dgbot Posted February 28, 2014 Share #421 Posted February 28, 2014 This is where dainty hands and fingers come in handy. My hands would be a little too big to get in there. David B Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted February 28, 2014 Share #422 Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) Toni,The original shipwrights had the same problem fitting beams into place - even without the knees. Their end clearances were very close and the frames above the decks "tumbled home." I suggest you do what they did if you can - spring the beam by lifting the center while holding the ends down, then rotate it into place. I installed Naiad's beams with knees attached using this method. Thanks to Blaise Olivier's 1737 commentary on English practice. (The French at the time apparently set the beams then raised the clamps under them.) Here's a picture. Ed Edited February 28, 2014 by EdT Elmer Cornish, avsjerome2003, robin b and 4 others 7 Quote All EdT posted material Copyright 2016 Edward J Tosti Young America - extreme clipper 1853 Young America POB Version Modeling the Extreme Clipper Young America Vol 1 1:60 HMS Naiad 1797 The Naiad Frigate Vol I The Naiad Frigate Vol II1:96 Victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trussben Posted February 28, 2014 Share #423 Posted February 28, 2014 Interesting thought there ED. Let us know Toni if you try that way and have success. Ben Quote Current builds: HMS Pegasus TFFM. HMS Winchelsea. Completed builds: ECHO cross section.18th C Longboat.QA Barge. Medway Longboat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratch Posted February 28, 2014 Share #424 Posted February 28, 2014 Beautiful , just beautiful work Toni . ): David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 2, 2014 Author Share #425 Posted March 2, 2014 Druxey, the counter timbers are safe (so far). David, I've seen your hands! But even my fingers are too large for some of these spaces so I do most of the fine work with needle holders and jeweler's forceps. A needle holder is similar to a hemostat but it has no deep ridges and the joint is much closer to the tip. Ed, I did just as you suggested a few frames forward but these beams are too short to spring them sufficiently. It is almost as easy to temporarily glue the knees to the beams in situ, mark their positions, debond, rebuild off the model to drill bolt holes and re-install using the bolt holes as a guide. Ben and David, thanks for looking in. Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor1234567890 Posted March 3, 2014 Share #426 Posted March 3, 2014 Ed, What you're saying about bending the beam in place makes perfect sense. Do you know how the shipwrights would have done it back in the day? Those are not little beams they had to contend with... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted March 3, 2014 Share #427 Posted March 3, 2014 (edited) Sailor, Olivier's report says a jack was used in the center of the beam. With that in mind, my guess is that the bean was laid out at an angle with the center at the final line and a screw jack up from the beam below - or off the pillar - placed at that point under the beam. The ends could then be held down with tackles to the beam below. As the beam was sprung with the jack and shortened, it could be rotated into position and the tackles eased to let the beam fit into place. Anyway, that is how I would do it. The beams do not have to be sprung very much. A 30' beam 14" wide would be about 0.3" too long measured between the diagonal corners. A fifteen foot beam of the same width would be about 5/8" too long. The sloping sides would require additional springing depending how high the beam was held above the clamp when rigged into place. Ed Edited March 3, 2014 by EdT Quote All EdT posted material Copyright 2016 Edward J Tosti Young America - extreme clipper 1853 Young America POB Version Modeling the Extreme Clipper Young America Vol 1 1:60 HMS Naiad 1797 The Naiad Frigate Vol I The Naiad Frigate Vol II1:96 Victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share #428 Posted March 9, 2014 I have finally finished the upper deck framing. The first three photos show the deck before final fairing. The last two are after everything has been sanded down. I started with 100 grit and progressively sanded down to 400 grit. I finished with a razor blade scraper. There was a slight hump in beam 20 which was corrected with the sanding. gjdale, Trussben, SailorGreg and 13 others 16 Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted March 9, 2014 Share #429 Posted March 9, 2014 Congratulations on reaching this point, Toni! That looks very nice indeed. Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbot Posted March 9, 2014 Share #430 Posted March 9, 2014 Congtrats on a job well done. your fingers are more dainty and gentle than mine. David B Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share #431 Posted March 9, 2014 Druxey and David, thanks. The only thing I could think of as I finished the deck was...thank god this isn't a frigate! I deferred making any of the items that attach on to the upper deck (except for the fore and main mast partners) until the entire deck was completed. Now it is time for some small projects which will vastly improve the monotony of the appearance of beams and scantlings. The first thing made was the capstan step. The shape of the step varied among the Swan class ships. In TFFM, David shows a three piece rectangular step. Atalanta has a tear-drop shaped step. At this point I was still psyched from finishing the deck, so I forgot to take pictures of the step fabrication. The step is made of three pieces of wood rabbeted together. The inner piece was 14" thick and the outer pieces were 10" thick. The edge of the 14" thick wood was highlighted on both sides with archival ink. The top of the step is flat, stands 7" proud of the beam and is parallel to the waterline, not to the deck. There is a hole in the middle for the capstan post. The step is secured to the beams and carlings with bolts. The mizzen partner is a simple plank, in contrast to the complex structures of the fore and main partners. The most difficult part is placing the hole in the correct location because of the rake of the mizzen mast. I do not plan on masting and rigging Atalanta so I took the location of the opening off the plan rather than make a dummy mast. Kevin, SawdustDave, Geoff Matson and 18 others 21 Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjdale Posted March 9, 2014 Share #432 Posted March 9, 2014 Congratulations on completing the deck framing Toni. She is looking terrific. Quote Grant ____________________________________________________ Current builds: African Queen - Radio Control / Live Steam Previous builds: The Shipyard at Foss' Landing (Diorama), Hannah - Ship in a Bottle, NRG Capstan Project, 1869 Allerton Steam Pumper, Medway Longboat , Alfa Romeo Spider Gran Touring (Pocher) , Da Vinci Flying Machine, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout - Dumas - Radio, Bomb Vessel Granado, 1742 - Cross Section - Scratchbuild, HMS Victory (Mamoli 1:90), Cutty Sark, Armed Pinnace, Bounty, Santa Maria At another place: Stephenson's Rocket (OcCre 1:24) (click the title to follow the link) In the Gallery: Lancia Armata 1803, Bomb Vessel Granada, 1742 Cross Section, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratch Posted March 9, 2014 Share #433 Posted March 9, 2014 Lovely work Toni . I like your leveller , is that on your phone ? David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share #434 Posted March 9, 2014 Thanks, Grant. David, it is an app on my phone. It's a freebie called Bubble. You have to calibrate it first with a known level surface but then it works great. Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted March 10, 2014 Share #435 Posted March 10, 2014 You wrote: "...thank god this isn't a frigate!" which is why I like smaller vessels. They take long enough to build. Which you are doing very well. Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvm27 Posted March 10, 2014 Share #436 Posted March 10, 2014 Congratulations on this milestone, Toni. Do you notice those lovely platform details disappearing before your eyes? You'll always have photos... Quote GregwebsiteAdmiralty Modelsmoderator Echo Cross-section buildAdmiralty Models Cross-section BuildFinished buildPegasus, 1776, cross-sectionCurrent buildSpeedwell, 1752 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remcohe Posted March 10, 2014 Share #437 Posted March 10, 2014 An other milestone achieved, great work Toni. Remco WackoWolf 1 Quote Treat each part as if it is a model on its own, you will finish more models in a day than others do in a lifetime. Current build HMS Kingfisher MSW 1.0 log click here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbot Posted March 10, 2014 Share #438 Posted March 10, 2014 Congratulations Toni The sad thing is as you go further all that beautiful work will be hidden from site. David B Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 10, 2014 Author Share #439 Posted March 10, 2014 Thank you, gentlemen, and thanks everyone for the likes. Greg, you mean there is a platform down there? All kidding aside, even though it is very difficult so see into the bowels of the ship, it was definitely worth installing. First, it gave me a better appreciation of the construction of these ships as well as the tight quarters endured by the men. On a more practical level, it gave me the chance to improve my woodworking skills where the mistakes will not be as noticeable. Trussben, mtaylor, paulsutcliffe and 3 others 6 Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share #440 Posted March 19, 2014 Because of the server issue I went back and checked all of the photos in the build log. It was necessary to repost about a dozen pictures. I have made and installed the hammock battens. These are pieces of tooth shaped wood that attach to the beams just under the carlings. Their function is