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Louie da fly

Henry Grace a Dieu (Great Harry) by Louie da fly - Scale 1:200 - Repaired after over 40 yrs of neglect

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Posted (edited)

Trimmed the new panels of planking to shape at the stern, added the missing pieces to the broken wales and cut gunports

20190331_165215.thumb.jpg.577455afa262337733312388079cff09.jpg 20190331_165236.thumb.jpg.65338091ba090c9db3e2180d3961793c.jpg 20190331_165243.thumb.jpg.079c1529db1202102e485ef266d654e0.jpg 20190331_165355.thumb.jpg.6cb6850cec001f056cdba85c611aae43.jpg 20190331_165435.thumb.jpg.ab6c6b41c07dc02e6d8a1d7ae006ee0d.jpg I've also trimmed the deck beams so they tie in with the bottoms of the false "frames" that show above the top deck, so I can fit the decking in below them.

 

And something of a milestone, I've finally glued one of the superstructure panels back into place, after being off the ship for a long time. Because the stern is narrower, the old aftercastle panels don't quite fit on top of the old hull planking - I'll have to do a little adjusting to get everything together and fill up any gaps between the two.

20190401_164227.thumb.jpg.a0c8a34b71ecc579de53bf425883061f.jpg  20190401_164350.thumb.jpg.20aed79a5c9c66e648a23b2957998f49.jpg  20190401_164900.thumb.jpg.a5ec48a03acb3049c7276fd950013147.jpg That's all for now. I really should get back to the dromon. It's been sitting there neglected for a while.

 

Steven

Edited by Louie da fly

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I hope so, Pat. I'm very aware of the shortcomings, not only of the original, but of my rather bodgy repairs. But I suppose it's just a matter of keeping on with it and hoping it'll be alright on the night . . .😒

 

Steven

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I've added the superstructure for the port side of the aftercastle. I had to sit with my thumb on the forward end till the glue dried - there was no other way to clamp it in position.

20190711_085130.thumb.jpg.e24e385da6362dbf7f1b6f2707b884af.jpg 20190711_085148.thumb.jpg.d6ee4d367315b5590d7fbf2988e3f145.jpg 20190711_170343.thumb.jpg.8c29ee3598c575000860dba0b09a6def.jpg

Because the stern is narrower than on the original model, the complex curves of the bottom of the superstructure and the top of the main hull no longer lined up with each other - there's a long narrow gap between them.

20190711_150120.thumb.jpg.ff4a10f07e93224c2e5a95771a29e51c.jpg

So I've started putting a sliver of wood in the gap.

20190711_172749.thumb.jpg.0987499a9f2f3a64047af3942a449add.jpgI didn't want to make any more cannons than I had to, so I've also added port lids to all the gunports except those at the "well deck", where the guns are visible anyway.

 

Steven 

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Coming along nicely Steven.  I visited the spot on the Hamble River where the remains of her hull lie during my recent trip to the UK; nothing to see but I can say I was there :)  I can send a photo if you like?

 

cheers

 

Pat

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Pat, I'm pretty sure the Hamble River remains are of Henry V's (the Agincourt guy) Grace Dieu. My model is of Henry VIII's (the guy with VIII wives) Henry Grace a Dieu. Different ships with similar names, over 100 years apart.

 

Having said that, I think the Grace Dieu is fascinating as well. She was enormous for the time; if I remember correctly she was about the size of the Victory - in comparison with other ships of the era she was sort of like the Great Eastern compared with the Sirius.

 

There was (and still may be) a set of lines for the surviving hull on the Net. I think this might have been connected with the Time Team investigation of maybe a decade ago done by echo-location, I think. As usual, only below the waterline has survived, and you could only get a small picture taken from an angle which was all but useless. I've meant to contact whoever's in charge to get a proper copy of them but never got around to it.

 

Steven

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Posted (edited)

Well, I started adding more slivers between the port superstructure and the lower hull, and cutting them back flush with the planking.

