Krabbenkutter by Heronguy - Billing Boats Nr 457&458 - Scale 1:30

[Heronguy]

The Krabbenkutter - a crab fishing boat - will be my 3rd build.  The other two are still in process but I want to reinforce what I’ve learned at each stage by repeating the steps and trying out alternatives.  

 

This model came to me as a old reclaimed closet kit.  It appears to be complete though the boxes were in a bit rough state.  Given that it is likely 20 or 30 years old, most of the thin sheet parts are simply printed on the boards - lots of careful sawing in the future to get the parts out.  A lot less fun that the laser-cut model I started with!

 

One attraction of this boat was the hull shape. The sleek shape of the Bluenose II (my 1st 2 builds in process) is in contrast the rounded stern and bulky hull of the Krabbenkutter.  Also the scale of 1:30 is quite a change from the 1:100 Bluenose I started with. Possibly easier fro my clumsy fingers.  

 

My intended theme in this build log is the choices I debate with myself.  I’ve done some reading, reviewed various build logs and done some of these things twice before.  What worked , what might work better, what new challenges and problems appear.

 

I expect progress on this build will be slow as it is competing for limited resources (me!) with  the others. So with some trepidation I start my 3rd kit and 3rd log.

 

Doug

 

[GrantGoodale]

Those old kits are starting to resurface these days. I am currently working on a resurrection of the Billings Danmark (3 of them!)

 

Best of luck

[Heronguy]

The kit:

 

 

 

 

The mahogany sheets - jeweller saw and x-acto knives at the ready!

 

 

10mm mahogany planks.  I think they’ll be a challenge shaping and bending.  I hope I’m wrong!

 

 

The instructions are minimal. This could be a problem. There's only one build log on this site for the boat and it is the newer version from Billing Boats - and not updated since 2013.  With some searching I was able to get the current instruction manual from the Billing Boats site.  Not much more in them but they may have some nuggets of help.

 

Doug

[Heronguy]

Those old kits are starting to resurface these days. I am currently working on a resurrection of the Billings Danmark (3 of them!)

 

Best of luck

Thanks.  And to you as well!

 

Doug

[Steve 12345]

Well done Doug jumping in at the deep end I'm sure there is method in the madness and it will pay off your fourth will be a buety good luck on this one and your others I think what your doing with the different builds is great and I will be following along

 

Steve.

[Heronguy]

Thanks Steve.  Seems to me we are following similar trajectories.  I'm following your lead with the HMS Bounty and the Mare Nostrum!  I'm enjoying your skill and progress.  

 

Doug

[Steve 12345]

Thank you Doug it is a pleasure to meet people on this forum with the same interest facing the same challenges and getting so much success from a great hobby

[Heronguy]

The bulkheads in place.  But there were a few problems.  (Does old plywood turn into concrete?  It was pretty had to shape.)

 

 

The deck sheet was my 1st effort at removing parts from the mahogany sheet. I got suggestions from reviewing the 

 

Shop Notes, Ship Modeling Tips, Techniques and Research forum

 

 

Fitting the deck plate showed up some of the problems - the bulkheads need quite a bit of shimming and shaving

 

 

 

 

 

[Steve 12345]

I did notice a different texture to ply wood bought from a builder supply compared to a hobby shop ply wood maybe the older stuff is building type material

[REXY]

Hey doug the first kit boat i built ( well just the hull) was the mary ann from billing boats. been procrastinating about finishing the painting of the hull which is the same hull as the krabbenkutter or new kit cux 87. the instructions are quite bad very little in the way of information. the frames and keel are easy but planking is the hard part my 1 suggestion is to plank down from the deck height tapering the boards fore and aft like the manual says but when the planks no longer want to follow the curve on the stern is use a stealer plank to shift the planking to a more manageable curve. anyway hers a pic of what the hull looks like.

 

 

Cheers Rexy.