to provide a hook to secure the hammocks. I first made several strips of wood the correct dimension (2" x 3") and glued them together. I set the height of the blade on the table saw to the depth of the notch and sawed all of the strips simultaneously. The distance between the teeth is 12". The piece was then put into a bottle of isopropanol and the individual pieces separated from each other after several minutes. The interior and exterior edges were rounded off with files. The nails attaching the batten to the beam were simulated with an awl highlighted with pencil. I decided to only place these on the starboard side since I have not yet decided how much decking I will install on the port side. I have also finished the upper row of planks for the aft bulkheads. They now extend to just below the beams. garyshipwright, gjdale, Richard Griffith and 18 others 21 Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbot Posted March 19, 2014 Share #441 Posted March 19, 2014 Great idea Toni. Is that the standard strength stuff from Osco? David B Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted March 19, 2014 Share #442 Posted March 19, 2014 Nice, Toni. Time to sling a hammock or two! Erebus and Terror 1 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael mott Posted March 19, 2014 Share #443 Posted March 19, 2014 (edited) Toni your ship is really beautifully crafted, congratulations on your milestone. Michael Edited March 19, 2014 by michael mott Quote Current builds Bristol Pilot Cutter 1:8; Skipjack 19 foot Launch 1:8; Herreshoff Buzzards Bay 14 1:8 Other projects Pilot Cutter 1:500 ; Maria, 1:2 Now just a memory Future model Gill Smith Catboat Pauline 1:8 Finished projects A Bassett Lowke steamship Albertic 1:100 Anything you can imagine is possible, when you put your mind to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratch Posted March 19, 2014 Share #444 Posted March 19, 2014 Nice work Toni . David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjdale Posted March 19, 2014 Share #445 Posted March 19, 2014 Nice touch with the hammock battens Toni. Quote Grant ____________________________________________________ Current builds: African Queen - Radio Control / Live Steam Previous builds: The Shipyard at Foss' Landing (Diorama), Hannah - Ship in a Bottle, NRG Capstan Project, 1869 Allerton Steam Pumper, Medway Longboat , Alfa Romeo Spider Gran Touring (Pocher) , Da Vinci Flying Machine, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout - Dumas - Radio, Bomb Vessel Granado, 1742 - Cross Section - Scratchbuild, HMS Victory (Mamoli 1:90), Cutty Sark, Armed Pinnace, Bounty, Santa Maria At another place: Stephenson's Rocket (OcCre 1:24) (click the title to follow the link) In the Gallery: Lancia Armata 1803, Bomb Vessel Granada, 1742 Cross Section, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury S Posted March 19, 2014 Share #446 Posted March 19, 2014 Nice detail Toni. Maury Quote Current diversion: Anchor Hoy c 1815 - 1825 1:48 scale Recent Builds: Fair American: 18th C. Longboat: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/2284-longboat-18th-c-by-maury-modelshipways-by-chuck/ Echo Cross Section: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/513-echo-cross-section-by-maury/ Emma C. Berry http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/gallery/album/203-emma-c-berry-132-pof-by-maury/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlevine Posted March 20, 2014 Author Share #447 Posted March 20, 2014 Thanks gentlemen. And thank you all for the likes. Druxey, you want hammocks, too? Quote Toni Chairman Nautical Research Guild Member Nautical Research and Model Society Member Midwest Model Shipwrights Current Builds: NRG Rigging Project Completed Builds: Longboat - 1:48 scale HMS Atalanta-1775 - 1:48 scale Half Hull Planking Project Capstan Project Swallow 1779 - 1:48 scale Echo Cross Section Gallery: Hannah - 1:36 scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted March 20, 2014 Share #448 Posted March 20, 2014 I got a US $1 that says he does.. I'm surprised Remco hasn't done them. gjdale 1 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remcohe Posted March 20, 2014 Share #449 Posted March 20, 2014 I got a US $1 that says he does.. I'm surprised Remco hasn't done them. I'm like 1 year of work behind Tony before I get to the hammock battens. No worries, I'll take it into consideration gjdale, robbl and mtaylor 3 Quote Treat each part as if it is a model on its own, you will finish more models in a day than others do in a lifetime. Current build HMS Kingfisher MSW 1.0 log click here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted March 20, 2014 Share #450 Posted March 20, 2014 I'm like 1 year of work behind Tony before I get to the hammock battens. No worries, I'll take it into consideration Ok.. but remember, it has to come from Druxey. I'm just a bookie making a side bet. Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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