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La Créole 1827 by archjofo - Scale 1/48 - French corvette


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Posted (edited)

@Jorge Diaz O

@Hubac's Historian

@Gahm

@md1400cs

@Roger Pellett

@albert

Hello,

there still seems to be interest in my construction report. Thank you for your nice comments and also for the many LIKES.
I am very happy about that and it gives me further motivation for the next sections.
I would like to express my sincere thanks for this. 

 

But let's continue here.
I was able to finish the double blocks for the breast backstays in the meantime.

DSC00012.thumb.jpg.94e85bf32294f636d27ffecfa9b3ce11.jpg

 

DSC00017.thumb.jpg.41fe8422ec715d16b04ca39f977307c0.jpg

 

DSC00020.thumb.jpg.10b75eb52272cc1f3959396e1e4ca897.jpg

 

And here is an overview of the back stays of the La Créole:

Backstays_LaCreole.thumb.jpg.0cda0db789b9b24b01dd5a08034679d1.jpg

 

The Shifting Backstays are already in preparation.
More about that soon.

Edited by archjofo
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  • 1 month later...

@mbp521

Hi Brian,

thank you for your nice comment and thank you to all the others for the many LIKES.

 

Here is the continuation of my report:

I imitated the leather lining of the caps accordingly.I use real leather with a thickness of approximately 0.25 mm. I split the thinnest leather I could buy with my own device.

DSC00046.thumb.jpg.5b62a99e3980979c736b0e24d3397fe0.jpg

 

DSC00013.thumb.jpg.d3b64e04a9ac821db003c98ae38d14e6.jpg

 

DSC00039.thumb.jpg.8a286291e82837600ce6eaa040376503.jpg

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

@GrandpaPhil

@Gahm

@allanyed

Many thanks for the nice comments und all the others for the LIKES.

 

Fore topmast stay - Étai petit mât de hune 
According to my announcement in the last post, I am dealing with the topmast stays. So I prepared the assembly for the fore topmast stay. According to my original assumption that a left-hand rope was used here, this is obviously not the case according to my current research. The stay had a diameter of 41 mm in the original, which corresponds to 0.85 mm in model scale.
The fore topmast stay is attached in the same way as the main stay. This requires an open eye. The two legs are spliced into the stay. Finally, the ends receive spliced-in eyes, which then receive a lashing, as can be seen in the following picture. For comparison, I have laid a rope next to it that corresponds to the mainstay.

DSC00127.thumb.JPG.f1ba9cbe0fffc8d0d9d844ba93e5bdca.JPG
          

The fore topmast stay was routed on the starboard side of the bowsprit top via stay sheave to the bow for fastening by means of thimble and eyebolt. The area of the stay that was led around the sheave was served.  
     
Fockstengestag.thumb.JPG.38392ae5b6ff6dca41c4e754a5347940.JPG

Source: Atlas du Génie Maritime

 

Fockstengestag_LaCreole_PariserModell_Musee_de_la_marine.jpg.7be741279a7242b48fd9032e8336b0a3.jpg 
Source: Original model in the Musée de la Marine Paris

 

The lashings for the fore topmast stay have to be applied directly to the model, as it is then no longer possible to pass the rope through the sheave cleat.

DSC00133.thumb.jpg.23380afbb640efd044b60e4171e7015b.jpg


 


The next picture shows the eyebolt with thimble of the stay attachment on the forecastle.
DSC00135.thumb.jpg.388cc5630468cc181bac345bf37bd322.jpg 
Here you can see the guidance of the stage over the side sheaves with the served areas.

DSC00137.thumb.jpg.d34ad4ccd3808ff302c89c638b0e4ee2.jpg
  
The last picture shows the fore topmast stay on the topmast crosstrees.

DSC00138.thumb.jpg.8c057a760ddb02d6d3d377f804d949af.jpg
     
To be continued ... 


 

 

Edited by archjofo
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13 hours ago, archjofo said:

@AbueloPhil

@Gahm

@allanyed

Muchas gracias por los lindos comentarios y todos los demás por los LIKES.

