shihawk

As i mentioned in my last post i wasn,t happy with the gunport linings ,have now come up with a combination i find more suitable . I first lined the port with same wood used to create the stripes 0.5x5mm  which gave a good clean hole which i then lined with the same wood as i used for the wales 1x3mm . I remember reading somewhere that when going for a non paint finish it,s best to stick to only  2 or 3 different wood types and think i now see the reasoning for this ,rather than trying to paint with wood ,certain shades and types seem to work together  ,of course this is in my eyes others will have different preferences


When seen together ,new on top old on bottom ,i,m sure you will agree ,any opinions welcome .Just a pitty i lined so many before i decided they were wrong!!! As im sure you realise by now i change my mind more often than i change my soaks 

As you will know from my previous post i made a bit of a horlics of my gunport openings and this was one part of the build i had been determined to do properly as i have seen a lot of pics of finished models spoiled because the gunports were all over the place . (Im setting myself up for a fall here) .Because i stupidly decided to roughly cut out my openings before fitting the wales, and then changed the position of the wales i finished up with high and low ports plus ones that were to big when properly squared . At one stage i considered ripping  out the strips between the wales and cutting all the ports again ,but thought before going to this extreme i would try to fix them and if i couldn,t i could still resort to this drastic and time consuming solution .I then concluded that i probably won,t be the first or last to make this mistake and so decided to show how i think i solved the problem ,as usual all views are welcome and any suggestions willingly accepted 

This is what i started out with having removed  0.5mm strips of stained cherry which i experimented with first, as you can see the timber surrounding the ports is 0.5 ,brittle and doesn,t have a shap edge ,chipped very easily when filling. I used it because when varnished it seems to turn yellowish and i had it in stock ,in hindsight i probably should have used Lime or similiar    . This time i carefully squared the holes especialy width wise as i can correct the height later on 

 
I then cut strip of the same wood to line the holes . Started at the bottom and depending on the hole it took 1,2 or 3 strips to finish 1mm above the level of the wale  ,i then measured up from this 13mm to give me the top of the hole ,again depending on the hole sometimes i had to file more of and sometimes i had to add a 0.5 strip if the hole was to big  Didn,t always add a strip at top cause i could get a straight edge filled with the run of the plank 
 

 
this shows the angles on the strips , by cutting them to big but at an angle it meant i could get a good tight fit easily an by leaving 1mm or so proud of the hull means that when carefully trimed of i finish with a reasonably straight edge flush with the hull This would also mean that anyone painting the inside of the ports could prepaint the strips and still have a clean unpainted edge to match the hull
 

 
This paticular port was far to wide and needed 2 strips up one side ,i would have used 1mm strip but only have 0.5 
 

 
I then lined the port properly with the same wood as the wales 1mm which has a good sharpe clean edge  These strips were cut with a small angle also and some fitted so tight that i only glued the top and bottom ones 
 

 
I then carefully trimed of the linings flush with the hull and gave a run of fine sandpaper 
 

 
And heres the finished gunport ,still might need a little sanding here and there . Maybe this will be of some use to some one sometime and if not i may need reminding myself the next time i start lining ports . Will show all when finished and you can tell me then that there still all over the place??? Have Fun 
 

Looking great David ,can,t imagine when ill ever reach that stage 

Finally got port linings finished on one side ,very tricky but after my previous statement i decided to give it my best effort .Im happy but not really looking forward to the other side although im waiting on more wood before i start so might make a few gun carriages for a change .
 

 
Would love to try a coat of varnish on the finished side to see how the colors come up and for protection but have read so much about glue not sticking on varnish im afraid to as i still have plenty to glue on the upper hull , i think i better hold of a while longer!!!, plus i discovered an odd springy plank and a few minor repairs needed on upper bow planking 
I redid my gun carriage to get it sitting at a better level and think the mark 2 will probably surfice 
 

 
Was tempted to order chucks carriages but thought i,d give a go myself and now that i have a design im happy with ill make up a few jigs for mass production , i think i need 20 odd thankfully much less than the cc kit 
 

 

 
the rings and cannon etc will be blackened but not sure how yet ,i bought a kit for this but  can,t find it . will try it out when i do   . might change the rings as i think they look slightly big ?? these are bought ones and i can make up smaller if i need to , any opinions welcomed !! when wood arrives i will try darker wheels although the pine ones don,t look to bad .
 