20190712_095741.thumb.jpg.f72d8ed9a8d8539c5479ed0c920a4d56.jpg

Then an AAAAARGGGHHH moment, I'm afraid. I've discovered that I'd got the position and alignment of the port superstructure wrong. You can see it on the following photos. When I started putting in cross-pieces at the stern I realised the starboard side was higher than the port, so the crosspieces weren't square.

20190712_101532.thumb.jpg.5a10b11b17898ac716012b4fb310baa2.jpg 20190712_161002.thumb.jpg.4d8fbf3f3b636dd8c453c3e17396631f.jpg 

You can see the difference in angle between the top crosspieces and the one at the bottom, which is the only one that's correct. I could have left it as it was - "she'll be right" - but I know it would have sneered at me from then on, and I'd have cursed myself for not fixing it when I could have.  So I've removed it again (thank heaven for isopropanol) so I can fix it properly.

20190713_182539.thumb.jpg.3432541677ce1b0cd10b90144fedbafa.jpg 20190713_182550.thumb.jpg.ac10008beeff13dbff96b4fc0def01cd.jpg

I've made a cardboard template which will be used to get the shape of the after end of the aftercastle right. I'll be able to re-use all the bits, but it's rather annoying.

20190713_182820.thumb.jpg.761b8113dbd26edd2e615d26cd2de0e8.jpg 20190713_182934.thumb.jpg.fde6bc4f180a158ed8b1c872df8ae4b2.jpg 

 

In retrospect, I don't think there was any easy way to avoid this problem. There were too many variables - I just had to try it and see how it worked. But perhaps I could have thought it out better in advance instead of charging in like a bull at a gate.

 

Sigh.

 

Steven

Edited by Louie da fly

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What an amazing project! I wonder how many people can reach back into their youth like that. I have an old Raleigh racing bicycle with which I had a head-on collision with a car in 1979. I never got back on the bicycle and I still have it, rusty but usable. Restoring it would make a cool project. 

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Well, why not, Rick? Sounds like something worthwhile to do. And who knows you might get back on it and get a lot of enjoyment from it.

 

Steven

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Well, that's fixed, anyway. I've now put the port superstructure back in place and it now all lines up - at least as well as possible - any further discrepancies come from my 17-year old self not making it perfect in the first place. 

 

I was hoping to make the after face of the superstructure the same way it would have been back in the day, with the wales and the strakes made and installed individually, using the cardboard template to define the shape. Unfortunately it just didn't work out that way. I ended up having to make it out of a single sheet of wood (got it right on the second attempt), with the wales glued on the outside instead of forming part of the structure.

20190714_112953.thumb.jpg.ecd8e5060051ca3130633c557da09233.jpg 20190714_113014.thumb.jpg.9465250cbc436104b11bac0e26519a20.jpg 20190714_170458.thumb.jpg.ade91e30cdf1a1ccb5f12bd3385a1ddc.jpg 

There  is now quite a gap between the lower hull and the  port superstructure, which I will have to infill with a new strake. 

20190714_170503.thumb.jpg.af93b25a256aab725080c8e3c5893e02.jpg 20190715_105017.thumb.jpg.1bf90a67b3bf14f848e15c1f91df0cfd.jpg

Still, it's now starting to look like the kind of stern you see in Bruegel's paintings, which has got to be a good thing . . .

 

20190715_105057.thumb.jpg.c532c34bb908441582a1ccfa6c02dd42.jpg 127458000_breugelbabelships.jpg.4d066e9395d99d795dbb7a0dafac72ff.jpg

Steven  

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After quite a long gap, I've put the wales on the transom. Unfortunately the wales on the port and starboard sides of the ship don't line up perfectly with each other, so I had to fudge it a bit to get the transom wales as close to parallel and horizontal as I could.

20190808_194128.thumb.jpg.ccdff6b6dbe0efb6414639f8e23b70a6.jpg 20190809_105158.thumb.jpg.2fa8fb92d67d8a3d1691f0d78a2e319e.jpg

Next job is to cut arched gunports in the transom, then make the lower part of the stern. I also have to fit a sliver of wood between the main hull and the upper works to fill the gap noted in the previous post. Slow but steady progress.

 

Steven

 

 

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Nice work on this model Steven.

 

Better slow but steady, then fast but wrong.  That is also my way of thinking about this hobby.