Edited January 3, 2017 by REXY

[Heronguy]

First obvious mistake

 

I was pretty happy to cut out the deck plate. I mounted it on the bulkheads and eventually glued it done. I sat back to admire my efforts and then noticed:

 

 

I guess I should have made the cutouts before I mounted the deck! At least I got to learn how effective Isopropyl alcohol is at softening glue. A skill it turns out I needed all too soon afterwards!

Edited January 3, 2017 by Heronguy

[Heronguy]

Second mistake - worse that the first.

 

I've been reading about how fillers between bulkheads at the bow and stern are necessary to provide a good base for planking.  And there ware blocks that needed to be fitted in the stern - so I did that.  Then I tried to share them.  Another piece of old tough wood.  I wasn't making much progress.

 

 

 

After realizing that the blocks (even when shaped) would interfere with additional fairing of the bulkheads and puzzling over the plans for this and other similar boats I came to understand that these blocks were not support for planking over but rather the planks stop at the last bulkhead and these block are the stern (unplanked).  I took them out by dowsing them with Isopropyl alcohol and prying them out very, very carefully.  (I guess that was a save).  I'm still going to have to shape them later - but hey that's later not now.

 

The lessons learned from this episode:  

- the plans and part numbers often refer the order that parts are needed (I don't need part 36 - the stern blocks - when I'm still working on part 23 - the deck plate.

- think ahead - what has to happen and what will this step affect later.

- look at other build logs for ideas and clarifications that might apply in this case

 

Doug

 

[Heronguy]

Hey doug the first kit boat i built ( well just the hull) was the mary ann from billing boats. been procrastinating about finishing the painting of the hull which is the same hull as the krabbenkutter or new kit cux 87. the instructions are quite bad very little in the way of information. the frames and keel are easy but planking is the hard part my 1 suggestion is to plank down from the deck height tapering the boards fore and aft like the manual says but when the planks no longer want to follow the curve on the stern is use a stealer plank to shift the planking to a more manageable curve. anyway hers a pic of what the hull looks like.

 

IMG_20170103_144026219.jpg

 

Cheers Rexy.

Thanks Rexy.  This build log has now caught up with current progress.  I've been pondering the approach to a planking plan so you suggestion is very timely!

 

Your hull looks really good!

 

Doug

[Heronguy]

Although I have read various notes on lining the hull for planking and will use techniques described I am still nervous about placing a planking batten to create the planking belts. To gain some confidence I decided to "plank" the hull with a file folder.

 

Material req'd:

hull

double-sided tape (I used carpet tape)

a file folder

paper cutter

ruler

pencil

Method

Cut the file folder into strips the width of your planking stock (in my case 14 strips 10mm wide)

Put some tape over the midsection bulkheads and over at least a pair of bulkheads near the bow and stern.

Plank with the strips overlapping them at the bow and stern as required.

 

 

Unfortunately my file folder strips weren't long enough for my hull.  Off to the craft store to get some Bristol board for the next "planking"

 

This technique has given me a bit more insight into what will happen when I plank this hull.  I considered marking the "planks" where they overlap in order to create a template for shaping the strakes but I'm simply going to go back to the usual methods of placing a planking batten (say plank 7 of my strips) and then dividing the space at each bulkhead using the planking fan.

 

I don't know if I'll use this method in the future but it gave me some confidence this time around.  Any thoughts about this?

 

Doug

 

 

 

 

 

[Heronguy]

Welcome aboard Joshua.  I expect this will be my slow one.  It appears neither the boat nor I were built for speed!

 

Doug

[Heronguy]

Krabby (my new name for the boat) and I have been negotiating the planking plan.  The planking batten was placed and the 1st couple of strakes have been mounted.

 

 

I think the benefit of having multiple builds in progress is now clear to me: while Krabby's planks are setting, I can paint the pinrails on the little Bluenose II  and cut out the bulkwarks on the bigger Bluenose II.  Hmmm, maybe its time to start another build.

