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HMS Victory by Wallace - Corel SM 23 - 1:98 Scale

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4 hours ago, Katsumoto said:

just want you to know that they repaint the HMS Victory last year into another colour.

Yes, I knew that Peter. I decided to go with the colors I knew she had when I was a boy. Thanks sir. 

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3 hours ago, Kevin said:

are you going to make your own gun port lids, or use the kit ones

I do have the kit ones but they are giving me some issues. We will see. 

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1 hour ago, harlequin said:

I have used the metal gunports in my Bellona build....they are not supplied with Bellona but I quite like the contrast they give....highlights them and makes a feature out of them which I like.

 

Yes, although the ports are proving troublesome to put together they are nicely detailed. I shall prep and dry fit them and see what they look like. Kevin had an idea that I perhaps scratch build my own. I may do a couple of those too and see how that goes. 

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I am sorry Mark, I missed your last two updates! 

 

You are making good steady progress and its showing in how good your Vic looks.

The only thing I would be worried about with the metal gunports/lids is making them look like wood, so I'm interested to see how you paint them. And interested to see your scratch built ones. Do you have to decide soon or are you able to leave the decision till later in the build?

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4 hours ago, nikbud said:

Do you have to decide soon or are you able to leave the decision till later in the build?

I have time until I have finished planking/painting the hull. As it stands I am leaning heavily towards the scratch build purely due to the fact that I am not happy with the Corel ports. That will obviously take me a lot longer but I think it will look a lot more authentic. 

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A lot...and I mean a lot of scratching hours will be spend on those gunports Mark. They will look so much better but on the other hand. I saw a other Corel build on this forum of the Bellona I think, he used the metal gunports and they looked Allright to me. To to bad afterall...

 

decision time.... 😬

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12 hours ago, Wallace said:

I have time until I have finished planking/painting the hull. As it stands I am leaning heavily towards the scratch build purely due to the fact that I am not happy with the Corel ports. That will obviously take me a lot longer but I think it will look a lot more authentic. 

I scratch built mine for the Victory, and I am very happy with them.  It took a bit, but it was well worth it.

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On 3/13/2019 at 6:51 AM, GrandpaPhil said:

I scratch built mine for the Victory, and I am very happy with them.  It took a bit, but it was well worth it.

And I think I will be going that route too Phil. I do like the look of yours so that gives me something to aim for.

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As I have mentioned several times before the job I have taken has sliced a large chunk off my recreation program and added to that I still have variois chores that go along with owning 10 acres and a farm. But, I am making slow but sure headway with my build. The few hours I stole this weekend were spent measuring out the gunports on the port side of the hull and finishing the second layer of strakes on that same side. 

 

I have all day Wednesday off and, having caught up on the afore mentioned chores I will be able and am certainly looking forward to spending some quality time in the shipyard. Pictures to follow. Oh yes, Spring has raised its colorful head here on the mountain. We have early blooming daffodils and crocus..... a nice splash of color after a loooong cold Winter. 

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Good to hear you are managing to get at least some hours in the shipyard.

Fingers crossed you don't end up with more snow...😁

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Sunday, March 24, 2019:

Hmmmmmmm…….

Something happened in the shipyard this week that made me sit and scratch my head which was then followed by a long period of decision making. This all had to do with the gun ports so let me take you all back to Wednesday afternoon.

I was busy happily putting together my scratch build ports. I started off by gluing two 5 x 1.5 strakes together. Once they were sanded down and dry I added a layer of the deck planking on top to give the port some profile.

image.png.3466038ae15ca70d13ac4058495fec8c.png

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After this was done I marked the strips off into 10 mm sections and cut them on my mini chop saw.

image.png.4193d8fe2e750f4b5640fcf93199ffaf.png

I then compared the result with the original gun port:

image.png.b30496240d732ffacc822924d72d0853.png

It was at this point that I decided to just check up on something that had been stuck in the back of my mind not wanting to show itself for a while now, a niggling thought that told me something was not quite right. I went back and checked on some images of the real ship that I had seen on this forum. When I had originally seen them I had a cursory look through them all and downloaded the ones I thought I would need onto my PC here. I think it was at that time that the “burr” got stuck in the back of my mind telling me to go back and have a proper look. Here is what I found and what my subconscious was screaming at me the whole time:

image.png.baf51cc4772d1b41c45f6f9078e8e011.png

This image had lodged itself in my memory and I could not figure out why until I looked at it again earlier on this week. Look at the gun ports (I have circled one just to highlight what it is I am talking about). Here is a much closer look:

image.png.747031b3e3c9fcd4b3acf01a5795f4cf.png

 

Notice how the ports appear to have been cut out of the hull wood and simply hinged. They follow the contours of the hull precisely and do not stand proud of it, neither are they recessed into it in a surrounding bracket, as is the case in the Corel model I have.