 

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Thanks for the likes and the comments.

 

17 hours ago, Backer said:

Better slow but steady, then fast but wrong.

Funny, I'm in the middle of reading a book called "Finders Keepers" by Craig Childs about archaeological looting, (which is a major problem and is nowadays carried out on an almost industrial scale) - the thing that grabbed my attention though, was his statement "I have secretly wished to be an archaeologist myself, but I do not have the patience for the scientific tedium involved, which would test model-ship builders." (my italics).

 

Nice to see the recognition of one of the main qualities of a ship modeller . . . Maybe I'll make this my signature?

 

Steven 

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The arched holes in the transom have now been done. I started off drilling holes where they were to go:

20190810_155631.thumb.jpg.9ba5da0e216fbfa2eff05b0cb1f29f89.jpg 20190810_155639.thumb.jpg.4dba8d5b7b01bf35892c518a6221f9ab.jpg

Then one by one cutting around the holes with a No. 11 scalpel to make them into arches of two different sizes - larger ones for cannon

20190810_160140.thumb.jpg.189b5f176cb31ef5ea8e26c7153b1ff4.jpg 20190810_160150.thumb.jpg.29bfa8a1366fd8610d2b5477d71fcad9.jpg 

and smaller ones for railing pieces or swivel guns. 

20190812_143233.thumb.jpg.9bca192909dbf156185f0a69dd01813a.jpg 20190812_143244.thumb.jpg.04c9f9ec4057557f79c8edce8f5d6694.jpg 

All done.

20190812_154321.thumb.jpg.0d835e139406f37a57bf901bc50d0bd2.jpg 20190812_154328.thumb.jpg.fd019dd9ff38ddb91b5ea0895aea6caf.jpg

And I've started filling in the gap between the lower and upper works on the port side of the ship. The lighter colour wood is the new stuff.

20190812_154343.thumb.jpg.7aa80bfca02e61002bc509a37246d630.jpg

Steven

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Finished with the "filling piece" on the port side.

20190819_150454.thumb.jpg.1f73eb89db8df90cf984ef48aa9191fb.jpg 20190819_150504.thumb.jpg.0f1f250f6ff2eee42dff56044b004e9b.jpg

And added the planking across the stern.

20190822_151456.thumb.jpg.1834a9944d2465203c7b73b0deaa2876.jpg 20190822_182027.thumb.jpg.0b1e28813bc07ecc68caa1f47c6cc154.jpg

Unfortunately the port and starboard sides don't quite line up, so I've had to taper the planks to gradually change the angle of the planking and get it right at the different parts of the stern (and bodge it a bit, such as lining up the upper surface of a wale on one side with the lower surface of the one on the other side). It's a legacy of my 17 year-old self, plus the changes I had to make to incorporate the existing superstructure into the new hull shape.

20190822_182125.thumb.jpg.8dc6ec20875bfa21477e2529bf8a44f9.jpg 20190822_182132.thumb.jpg.aed18a17a2037b7f733b2ef633fde030.jpg 20190823_184654.thumb.jpg.e86218d35dbd6a7af779c72c6e16e4d7.jpg   

But once it's cut to shape and sanded smooth you have to look pretty carefully to see it. 

 

20190823_185610.thumb.jpg.6b150f206ff796f7dd69e47e100dc3c2.jpg

 

Steven

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I decided I couldn't live with the off-square stern sneering at me, so I took everything off below the transom and started again. To overcome the problem with the wales on port and starboard sides not lining up, I carved the curves in the port side below the transom so they did. I had to re-align some of the port side wales a bit, too, but it felt good to do it.

 

Her are the pics:

 

I put in new wales on the transom, all parallel to the gunwale and the lowest wale. That gave me a starting point. I had to re-cut two of the lowest line of arched gunports, as they'd followed the (off-square) line of the wale below them. And here I have started planking below the transom.

20190902_170731.thumb.jpg.06934bf4b5b5785887b6eb88113a0df0.jpg 

The two cut-out curves of the port side at the stern have been adjusted to line up with those of the starboard side:

 

20190902_170735.thumb.jpg.cfd79ec2ebd750c0c724a1768e314bca.jpg 

And the first panel of planking below the transom complete.

