badams_ios

Instructions are important to me

Currently way over my head with Model Shipworlds Niagara. It's hard seperating which rigging is for standing only and which is for sails/furled...etc. So I've shelved it and want another ship. I asked this question when I first started here and was told it was a stupid question. 3 years later I'll ask again.

 

Who makes the best kits? GOOD detailed instructions. I hear Victory makes great kits, but they only have a few to choose from and they're mostly for advanced builders.

 

What about Constructo?

 

I want a mid size ship, around 1:60th, needs to have at least a few cannons but must have GREAT documentation and plans.

Canute, CaptainSteve and medic like this

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It's not a stupid question, just one without a clear answer because there are so many variables.

 

Model Expo's instructions seem to vary in quality depending on how old the kit is; the good news is that all of their kits' instructions are posted on their website, so you can review the entire process before diving in. It's a very helpful way to judge if a kit (and its instructions) are suitable. For example, Sultana has a regular set of instructions and then a long, detailed practicum (I haven't built this kit, but I've consulted its practicum before for some good drawings of certain concepts that apply to other situations).

 

Personally, if something like Niagara is overwhelming you, maybe look for a simpler kit? A nice sloop with one mast where you can learn the basics of rigging and then apply them to a more complex situation? I've heard very good things about BlueJacket, though I haven't built one of their kits yet.

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Chuck Passaro's Syren (Model Shipways kit) has great plans and detailed instructions. Check out some of the builds here. Chuck is also a PM away for questions.

 

Russ

 

Plus he has a practicum also doesn't he?

 

Another recommendation would be Victory Models' Lady Nelson cutter. Only one mast's worth of rigging to deal with, but it's a mast with full shrouds and square yards and a gaff boom so it's representative of all the other masts you'll run into, excepting the not complicated differences between that and one with all square sails. That's about as easy as it gets, and in doing it you can understand all the ropes and standing rigging for that one mast in isolation. Then you can move to two masts and then three, now that you can see them as consisting of two or three units of that mast you now understand.

 

Also buy Rigging Period Ship Models and Masting and Rigging of English Ships of War 1625 - 1860, both of which come with lots and lots of clear diagrams and drawings and explanations of what everything does and why.

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I just bought the HM Bomb Vessel Granado 1:64 by Victory and the Lady's Cutter. I'll let you know what I think when they get here.

 

I didn't know you could check model shipways plans first. I see them under documentation now. Thanks!

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I built Constructo's Enterprise, and the instructions left lots to be desired, but I think they've updated the kit since then.I swear by Frank Mastini's "Ship Modeling Simplified," While not specific to one kit, it is a step-by-step guide that, with a good set of plans, can get you going on any beginner or internediate model. I gave the book and MS Bluenose to my father in law and he built a very nice ship, so that might be a kit to consider.

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I agree that instructions are important.  My current build didn't really offer a lot, 3 pages of written instructions and a few pictures.  This forum has helped me a lot.

 

 

For my next build I chose the Bluenose because I've heard that Model Shipways has very good instructions.  I've received the boat and sure enough, there is a 32 (or so) page manual plus 6 full size drawings.

 

But just to make sure I have all the information available I purchased a practicum from Bob Hunt at Lauck Street Shipyards.  He offers quite detailed build instructions including a disc with a few hundred reference photos.

 

I also purchased one of the books that Model Shipways used as reference when making their Bluenose plans.

 

I'm thinking I should be loaded now for reference material.

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Posted (edited)

Yes i agree instructions are of up most important for beginners / Rigging complicated models, i am quite lucky as my father was a boat builder for around 10 years building million dollar launches and yachts. he taught me how to interpret real plans, from the kits i have looked at even beginner models give the impression that you have many years woodworking experience and tend to skip important steps.

 

Ps never go billing boats the instructions are terrible 

Edited by REXY

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Hi.

Putting my 2 pence worth in...

I agree with the statement that INSTRUCTIONS are very important and there are a lot of new model ship suppliers trying real hard to do what's right.

Just to list a few.

http://www.marisstella.hr/marisstella_modeli.php

http://www.dusekshipkits.com/ship-kits?l=&velikost=---&vyrobce=1&poradi=

The good news is... Yes they are getting better. It's the old company that need to redo there instructions. A good way to do this is to have someone build it and document the methods.

Have seen lots of MSW members that make such a good job of there build log .. this is exactly what's wanted.

 

But the most impressive instructions are the Deagostini model space. It's a magazine subscription company.

http://www.model-space.com/gb/hms-victory-cross-section-full-kit.html

I learnt to rig my ships by looking at the real thing and working out what each rope does.

As suggested already.. Read up on a good book. And the Lady Nelson Cutter is a excellent kit with nice drawings.

 

Enough of me ranting on.

Regards Antony.

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Hi.

Putting my 2 pence worth in...

I agree with the statement that INSTRUCTIONS are very important and there are a lot of new model ship suppliers trying real hard to do what's right.