Greetings all
Well things have really slowed down now. I have finished all the work I intend to do on the deck apart from a bit of repair work on the buckets , and a broken handrail on one of the stairways . All the ratlines need a lot of attention which will take a while. I am now starting to work my way around the hull from the starboard bow and have repaired all the gunport lids as far as the ships entrance. I have just finished adding the first anchor and next the second anchor and onward to the stern. Thanks for viewing and all your comments. Here's a few photos .DAVID

Hello Boyd
It's awesome !! A brilliant build. You are building something special for yourself. Just keep posting lots of photos for us all to enjoy Boyd. DAVID

As you will know from my previous post i made a bit of a horlics of my gunport openings and this was one part of the build i had been determined to do properly as i have seen a lot of pics of finished models spoiled because the gunports were all over the place . (Im setting myself up for a fall here) .Because i stupidly decided to roughly cut out my openings before fitting the wales, and then changed the position of the wales i finished up with high and low ports plus ones that were to big when properly squared . At one stage i considered ripping  out the strips between the wales and cutting all the ports again ,but thought before going to this extreme i would try to fix them and if i couldn,t i could still resort to this drastic and time consuming solution .I then concluded that i probably won,t be the first or last to make this mistake and so decided to show how i think i solved the problem ,as usual all views are welcome and any suggestions willingly accepted 

This is what i started out with having removed  0.5mm strips of stained cherry which i experimented with first, as you can see the timber surrounding the ports is 0.5 ,brittle and doesn,t have a shap edge ,chipped very easily when filling. I used it because when varnished it seems to turn yellowish and i had it in stock ,in hindsight i probably should have used Lime or similiar    . This time i carefully squared the holes especialy width wise as i can correct the height later on 

 
I then cut strip of the same wood to line the holes . Started at the bottom and depending on the hole it took 1,2 or 3 strips to finish 1mm above the level of the wale  ,i then measured up from this 13mm to give me the top of the hole ,again depending on the hole sometimes i had to file more of and sometimes i had to add a 0.5 strip if the hole was to big  Didn,t always add a strip at top cause i could get a straight edge filled with the run of the plank 
 

 
this shows the angles on the strips , by cutting them to big but at an angle it meant i could get a good tight fit easily an by leaving 1mm or so proud of the hull means that when carefully trimed of i finish with a reasonably straight edge flush with the hull This would also mean that anyone painting the inside of the ports could prepaint the strips and still have a clean unpainted edge to match the hull
 

 
This paticular port was far to wide and needed 2 strips up one side ,i would have used 1mm strip but only have 0.5 
 

 
I then lined the port properly with the same wood as the wales 1mm which has a good sharpe clean edge  These strips were cut with a small angle also and some fitted so tight that i only glued the top and bottom ones 
 

 
I then carefully trimed of the linings flush with the hull and gave a run of fine sandpaper 
 

 
And heres the finished gunport ,still might need a little sanding here and there . Maybe this will be of some use to some one sometime and if not i may need reminding myself the next time i start lining ports . Will show all when finished and you can tell me then that there still all over the place??? Have Fun 
 

As you will know from my previous post i made a bit of a horlics of my gunport openings and this was one part of the build i had been determined to do properly as i have seen a lot of pics of finished models spoiled because the gunports were all over the place . (Im setting myself up for a fall here) .Because i stupidly decided to roughly cut out my openings before fitting the wales, and then changed the position of the wales i finished up with high and low ports plus ones that were to big when properly squared . At one stage i considered ripping  out the strips between the wales and cutting all the ports again ,but thought before going to this extreme i would try to fix them and if i couldn,t i could still resort to this drastic and time consuming solution .I then concluded that i probably won,t be the first or last to make this mistake and so decided to show how i think i solved the problem ,as usual all views are welcome and any suggestions willingly accepted 

This is what i started out with having removed  0.5mm strips of stained cherry which i experimented with first, as you can see the timber surrounding the ports is 0.5 ,brittle and doesn,t have a shap edge ,chipped very easily when filling. I used it because when varnished it seems to turn yellowish and i had it in stock ,in hindsight i probably should have used Lime or similiar    . This time i carefully squared the holes especialy width wise as i can correct the height later on 

 
I then cut strip of the same wood to line the holes . Started at the bottom and depending on the hole it took 1,2 or 3 strips to finish 1mm above the level of the wale  ,i then measured up from this 13mm to give me the top of the hole ,again depending on the hole sometimes i had to file more of and sometimes i had to add a 0.5 strip if the hole was to big  Didn,t always add a strip at top cause i could get a straight edge filled with the run of the plank 
 

 
this shows the angles on the strips , by cutting them to big but at an angle it meant i could get a good tight fit easily an by leaving 1mm or so proud of the hull means that when carefully trimed of i finish with a reasonably straight edge flush with the hull This would also mean that anyone painting the inside of the ports could prepaint the strips and still have a clean unpainted edge to match the hull
 