 

Estancia de mástil de proa - Étai petit mât de hune 
Según mi anuncio en el último post, me estoy ocupando de las estancias de mástil de proa. Así que preparé la asamblea para el mástil de proa. De acuerdo con mi suposición original de que aquí se usó una cuerda a la izquierda, obviamente este no es el caso de acuerdo con mi investigación actual. La estancia tenía un diámetro de 41 mm en el original, lo que corresponde a 0,85 mm en la escala del modelo.
El mástil de proa se fija de la misma forma que el principal. Esto requiere un ojo abierto. Las dos piernas se empalman en la estancia. Finalmente, los extremos reciben ojales empalmados, que luego reciben un amarre, como se puede ver en la siguiente imagen. A modo de comparación, he colocado una cuerda al lado que corresponde al pilar.

DSC00127.thumb.JPG.f1ba9cbe0fffc8d0d9d844ba93e5bdca.JPG
          

El tirante del mástil de proa se encaminó en el lado de estribor de la parte superior del bauprés a través de la polea del tirante a la proa para sujetarlo mediante dedal y cáncamo. Se sirvió el área del estay que se condujo alrededor de la polea.  
     
Fockstengestag.thumb.JPG.38392ae5b6ff6dca41c4e754a5347940.JPG

Fuente: Atlas du Génie Maritime

 

Fockstengestag_LaCreole_PariserModell_Musee_de_la_marine.jpg.7be741279a7242b48fd9032e8336b0a3.jpg 
Fuente: Modelo original en el Musée de la Marine Paris

 

Los amarres del tirante del mástil de proa deben aplicarse directamente al modelo, ya que entonces ya no es posible pasar la cuerda a través del listón de la polea.

DSC00133.thumb.jpg.23380afbb640efd044b60e4171e7015b.jpg


 


La siguiente imagen muestra el cáncamo con el dedal del accesorio de estay en el castillo de proa. Aquí puede ver la orientación del escenario sobre las poleas laterales con las áreas servidas.
DSC00135.thumb.jpg.388cc5630468cc181bac345bf37bd322.jpg 

DSC00137.thumb.jpg.d34ad4ccd3808ff302c89c638b0e4ee2.jpg
  
La última imagen muestra el mástil de proa se mantiene en las crucetas de los mástiles.

DSC00138.thumb.jpg.8c057a760ddb02d6d3d377f804d949af.jpg
     
Continuará ... 


 

 

 

 Wonderful, a great reference to all his work. Admirable

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Posted (edited)

@Jorge Diaz O

Hello,

I am particularly pleased with your last post. I would like to thank you very much for that.

 

Hello,

and here it goes on:

Fore topgallant stay - Étai petit mât de perroquet

In preparing to make the fore topgallant stay, the following question needs clarification and I hope for your expert assistance to clarify it:

In the monograph for La Créole, a diameter of 40 mm is given for the fore topgallant stay, not only in the overview with rigging plan but also in the text.
The fore topmast stay has a diameter of 41 mm. In this respect, the fore topgallant stay with a diameter of 40 mm seems to me to be much too thick. In my opinion, the stay should be
be much thinner, perhaps around 19 mm in diameter.
What do you think?

Fockbramstengestag_LaCreole.thumb.JPG.f8237156248c7be7266f45ec043e1514.JPG

Edited by archjofo
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Johann, I don’t think it is a typo. Look at the Main topmast and topgallant stay diameters. They are all similar proportions. Which tells me they are intentional. Topgallant and topmast stays seem to be practically the same diameter….almost. 
 

Of course this is a French rigged ship, but I would be interested how it compares to a British rigged frigate of the same period. Or perhaps other French rigged ships as well. 

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Hi, 

I am not an expert on your "La Creole", so I cannot help you to answer your question, but currently I am having similar problems with my 74 gun ship I am building, following Boudriot's 4 volumes. I noticed that in his books he sometimes says one thing, and elsewhere he contradicts himself. For example, he says that the running end of the fore topmast preventer stay is tied to a deadeye and the second deadeye is made fast to a jackstaff standard on the bowsprit, with a lanyard in between. But on his plans he clearly shows two blocks instead! Go figure!

I think that either you will have to faithfully follow Boudriot, or use your own best judgement and perhaps make your stay, say 25 mm thick - something in between 40 mm and 15 mm, (which is on item nr. 26 on your plan).

Thomas

PS: I always hugely admire your build - it is an inspiration for me with my own build, but I cannot come to your quality nearly enough!   😬

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Hello,

 

In the "Manuel du gréement" by F. A Costé which dates from 1828, the author gives the method to calculate the dimensions of the rig.
The result of this calculation gives the following diameters:
Fore topmast stay: 43 mm
Fore topgallant stay: 26 mm.