Just to list a few.

http://www.marisstella.hr/marisstella_modeli.php

 

 

The guy is complaining about not understanding instructions, so let's send him to a site in solid Croatian ;)  Those are some cool model offerings though, especially the galley/xebec with the built-up stern castle. If he offers English instructions there are some nice small ships there that could be good choices for the OP.

 

Actually speaking of that schooner I linked to above, what the heck kind of sail rig is that? I thought it was just a topsail schooner at first but the foremast is a semi-lateen mast, not a gaff, so it has left my limited knowledge of sailing rigs.

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Where would a person find a practicum for the HM Bomb Vessel Granado 1:64 by Victory? I don't want sails to hide the he** I'll go through rigging.

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I recently got the Cutter 'Mermaid" a kit from the Modeller's ship yard in Australia. Nice detailed plans and ticks off most of the things on your list.

 

Cheers,

 

Medic :D

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Where would a person find a practicum for the HM Bomb Vessel Granado 1:64 by Victory? I don't want sails to hide the he** I'll go through rigging.

 

Granado is a brig no less complex rigging wise than Niagara, so just a step sideways. If you insist on a brig, I suggest the Fair American as it has a practicum by the Lauck Street guy. I haven't bought anything from him but it seems his practicums are very thorough.

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Where would a person find a practicum for the HM Bomb Vessel Granado 1:64 by Victory? I don't want sails to hide the he** I'll go through rigging.

 

The only thing I know that's out there for Granado is the Anatomy of a Ship book.  It's basically just plans.

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Any thoughts on Model shipways Bluenose? Doesn't say if it''s intermediate or advanced, but doesn't look like it should be too bad.

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Hmm.. I just did a quick search... lots of Granado builds with the Caldercraft/Jotika kit... none on the Victory Models kit.   Strange...

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Victory does only a few ships.

 

Found Practicum's on both Model Ship Ways ships, bluenose and Baltimore. $120 each including a cd. I think it was the Baltimore that has some 30 pages dedicated to planking for that specific ship. Liking the Baltimore. 12 instruction booklets. I just asked what's on the cd specifically. Photo's of the ship, or instructions?

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Brian

 

Since I am currently rigging my Model Shipways Niagara, I felt compelled to put in my two cents worth. First off, your Niagara is wonderful and I hope that you get back to it. I can tell you that it does not take much in the way of rigging to bring out the magnificent beauty of the ship.

 

I have followed your build log very closely to guide me through the hull and deck construction. Your work is exquisite.

 

I have complained about the rigging instructions in my own log for the very reason you identified at the beginning of this post. Sheet 5 and 6 are indeed hard to follow since all of the sails are overlayed onto the rigging plans. But it caused me to do my homework. I had to learn how a ship works, and how and why a ship is rigged the way it is. Most of that was done on this forum. As a model ship builder thinking about doing future projects, it is an exercise worth the effort.

 

I decided that I had to make a plan.  I decided to do ALL of the standing rigging FIRST.   That is all of the shrouds and stays. I decided to start with my bowsprit and foremast , working from the bottom up on the foremast, and inside out on the bowsprit. Parcelling out the standing rigging from the integrated plans is a little easier than it first seems. If you start there, take your time, and like me, refer to the wonderfully descriptive build logs on this forum, I believe you will succeed, and the farther you go, the more skill and confidence you will gain. AND more importantly, your ship will begin to really look great. 

 

The running rigging was a bit more complicated. However, start with a plan. I broke the running rigging into two categories. The lines that attached to masts and yards (lifts, halliards, braces, slings) which I decided to do ALL of, and the lines that attach to sails (sheets, buntlines, clews, reefs). The plans are pretty good when it comes to the running rigging that attaches to the masts and yards.  It is there, albeit, buried underneath some of the sail diagrams. As far as the rigging that attaches to sails (when you decide to rig without sails), there is nothing, other than a reference in the instruction manual advising us to tie the ends off on the yards somewhere???

 

I have seen Niagara builds that totally omit the running rigging that attaches to sails. They look great. I decided to do some of this rigging, focusing on the clews and sheets.  i just tied them off on the yards.  I don't know it if is right, but it looks ok to me. And it adds another layer of running rigging that looks great on the ship.

 

 I am a true journeyman in this hobby, who makes all kinds of mistakes all of the time.  However, if you decide to embark on the rigging on your Niagara, and I truly hope you do, I would be more than happy to help you as best I can. I have tried to take good photos of my rigging experience, and label each of my posts to help future Niagara builders to find a particular part or exercise. 

 

And finally, let me say this.  Once you tackle the Niagara rigging plans, and get some experience, you will find ALL future plans, for whatever ship you work on next, to be a lot easier to follow.

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Any thoughts on Model shipways Bluenose? Doesn't say if it''s intermediate or advanced, but doesn't look like it should be too bad.

 

Bluenose or Bluenose II are traditional starting places, with relatively easy hulls to plank, little fancy deck furniture, and simple fore and aft sails with much less rigging than you get with square sails. So yes, that's a very good place to start.

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