 

 Doug

Edited January 10, 2017 by Heronguy

[Heronguy]

Krabby is starting to look like a boat.  1st planking belt finished.  On to the next.

 

 

[Heronguy]

Today was a day for finding some the problems but few of the solutions for this build.  One could reasonably say that Krabby is making me a bit crabby today.

 

The current problem I'm trying deal with is preparing the rudder mount (the part is shown here)

 

The plan shows the rudder post as:

 

My dilemma is how to drill this given the geometry of the false keel.  I can't get a straight line with a drill (and I don't have a right angle adapter - do I need yet another tool???)

 

I suppose I could simply cut off 1/2 of the rudder post and drill a slightly skewed hole for it and glue it in.  The boat was capable of being set up for RC control but I have no intention of doing that.  But suppose I did want to - then how would I drill the hole.  I suppose I could come in from the deck but that would leave a hole in the deck that isn't covered by any deck fittings.  

 

I suppose the instructions might have pointed out that the hole could have been drilled very early in the build - but we're talking about BB instructions.

 

Any guidance would be appreciated! 

 

Doug

 

 

[skifflake]

Hi Doug:  I'm still watching. You will figure it out. The more you build the more lessons you will learn. I went through all of this and one day I started a new build and everything I had learned in the past all came together and I ended up with a beautiful boat. When I look at it oday I'm still amazed I actual built it. You will see so keep going. Pat at Skiff Lake NB 

[Heronguy]

Hi Pat,

 

I'm not too worried - I was just fishing for alternatives.  

 

I'm still hopeful I'll get good at this modelling stuff.  I'd be really happy to have an experience like you just described!  In the meantime I'm enjoying the journey (even if I do get a bit frustrated with it occasionally).

 

Doug

[popeye the sailor]

hello doug........sorry I'm late.   man!........do you have an old kit or what?!?!?!   don't feel bad........my very first build was a 40 year old Nordkap.  it had been in an attic for 30 of them.  I remember cutting out every part.......what I goofed up on,  I made scratch.  I've built the Cux 87 as well....although it was a later production........there's really not much difference,  other than the fact that it was laser cut.   here is the build log for it and the Nordkap as well:

 

http://www.blogger.com/profile/17452257054561544627

 

I didn't use the R/C parts....I did it as a static model.   your planking looks pretty good so far.   how are you going to plank the stern?   the logs will show how I did mine.......it looked like crap too.   but,  with a bit of work,   it will come out fine {you may need to soak some planking and bend to shape}.   I've built a few Billing's kits...I've actually become accustomed to the instructions {if that's possible}.   they are vague......even for an advanced beginner's kit.   I've also built the Mary Ann,  which is a copy of the same hull.......there are a couple more kits like this too.   I've even replicated a couple of hulls from the parts panels and built them as I saw fit.......the M&M fun Ship is in the scratch build gallery.  an elongated version of this hull  is my trawler Syborn......I have a log on her in the scratch build forum.   this is a super model to build.....I will enjoy following along

[Heronguy]

Hello popeye,

 

Thanks for the encouragement and the pointed to build logs.

 

One of my early goofs was the bulwarks at the rear.  When I discovered my slip-up with the stern filler blocks I thought I did't need to take any strakes around so cut the top two planks.  I've been thinking of a fix - I'll try to scarf the stern plans onto the existing planks.  That way both can have a good connection to the last bulkhead.  The stern piece will of course have to be bent into a circle but my limited experience with plank bending has been relatively successful so far.  

 

I'll read you logs and reconsider if necessary.

 

You have lots of experience with Billing Boats.  Any reason in particular that you selected them - they had the ships you were attracted to?

 

I'll look forward to your advice.

