Static - AL San Fransisco - First Model

Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 2:57 pm • Post subject:

Maybe card from a ceral box, a bit thicker than paper, but not by much, might make a difference to the hinges and give just a little bit of depth. and a small ring on the port lid would make a difference. Very Happy

Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:51 pm • Post subject:

Hi Bernie

Perhaps another alternative. If the hinges are to small to work with actual copper strapping, but thicker than can be achieved with paper alone. Perhaps try for a simpler approach.

Use the current paper for the straps . Then once the port is in its position (open, closed, in between) add a small short section of brass across where the hinge is. a little diluted glue to blend the wire into the paper, add glue spots for bolts, and paint all to match. The upside is its more in true to scale. The downside is it has to be built in situ, and the port-lid can not be repositioned after.

Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 6:31 pm • Post subject:

Hello Bernie,
I have sometimes used thin strips of the plasticised card to simulate metal bands etc. It is use as cover material on desk diaries etc and alsowhen you get things spiral or comb bound at Staples . I find it is just a little bit thicker than cartridge paper and cuts cleanly rather than compresses when using a #11 blade. furthermore it is black all the way through so no painting is neccesary. It does not seem to be adversely affected by CA, or acrylicpaint or water based stains.
have fun,
Kip

Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:04 pm • Post subject:

Thanks for all of your suggestions and feedback! Once again, the MSW team swings into action!!
It's hard to make objective decisions sometimes about something you're working on.
Garward is correct about the perceived flatness of the hinges, but Jan is correct in pointing out that contemporary hinges (albeit of another country's ship) aren't really very thick.
The paper I used is about 0.1mm thick and this is a 1/90 scale model, making them 9mm thick scale hinges... which must be in the ballpark. However, as most of you pointed out, pretty much nothing on this model is in scale, and most of us (especially at this scale) will choose appearance and practicality over accuracy.
Thanks for the pic of the Susan Constant, Jan. I think it's given me a clue as to the most significant problems with my hinges.
That pic of the Batavia is brilliant, BTW. What a lovely replica, and as far as contemporary goes, I think the Batavia is close to the San Francisco. As far as anyone can work out, the SF is meant to be a mid to early 17th century ship.
Fritz, adding a small piece of brass wire to simulate the actual hinge pivot is a good idea. Bending the brass around in a roll was just too difficult and not easily reproducable. Also, Caroline: Brilliant suggestion re: a ringbolt. I will try to make something to simulate this. I think the flatness and lack of detail of the hinges made the whole area of the portlids rather dull and lifeless.
Just noticed that Sawdust has commented too. Great suggestion. When stuck, it makes sense to think "outside the box", so an alternate like this is very useful.
I think I'll try to combine the various wisdoms offered.
Looking at Jan's pic of the Susan Constant, I realise that the clumsy parallel-sided strips of black paper are just not good enough. They need some shape.
Second, I think that Garward's original comment about flatness was about the pivoting part of the hinge, so I will try to use Fritz's suggestion of glueing a piece of brass wire there. I'll paint the hinges rather than use blackening.
I guess this means that I'll have to solve my problems with PE first...
Thanks again everyone for coming to my rescue.
cheers, Bernie

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 3:49 am • Post subject:

Hi Bernie,

How small did you say your hinges had to be ?

I knocked this one up in about 2 minutes - it's 0.58mm x 0.35mm brass strip, end is rolled to take a 0.5mm pin. It's 5mm long.
I would have preferred 1mm wide, but my shop was out of stock.

The "piece-de-resistance" - two 0.3mm holes drilled into it for nails made of the same size copper wire Laughing

Yeah - I'm just trying to be smart Laughing

..... but it IS possible.

The tools I used to bend the loop (and try to HOLD the bloody thing - it is TINY) are in the last pic - $30 from Dick Smith for the whole set, and seem like really good quality.

BTW, if you still want to go the "paper" way - have you tried Glossy "Photo Quality" Photocopy paper? Pretty easy to cut without shredding or tearing, as long as you use a SHARP blade.
A good read

, Danny

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:13 am • Post subject:

HA!

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:19 am • Post subject:

Actually Bernie, I DID snap a drill Embarassed

AND I dropped the thing about 6 times Laughing

Here's a tip - get some brass strip like I did, but get the size that suits your scale ..... costs about $1.50 for a 300mm length from the Model Railway shop. Save you trying to cut it out of sheet.

A good read

, Danny

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:27 am • Post subject:

That's a good tip about the Model Railway stores stocking useful brass stock. Thanks.
BTW, I bought a pack of 4 small sheets of brass each about 10cm square:
0.001", 0.002", 0.003" and 0.005" thick for $9.95 from a nearby model shop. I thought it was a bit steep.
On Friday, I found a hardware store selling an identical pack for $36.00!
I used some interesting words to point out he was overpriced!
cheers, Bernie

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:08 am • Post subject:

Yeah .... JUST A BIT overpriced Twisted Evil

The Model Railway guys have a LOT of different Profiles available - I actually bought a piece of 1mm brass TUBING as well - hole size is 0.48mm !

Try Googling "Walthers Catalog" for some of the bits available for Railways - lots of useful stuff there.

A good read

, Danny

Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:07 am • Post subject:

Hi, Bernie,
Once again about loops of gun ports: even on Batavia (an example resulted in the previous messages) these loops far not the flat:
http://www.forkedatfark.org/e107_plugins/coppermine_menu/displayimage.php?album=250&pos=28
Best regards,