This "manuel" is here https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k9768285f?rk=42918;4

 

I am still in awe of this beautiful model.

 

GD

 

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@Jeronimo

Hi Karl,

many thanks for the nice comment.

 

Main topmast stay - Étai grand mât de hune
The main topmast stay of the La Créole had a diameter of 43 mm, which corresponds to a diameter of 0.89 mm in model scale 1:48. I made the corresponding rope from the finest Japanese silk yarn from Yli; 4 x 3 righthanded, and then these 3 strands were laid to the left to form a cable.

DSC00142.thumb.jpg.3cd94ea3ca1cf0fb8fed4517ffdd2da3.jpg

 
The next picture shows the main topmast stay with the open stay eye and the eyes spliced into the legs. Next to it is the prepared guide collar with thimble, which is placed around the masthead and then lashed down.
 
The main topmast stay is led through the thimble in the guide collar down to the deck and fastened there. I still have to finalise this detail.

To be continued ...


 

DSC00141.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

@jdbondy

Many thanks !


In the meantime, the rope for the mizzen topmast stay was made from fine silk yarn, three strands are laid up right handed to form a hawser laid rope with ø 0.77 mm in model scale, which corresponds to ø 37 mm in the original.  A guide collar was also made, as for the main topmast stay, to guide it down along the mast for attachment.
As already mentioned for the main topmast stay, this detail needed further clarification, which has now been done. Behind both the foremast and the mainmast was a set of guide blocks, which were carried on an iron rod. The respective stay was attached in the middle to this iron rod, which was fastened to the deck with three holders.For this purpose, the iron rod was inserted through the thimbles tied into the stays.
Here you can see the binding of a thimble:

DSC00158_wett.jpg.a02e1b1027bd25fe4b259305cc20abda.jpg
The following three pictures show the mizzen topmast stay from the top to the attachment point:

DSC00149_wett.jpg.9afd2efc9b614c0c36327a400cda87e0.jpg

 

DSC00150_wett.jpg.bdbaad698d01d0e3252e52256d93243a.jpg

 

DSC00151_wett.jpg.ab7ac2402af91bec722f45452cc36e2e.jpg

 


The following are three pictures of the main topmast stay from the top to the attachment point at the guide blocks:

DSC08193_wett.jpg.e289c2d0a401182820e19fd4ba095b21.jpg

 

DSC08191_wett.jpg.ec80f0ed942afae7c72771c889510eba.jpg

 

DSC08192_wett.jpg.004c7fd05bd74f97551c4f3e67a48321.jpg


To be continued ...

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Ratlines for the topmast shrouds 
The topmast shrouds were thinner than the lower shrouds (comparison on the model: Fore mast shrouds ø 1.08 mm / fore topmast shrouds ø 0.66 mm), their ratlines are also to be made with smaller diameters in proportion, which is the result of earlier research.

ratlines-dcece8aa-dc8b-4e61-8304-b7d66a90a3e-resize-750.jpg.e5d472c747b6a4b0bb0923ff6df3801a.jpg
 
Some time ago, I tried to clarify whether the required eye splices could be made with a thickness of ø 0.25 mm. For this purpose I made a splicing tool with a smaller diameter ø 0.8 mm, as shown in the next picture. 

DSC07910.jpg.5759fe66b5112a81b18a9b854ec77863.jpg
  
The fake splice (2x sticking through) with a dew thickness of ø 0.25 mm was already quite successful at that time. 
In the following picture you can see the comparison of the ratlines thickness again.I don't like the simpler alternative version with knots, because it is too thick and doesn't correspond to the original version.
DSC07955.thumb.jpg.5c46dd592c2626d83229ddec9965c5bb.jpg 

In the meantime I have found the time and muse to make these filigree ratlines with the fake splice directly on the model. It has to be said that this is an extremely difficult job, but it can be done. In my opinion, the result speaks for itself. In this respect it is worth the effort.

DSC00167.thumb.jpg.a1fd1a412116efa642a0d1d94b223d88.jpg
 
But now we will continue with mizzen topmast stay. I still have to find out how it was attached. 
I would be very grateful for any information. 
See you soon ...

 

Edited by archjofo
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  • 4 weeks later...