 
This paticular port was far to wide and needed 2 strips up one side ,i would have used 1mm strip but only have 0.5 
 

 
I then lined the port properly with the same wood as the wales 1mm which has a good sharpe clean edge  These strips were cut with a small angle also and some fitted so tight that i only glued the top and bottom ones 
 

 
I then carefully trimed of the linings flush with the hull and gave a run of fine sandpaper 
 

 
And heres the finished gunport ,still might need a little sanding here and there . Maybe this will be of some use to some one sometime and if not i may need reminding myself the next time i start lining ports . Will show all when finished and you can tell me then that there still all over the place??? Have Fun 
 

As you will know from my previous post i made a bit of a horlics of my gunport openings and this was one part of the build i had been determined to do properly as i have seen a lot of pics of finished models spoiled because the gunports were all over the place . (Im setting myself up for a fall here) .Because i stupidly decided to roughly cut out my openings before fitting the wales, and then changed the position of the wales i finished up with high and low ports plus ones that were to big when properly squared . At one stage i considered ripping  out the strips between the wales and cutting all the ports again ,but thought before going to this extreme i would try to fix them and if i couldn,t i could still resort to this drastic and time consuming solution .I then concluded that i probably won,t be the first or last to make this mistake and so decided to show how i think i solved the problem ,as usual all views are welcome and any suggestions willingly accepted 

This is what i started out with having removed  0.5mm strips of stained cherry which i experimented with first, as you can see the timber surrounding the ports is 0.5 ,brittle and doesn,t have a shap edge ,chipped very easily when filling. I used it because when varnished it seems to turn yellowish and i had it in stock ,in hindsight i probably should have used Lime or similiar    . This time i carefully squared the holes especialy width wise as i can correct the height later on 

 
I then cut strip of the same wood to line the holes . Started at the bottom and depending on the hole it took 1,2 or 3 strips to finish 1mm above the level of the wale  ,i then measured up from this 13mm to give me the top of the hole ,again depending on the hole sometimes i had to file more of and sometimes i had to add a 0.5 strip if the hole was to big  Didn,t always add a strip at top cause i could get a straight edge filled with the run of the plank 
 

 
this shows the angles on the strips , by cutting them to big but at an angle it meant i could get a good tight fit easily an by leaving 1mm or so proud of the hull means that when carefully trimed of i finish with a reasonably straight edge flush with the hull This would also mean that anyone painting the inside of the ports could prepaint the strips and still have a clean unpainted edge to match the hull
 

 
This paticular port was far to wide and needed 2 strips up one side ,i would have used 1mm strip but only have 0.5 
 

 
I then lined the port properly with the same wood as the wales 1mm which has a good sharpe clean edge  These strips were cut with a small angle also and some fitted so tight that i only glued the top and bottom ones 
 

 
I then carefully trimed of the linings flush with the hull and gave a run of fine sandpaper 
 

 
And heres the finished gunport ,still might need a little sanding here and there . Maybe this will be of some use to some one sometime and if not i may need reminding myself the next time i start lining ports . Will show all when finished and you can tell me then that there still all over the place??? Have Fun 
 

As i mentioned in my last post i wasn,t happy with the gunport linings ,have now come up with a combination i find more suitable . I first lined the port with same wood used to create the stripes 0.5x5mm  which gave a good clean hole which i then lined with the same wood as i used for the wales 1x3mm . I remember reading somewhere that when going for a non paint finish it,s best to stick to only  2 or 3 different wood types and think i now see the reasoning for this ,rather than trying to paint with wood ,certain shades and types seem to work together  ,of course this is in my eyes others will have different preferences


When seen together ,new on top old on bottom ,i,m sure you will agree ,any opinions welcome .Just a pitty i lined so many before i decided they were wrong!!! As im sure you realise by now i change my mind more often than i change my soaks 

few pics of my atempt at Victory stripes and before anyone points it out i know the wales are not exactly where they should but it was the only way in my limited experience i could figure out how to do it without paint . Im happy with the overall result except for the gunports ,in hindsight i should not have tried finishing them before fitting the wales as quite a few now need realinement and i don,t want them to look patched up  
                   
i rubed a small sectionwith damp cloth to show nearer color when varnished  
   
 Not happy with lining for gunports  ,they aren,t definite enough so may change to a different better edged wood , more experimenting necessary  

 
 I think i asumed that it needed to be a redish wood but may now consider a different color as the rest of the build isn,t the proper colors anyway ,In a way its very liberating not to have to follow a set of strict plans or color schemes!!!                                               

I found soaking overnite and then slowly bending and drying over a hot fan heater ,has the advantage of finishing with a dry plank ready for fitting  ,also use a plank bender for final adjustments . problem is different woods sometimes require more work than others  eg i second planked with 0.5 cherry and needed no soaking or plank bender but the 1m Didetou wood in the wales required a lot of soaking before fitting . You just need to experiment and find the method that suits you    . Your getting on well and now we have the experience of Keith to fall back on !!! so remember if in doubt ask ?????              
            Boyd

Thank you. For this build I am sticking to the instructions, no mitring strangely enough...