This revelation made me rethink my gun port design completely. I considered several options, one of which was to just add the port itself from the Corel kit and forget the supplied insert. (My plans have changed since then and I am heading in a slightly different direction but it is relevant to what happened next).

It was at this time while I was separating out the lids from the inserts that I noticed that Corel had done it again – they had supplied me with insufficient ports of the correct sort. All in all I need 78 hinged gun ports, this is what the plans are calling for (please notice that they all have hinges running from top to bottom):

image.png.299f294bf5fb254057bffd702d05ea50.png

And this is what I found in my box:

image.png.5711e8166e2467a7a7f4f012ddfc06b0.png

 

I have 45 of the hinged ones and 34 plain ones. It made me realize that I really should have inventoried the whole kit back in October like I wanted to and not just the wood! I double (and triple) checked to see if in fact the “unhinged” ports were meant for a specific deck but this was not the case. The plans clearly show that all ports have a hinge. I now have the option of writing to Corel (again) to send me a sufficient amount of the correct ports or I could simply make the ports look like the ones on the real ship, which is really what I should be doing and I have a strong tendency to head in that direction.

As it stands I am just about done with the port side. The wales on the image do look a little wavy but they are nice and straight on the model itself, believe me.

image.png.7ec2c38cc6b16265a1af01989322f103.png

In my frustration I decided to change tack and start on something else for a while to clear my mind. I started thinking about the coppering process and how I was going to approach that. My thanks go out to Grandpa Phil for sharing his technique using the adhesive copper tape with me. It was a great help Phil! By the time I upload my next update the gun port issue will have been resolved (any input there would be appreciated) and the hull will have the beginnings of a new shiny copper coat. Until next time guys…….

 

 

 

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Y'know, I had never noticed that before. Certainly the Constructo version of HMS Victory does not have stepped gun-ports, either. From your image of the real Victory, it appears they are only like that on the lowest gun-deck. If it is not too difficult, then you certainly could recreate the stepped version on your model. Just a thought, Mark, but I'd run this post past Dafi for his opinion. He seems to be the unofficial authority on all things Victory. It's entirely possible that the stepped version only relates to a particular period (most likely the modern one).

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20 minutes ago, CaptainSteve said:

He seems to be the unofficial authority on all things Victory.

I will certainly do that sir, thank you.  If that is his user name here he should not be too hard to track down. 

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23 minutes ago, CaptainSteve said:

If it is not too difficult, then you certainly could recreate the stepped version on your model. 

That should be relatively simple as I am planning on displaying her with the ports closed anyway. 

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If you don’t use the prefab ports, it’s easy to create them out of wood but she’s a big ship so a lot of Ports to make sir! She is looking very good!

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4 minutes ago, Katsumoto said:

If you don’t use the prefab ports, it’s easy to create them out of wood but she’s a big ship so a lot of Ports to make sir! She is looking very good!

Why thank you Peter, always nice to hear your feedback mate ☺️

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Hello Wallace,

 

nice to see you doing all things Vic 🙂

 

And yes, it is right that at the Vic at all times the gun port lids were flush with the surface, no step, no frame, imitating the whales and other timbers.

 

And this was not just on the Vic like that, also on all ships as far as I know. Basically one could plank the ship completely cut the edges of the ports as a groove 🙂

 

Does this answer your question?

 

All the best, DAniel

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1 hour ago, dafi said:

Does this answer your question?

It most certainly does and it gives me a green light to go ahead with how I had planned on doing the ports anyway. 

Thank you Daniel. 

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Going by what you said on page 1;

 

Quote

This is going to be a meticulous and therefore slow build - I want to get this right

 

...I think in this case, and probably others to come, you had already made this decision before you opened the box!