 

Doug

[popeye the sailor]

I imagine your using the original planking?   seeing how far you've gone down the hull,  it will be hard to fit in the planking.  the logs may give you an idea,  but the best thing would be to soak the planking in hot water for a short period of time,  and then bend them around a drinking glass or a bottle,  whatever will give you the curvature you'll need.   did you cut the planking flush with the last bulkhead?   if you did,  then you can create some rabbits,  to the shape of the bulkhead.   this will give you a sill to pin the plank to as it dries  {glue}.  there are rabbits for the stern stem {or there should be...you'll see then in the log}.      the planking terminates at the stern stem,  cemented to the rabbits.  it won't be pretty.......filler and sanding will be your friends,  to arrive at the contour you need.

 

when I got the Nordkap,  I went off looking for the fitting for it  {did you get the fittings with yours?}   it's a long story,  but I got to know the fellow who owned Billing USA.   a couple of years ago,  he sold it to Ages of sail in California.  a very sad day indeed!  that's how I got the Cux........he sent it to me to build for him.   I personally like the kits......I use the instructions merely as a reference.   they assemble fairly well and the fit of the parts isn't to bad.  laser cutting was a big step for them.......made their kits a lot better to work with.  I like fishing vessels,  but I also want to get into the sailing vessels as well {I have a couple in my que}.

[Heronguy]

Popeye,

 

I am using the original wood from the kit.  I knew when I saw the kit offered that it wouldn't be laser cut or even punched out but I thought if I do one kit like this I'll appreciate the newer kits even more!

 

One difference with my kit and the current Cux version (I downloaded BB instructions for reference) is in the handling of the stern.  The bulkheads stop at #0.  Below deck level the stern is to be formed by shaping a wooden block on each side of the stern post. are no planks that wrap around the stern below deck level.   The top 2 planks (above deck) were supposed to meet at the stern post (my slip up).

 

I'm Currently expecting to cut the stern blocks in slices and laminate them together (this decision came after I had tried to carve the blocks that were supplied with the kit - they were like little bits of concrete - slight exaggeration)

 

I was expecting to make the top 2 stern planks a single piece from the port bulkhead around the stern post to the starboard bulkhead.  Since it is above deck and visible I'll try to share the last bulkhead between the above deck hull planks and the stern planks by 

 

 

 

[popeye the sailor]

if you have the later production instructions......you can see what the stern rabbits look like.  I still think you'd fair better scratch making these parts.  

      gemmaJF  has a good point.   you'll develop the knowledge,  but it does take time.   these  kits make you think.......how to be creative.   as you encounter obstacles,   you'll find that there are other ways to solve them.

 

interested to see how your idea works    

[Heronguy]

Thanks both of you. I'm discovering lots of things I'll benefit from going forward. Learning a bit about the tools and the material, I'm gaining new respect for wood - previously I mostly burn the stuff to keep warm or fight with 2x4's to try to get some little building hammered together. Also learning about glue - when it holds and when it doesn't and how much of mess it it makes if you use too much! Files and sandpaper solve a bunch of problems. I'm pretty sure that wood filler will be playing a bigger part in my life too!

 

All in all I'm having fun.

 

Doug

[popeye the sailor]

that's the best part of the hobby.   experiment to see what will work for you.    

[Worldway]

Doug,

 

If my count is correct you have three builds on the go.

 

How do you keep track?

[Heronguy]

It's my escape valve Derek!  When little Bluenose rigging has me baffled I can go back to trying to put the bulwarks on big Bluenose.  When that glue doesn't hold because I can't clamp it properly I head back to Krabby to add another strake to the hull or cut out another piece from the parts sheet.

 

Round and round between the builds - seems like it progress is really slow compared with yours on the Mare!

 

Now I've got 2-1/2 kits on the shelf - I'm tempted to crack them open so I'll be back at the "easy" (i.e. familiar) parts of the process.  But if you saw my work area you'd understand why that would be really foolhardy.  I'll finish one of these before I start another (I keep telling myself that!)

 

Are you looking forward to starting your Bluenose???

 

Doug

[Steve 12345]

Hi doug ive missed out on a good part of this log what excellent progress very impressed lovely start to the planking I must learn to hit the follow button in future

 

steve