As for tarring or tallowed...really? It is a model after all. Sorry I just feel that there is a limit when it comes to accuracy...the way some of you guys talk you may as well just build the real thing

Great log Michael ,will be following with interest

As i mentioned in my last post i wasn,t happy with the gunport linings ,have now come up with a combination i find more suitable . I first lined the port with same wood used to create the stripes 0.5x5mm  which gave a good clean hole which i then lined with the same wood as i used for the wales 1x3mm . I remember reading somewhere that when going for a non paint finish it,s best to stick to only  2 or 3 different wood types and think i now see the reasoning for this ,rather than trying to paint with wood ,certain shades and types seem to work together  ,of course this is in my eyes others will have different preferences


When seen together ,new on top old on bottom ,i,m sure you will agree ,any opinions welcome .Just a pitty i lined so many before i decided they were wrong!!! As im sure you realise by now i change my mind more often than i change my soaks 

As i mentioned in my last post i wasn,t happy with the gunport linings ,have now come up with a combination i find more suitable . I first lined the port with same wood used to create the stripes 0.5x5mm  which gave a good clean hole which i then lined with the same wood as i used for the wales 1x3mm . I remember reading somewhere that when going for a non paint finish it,s best to stick to only  2 or 3 different wood types and think i now see the reasoning for this ,rather than trying to paint with wood ,certain shades and types seem to work together  ,of course this is in my eyes others will have different preferences


When seen together ,new on top old on bottom ,i,m sure you will agree ,any opinions welcome .Just a pitty i lined so many before i decided they were wrong!!! As im sure you realise by now i change my mind more often than i change my soaks 

Keith  will you be double planking??? ,this is advertised as a double planked hull but in fact it,s only from the wale line up if you count the gunport strips as a bottom planking . Im only thinking if your filling and sanding the pins could be a problem . i think thats four billings Victory logs going now so hope you won,t mind a few questions now and again ????                           Boyd 

Someone asked what building HMS Victory was like and I replied with "It is a series of highly repetitive building tasks; just as you get the hang of a task in hand it's completed and its time to move on to the next repetitive task."                                                                                                                                                                                                           I am still at the planking stage and was just thinking to-day i must keep a record of usefull hints and tips cause it will probably be a couple of years before im planking again and ill have forgotten all im learning by then, same applies to rigging etc it can be years between builds and you keep saying i must remember that method for the next time,but never do . Maybe im just getting old .                                                                                                                                                                                                    your build is looking great Glenn and as David said with the number of Victory builds going on someone should come up with a system of building large and cheap display cases  Have Fun 

"A-trennelling we will go ... a-trennelling we will go. 
Trennelling ... trennelling ... trennelling ... trennelling ...
Life is but a dream !!"
 
CaptainSteve's already tenuous grasp upon sanity hath been sorely tested these past two weeks. For he hath been occupying every erstwhile free moment in cutting many a toothpick into even smaller pieces ...
 

 
Thence he didst taketh up his drill and madeth verily great numbers of tiny, tiny holes in which to place these pieces ...
 

 
And, thencewise, whereupon that was doneth, he didst commenceth the whole process over again ... and again ... and again. All the while singing the refrain at the top untoest his self.
 


 
But, just when it didst seemeth darkest, just when it wouldst appeareth that our hero's grasp on reality musteth surely fail, he was able to discovereth his Inner Porcupine !!
 

 
Whereupon, finally seeing light at the end of the trennel tunnel, he didst taketh up the Fearsome Clippers of Toe-Nail Destruction to trim that Porcupine ...
 




 
 
"They be subtle," our Hero didst sayeth. "But the detail be there ... and it be good, methinks !!"
 
At this stage, it twouldst be pertinent to point out that nobody has informed CaptainSteve just yet that the outer hull couldst beeth in need of a good trennelling, as well.
For the sake of our Hero's sanity, let's just keep that matter betwixt our own selves, for the time being !!!