Hello,

here it goes on after a small creative break:

In the meantime I have made the ropes for the main topmast preventer stay (Ø 0.63 mm) and mizzen topmast preventer stay (Ø 0.50 mm). 
In principle, these are attached as shown in the following sketch.

borgstag_.jpg.e94003a7690b03af8865aae1540bbae4.jpg

Source: Internet unknown


This method of attachment was described in the monograph by J. Boudriot. I hope that I have interpreted it correctly.
Accordingly, the collars were prepared with thimbles. At the corresponding places the stays are served.

DSC00171.thumb.jpg.a2ca0fb4726fa469992fc4fc37ec76fe.jpg

 

DSC00175.thumb.jpg.8bb164f90e2444298a87387a2f1b832f.jpg

 

DSC00180.thumb.jpg.3e6e8ab02b3eb42ac74ed77f33456ffd.jpg


Shortly I will show how they are then mounted on the model.

 

Edited by archjofo
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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello,
I have not yet come to the assembly of the mizzen topmast preventer stay and main mast preventer stay. I still have to finish these steps and will of course report on them.
 

At the moment I am dealing with the detail clarification for the following stays:
Mizzen topgallant stay and main topgallant stay  - Étai mât de perruche et Étai grand mât de perroquet


The mizzen topgallant stay of La Créole had a diameter of 22 mm, the main topgallant stay 28 mm (recalculated according to G. Lacroix method). 
etai_perroquet_fleche.thumb.JPG.8c19100f66ec52d4de8c32b394d2d392.JPG  
Source: Atlas du Génie Maritime, Annexe Pl. 1


These stays did not have open eyes like the top mast stays (Fig. 1). The collar was spliced directly to the stay (Fig. 2) and served accordingly. Based on the illustration in the atlas (1860), I assume that these stays, also due to their small diameters, were made as hawser laid rope. Unfortunately, I did not find corresponding information in the monograph on La Créole, also not regarding the continuations and fixations on the respective tops. Also on the picture material available to me I cannot see any indications in this respect.
Only to the mizzen topgallant stay I have read in the monograph that this is led down to Mars via a single block, which was attached to the mast cap. About the attachment of the stay again nothing concrete can be taken from the description.
Therefore a few questions arise in this connection, which I try to bring to a clarification.


In addition first the following representation for the overview of these two stays:

476480304_Monographie_La_Creole_03-Kopie.thumb.jpg.f1d5f1b9851c429bfc542b063bf63ee8.jpg 
Source: Monograph "La Creole" by J. Boudriot, p. 129

 

 

kreuzbramstengestag_lacreole_ziff.thumb.jpg.cec803132f700f39ba889991e272716e.jpg

 
My research gave, as shown graphically above, from my point of view a conceivable fixing possibility for these stays (numbers of the overview assigned) on the respective crosstrees. In my opinion, the main topgallant stay could be forwarded by means of a collar (number 3) with a thimble. 
To what extent this way of fixing and forwarding the stays for the La Créole is historically correct, I could not find out.

 

Therefore I would be grateful for any hints and your valued opinion. 


See you soon ...

 

 

Edited by archjofo
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Hello,


This way of working the upper end of the stays is correct as it is quoted in Costé's treatise which serves as your reference.
It should be noted, however, that Costé specifies that coherence is required and if the upper stays use this type of mooring, it should be practised for all the stays.
For the mooring at the bottom, depending on the stay, they are fixed either on the bars as you have shown, or on the stay next to it after passing through a thimble or a block (depending on their diameter) fitted on a bolt behind the cap or even more simply by tying it to this bolt.
Here is the mizzen top stay of La Créole where you can see how it is worked with two branches, i.e. without mouse.

 

Etai.jpg.6ea67b0e17b4841ce95b23185f09e38d.jpg

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@bdgiantman2

 

Hi there,

I am happy to comply with your request.
Of course, the model looks a little messy in this condition.
Besides, I'm not a professional photographer. I will soon get myself a real background for taking photos so that I can bring the whole model onto the picture.
I hope that you like the pictures so far.

_DSC7700.thumb.jpg.c381ccd0f18f2d451cda5aa15d2665b1.jpg

 

_DSC7703.thumb.jpg.644cfe604a7e6935e1e9038c6bf066c1.jpg

 

_DSC7705.thumb.jpg.263a1bbc63131ec4a8ff7718ea6403cd.jpg

 

_DSC7690.thumb.jpg.5d4db2430931caac50385b4c02fc1fbf.jpg

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