 

For me, I don't know about others, but if I am faced with a "should I use the kit part or make my own?" choice then its important that I at least try. I know from previous experience there is not much worse than looking at a completed model thinking "if only I'd have tried, If only I'd made the effort".

 

Plus if I have to learn 16/17th century rigging from scratch, you can make 100 lids - misery loves company! 🤣🤣

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It does look like it was mainly along the bottom row of ports where the lids have the same stepped thickness as the Whale, what you could do is to make the lids then create the different parts that are thicker and keep testing/shaping until they match the profile of the whale.

 

OC.

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8 hours ago, Old Collingwood said:

It does look like it was mainly along the bottom row of ports where the lids have the same stepped thickness as the Whale, what you could do is to make the lids then create the different parts that are thicker and keep testing/shaping until they match the profile of the whale.

 

OC.

Thanks for the input OC. That is sound advice and pretty much what I will end up doing I guess. 

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Hi Mark - just catching up with your build log. You're a better man than me....always thought about doing a Victory next but not sure I have one in me - seems there's everything on the Bounty times ten! You're putting in a lot of great effort, should be special.

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1 hour ago, Tim Moore said:

Hi Mark - just catching up with your build log. You're a better man than me....always thought about doing a Victory next but not sure I have one in me - seems there's everything on the Bounty times ten! You're putting in a lot of great effort, should be special.

Judging by the quality of your build I would say you are more than capable of managing a Vic mate, and thanks for dropping by.

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12 hours ago, harlequin said:

Wallace.....I have more than enough ports by corel if you want them....Quite happy to post to you FOC if you decide that is the route you are going down. 

Thanks mate, I appreciate that. 

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Monday, April 01, 2019:

Coppering-

A quick update on the progress thus far gentlemen. After getting some input from those better schooled than me in things HMS Victory (thanks Dafi for your input) I decided to re-fill and sand down the gun ports as they were slightly off. I will finish the second layer of strakes, prime the hull and then etch the lower two levels of ports into the wood to signify the closed hatches. I am considering several options right now as to how best to achieve this, one of which was a square hollow punch (a very sharp one!) that is 10 mm x 10 mm. The only issue with that is I don’t really want to go around banging the punch against the hull – like I said, to accomplish this it would need to be extremely sharp so that a light tap gives me the result I am looking for. I am still searching for said tool by the way…..

To move forward with other parts of the build I started to assemble the rudder. I wanted this done as I am starting the coppering this week and the rudder is going to get a nice shiny coat too (at least 2/3 of it is anyway).

The plans called for several pieces of 5 x 5 beech wood to be cut to specific lengths, shaped accordingly and then glued together:

image.png.e1200f05d97bc43343c5a440bf30673a.pngimage.png.dd93566094cfe5acc5ded01965ddcc76.png  

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I left the bottom edge of the rudder as a rough cut, I want to sand it straight later once I match it to the hull. The 2 x 5 walnut strips that house the hinges will be added later.

After getting all that done I started the coppering process on the hull. My slug tape was cut into 4” lengths:

image.png.78ce5ec757b9703c5a5bb8da7b8a72ab.png

… and then divided into 3 equal strips:

 

image.png.21405b6e68ccb2ad65cc5191d8fa0fa6.png

These were then sectioned off to the appropriate size for this 1:98 scale model (1/4 inch by ½ inch long, or for the metric pros among us 6.4 mm by 12.8 mm):

image.png.c67082b4e06d9472277f739a68b5fd71.png

I had planned on marking the nails with a pounce wheel but it has not arrived yet. Instead I used a dental pick and lightly punched the indentations into the copper, using my steel ruler as a guide to keep the lines straight. These strips were then attached along the edge of the keel:

image.png.80f909141cdc16b6606c47765de769ad.png

For the eagle eyed among us you will see that the second strip drops down a little at the end (I noticed that after I had taken the pic). This was corrected and the strip along the bottom of the keel was laid on and overlapped:

image.png.1fb94d2839fb2d47694ec54de168f717.png

The stern post piece will be added once the coppering is done. It will tidy up the edges as it overlaps around the post to finish everything off.

This is where I am at now. This process will take some time but I am glad to be doing it, the hull will look amazing once it is completed. Onward.......

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