20190906_132824.thumb.jpg.fb965d051feb677360a8766d490b5bde.jpg 20190906_132831.thumb.jpg.3358814bb7d7edb3b9af56ce73b26f7b.jpg 

Here it is from the port side. The lighter-coloured wood is the new stuff. Though I was originally going to colour it the same as the original wood I've decided instead to keep it as it is, to show the new work compared with the old.  20190906_133058.thumb.jpg.6bf22632c6b5f4cb8ed7d9b21a16996a.jpg 20190906_133125.thumb.jpg.989a11f18ceaa32f65595ac1fe6170f1.jpg 

Steven

 

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That was always a concern, Pat. Certainly I had to ditch a lot more of the old structure than I'd wanted to (have a look at the first couple of posts in this build log). But I've managed to keep much of the original and I'm pretty happy with that. The hull above the waterline will mostly be original, as will the main deck and the forecastle, but the deck of the aftercastle will be new. It's a shame I lost the main hatch and the longboat - they were pretty cool.

 

The bowsprit, fore and main masts and their spars and shrouds I still have, along with their original sails (which will have to be replaced but will serve as a pattern for the new ones). The mizzen and bonaventure mizzen have been lost along the way, along with their spars, sails and rigging, and will have to be re-done. 

 

I'm hoping that when it's all done it will be a nice snapshot of what I was capable of at 17, with the new stuff showing how much I've learned in the interim.

 

Steven

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I'm nearly finished on the stern; in fact I've gone as far as I can until the bottom planking is done.

20190910_140745.thumb.jpg.4fd6ed700aab5e3130c1ead7f8e0bfec.jpg

 

Love these new clamps! (For Aussies, these are available at Officeworks very cheap, and have a very light grip so they don't warp anything. Oh, and they don't get stuck to the glue like my wooden miniature clothes pegs).

20190910_140753.thumb.jpg.1a1994f12d55f32889f1791c0fe6d123.jpg

Added the sternpost. I'm always a bit undecided how far to take things - do I make it the same as I would have when I was 17 and iggerant, or upgrade to my current state of iggerance? Usually I do a bit of each - for example, except for the sternpost the keel is in one piece, rather than made in bits like the originals. 

 

I've also cut out the arched hole for the tiller. Unfortunately you can see the balsa crosspiece of the frame behind it.

20190910_182420.thumb.jpg.416ff339eda27bf1884e37ca60916f70.jpg 

So I added another crosspiece below it and cut a hole in the first one for the tiller. Still a bit of tidying to do. Here she is upside down. You can see the added balsa crossbeam and the original crossbeam with a central cut-out just behind and to the left of the number 3.

20190911_135729.thumb.jpg.31e22b9ca27acc5f5f2aa9094f951046.jpg 

And looking through the arch. The crossbeam of the aftermost frame has had the hole cut in it, but you can see through to the next frame's crossbeam behind it. Naturally that won't be visible unless you look very carefully with your eye up against the hole. 

20190911_135904.thumb.jpg.375c1b4320ed8d8fe807d73f22c8108b.jpg 

Looking aft past the frames you can just see daylight through the cut-out in the crossbeam and the tiller arch. 

20190911_140036.thumb.jpg.4903317d9501b051fac8df6de2ca6ccc.jpg

And added more planking and the bottom wale (which still needs to be trimmed to length).

20190911_135532.thumb.jpg.68433392bca94370adecd000a6af5581.jpg 20190911_135614.thumb.jpg.1e4a1cc0befd83a5b7858a11828fb450.jpg

Next is to make the few cannons I'm putting on this model. I have yet to close up some more of the gunports I don't want open so I don't have to make too many cannons.

 

Then I can close her up with bottom planking and upper deck.

 

Steven

Edited by Louie da fly

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Who would know what level of 'iggerence' you were at, or had the potential to show, back then mate; I say do it to your current level of 'ignorance'.  I show/demonstrate mine on a near-daily basis and have become somewhat 'immune' to outside comments.

 

cheers

 

Pat

Edited by BANYAN

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