It,s a good idea Adam and i  will be glad to join in ,but im sure you have read plenty of build logs and realise that one mans food is anothers mans poision .Everyone has different expectations from a kit , some prefere great instructions ,some demand accuracy, others want first grade timber .I resently read a topic on the perfect kit and why manufactures couldn,t or wouldn,t produce it and i believe the conclusion was that apart from cost you simply cant please every one . possibly a poll of who supplies the best timber and who provides the best beginners instructions or the most authentic build rather than a general opinion could be more usefull for the individual needs .    Only my thoughts in my limited exoerience  and will support what ever you go with ,all help is usefull when deciding on next build .      
          Boyd

As you quite rightly state it's your own build and if it pleases you then that's all that really matters. But you also have to ask yourself the question what made you choose that way of second planking the hull after taking such care to get the first layer so smooth and clean? the base was there to get the second planking spot on! a little more research and taking the time to read the available FREE literature about planking would have set you on the course to get the planking looking realistic AND aesthetically pleasing.
There are one or two snobs and rivet counters on this site and they tend to forget or ignore that they were once novices themselves, however I see that you post on Modelspace as well and I think that is where you may have been lulled into a sense of achievement? quick one line messages praising your build doesn't offer advice it just inflates your own and massages the posters egos. Look around at the posters own builds and say to yourself is THAT what I want to build or do I want to take my time and do it right, it doesn'y take any longer to do something right than it does to do it wrong!!
Where the build is at the moment it wont take very long at all to sand of the veneer and start again and invest in a proper guide or take advantage of the free one on this site, and remember because someone posts a lot it doesn't mean they are a good modeller, it just means they post a lot!!
There are other sites on the net with plenty of capable builders, all examples can be learned from. You don't have to join most sites to be able to read and look at photos of build examples.
I'll stop my rant there before it goes on too long.
Regards, Nat.

Thats the spirit .We all have off days !!!!!

Hi Dominic ,i could say all the usual ,Its your build and we are our own worst critics etc etc ,all of which are true ,and as i only have 3 years building  i do see your point about advice from more experienced builders ,but thats all it is ,advice !! In the end do it your way what makes you happy and if you ain,t happy i always think ,well i,ll remember and do it different in my next build . Personaly i think your planking looks great (im not being patronising ) if you google ,as i  have numerous pictures of builds many show different ways of planking ,very few are historicaly correct and many are amazing  . Im attempting a Victory build without paint and will have to change the position of the wales in order to simulate the stripes dispite   ADVICE  that this may not be correct , but if it looks right ,and time will tell,  im happy. Now for my advice !!  As regards the spaces in your planking ,it could be bad timber , it could be soaked timber drying out and shrinking ,but there are solutions ,if it were mine i certainly would not take it off ,my opinion,!! We all get frustrated when you see imaculate builds but remember these were probably built with top quality timber and fancy percision tools ,not blades and cheap files as in my case . Perfection in our own eyes is impossible ,striving for it takes a life time     Gee i talk some s--t  , hang in there i see you started your Bounty Jolly   don,t stop   Have Fun!!!

Thanks for all the comments guys.
 
I must come across as a right stroppy diva! Really not the case. I think I may have over-reacted slightly for the reason that when you have done something you are really happy with and someone comes along and dismantles it with just a few words...it's kind of like a smack in the chops
 
Yes I know it's not the accepted method of planking. On a real ship that bow would have simply exploded outwards but I was concentrating, perhaps in hindsight too much, on surface quality. My camera doesn't help either. It's too good at highlighting things, in this case the rather, I believe the word used was unorthodox, Aztec planking, which isn't that visible with the naked eye. I was also playing the long game, as once sanded and varnished and then had all the ribbing added on, would barely be visible anyway.
 
I do think perhaps I had become complacent...as each new build I think, should I do it the right way this time...and I always convince myself no, get a bit more practice in first...my intention now with starting the Bounty Launch is that will require at least a few corrective planks, that will be my test bed.

It,s a good idea Adam and i  will be glad to join in ,but im sure you have read plenty of build logs and realise that one mans food is anothers mans poision .Everyone has different expectations from a kit , some prefere great instructions ,some demand accuracy, others want first grade timber .I resently read a topic on the perfect kit and why manufactures couldn,t or wouldn,t produce it and i believe the conclusion was that apart from cost you simply cant please every one . possibly a poll of who supplies the best timber and who provides the best beginners instructions or the most authentic build rather than a general opinion could be more usefull for the individual needs .    Only my thoughts in my limited exoerience  and will support what ever you go with ,all help is usefull when deciding on next build .      
          Boyd