kruginmi Posted April 19, 2020 Author Share #31 Posted April 19, 2020 I feel like I am posting the same pics over and over again but there are HOURS of work in between. This series is called 'Almost There' haha. I am thinking another solid day and this just may be. Did some sculpting of the stern (again) but pretty complete. I still need to add a block below the wing transom to allow shaping of the stern and better attachment for planking. The bow is pretty set, with the exception of the bow block (same purpose) and a few other minor details. I (of course) got messed up with the railing height (my template meant for above the false deck, started to apply without it so......some 'repairs' are required. Final shaping of the bulkhead bevels are soon to come. This process has been very educational (and frustrating) but getting back into the groove needed some re-education. I am looking forward to the next step of a good set of drawn plans and then a full POB build to validate. Stay Building My Friends, Mark Edwardkenway, Omega1234, ccoyle and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted April 19, 2020 Share #32 Posted April 19, 2020 Brilliant Stuff Mark .. As Usual !! I do like your builds.. Love what you are doing with the available plans.. Sure are giving me food for though as there is a local boat (Arklow Yawl) I was thinking about modelling but there are no plans, there was a full size reconstruction about 30 years ago (since broken up) but I never cared for the shape (Topsides too high out of the water).. I may be able to locate those plans and adapt them to photos of the actual vessels from C 1900's.. have a few regular builds to do first though as my skills wouldn't be in your league ! All The Very Best.. Eamonn mtaylor and kruginmi 2 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 19, 2020 Author Share #33 Posted April 19, 2020 Come on In Eamonn - the water's fine! I don't know about that 'league' comment - given the number of missteps and do overs I have done HaHa. I came out of the initial draw up phase pretty confident I had knocked it out of the park - boy that is funny. Here's hoping that when I do the full POB the same voyage of discovery won't be retaken LOL. When you do a Frankenstein build though, no one can 'really' criticize you since you are doing a what if. Well, they can criticize but you don't have to listen! Thanks for the kind comments, I will buy you a beverage of your choice should ever we meet. -Mark egkb and mtaylor 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted April 19, 2020 Share #34 Posted April 19, 2020 Will take you up on that drink if we are even in each others neck of the woods ! Stay Well E mtaylor and kruginmi 2 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 20, 2020 Author Share #35 Posted April 20, 2020 I think I am left with beveling the lower frames, and adding a block at the extreme fore and aft for plank affixing. Maybe this afternoon. Added a false keel. Had to cleave off the keel forward of the scarph joint (don't ask) so vertical line at V7F frame is this fix (ignore). Everything appears ship shape and to plan. Making templates coming up..... egkb, gieb8688, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 21, 2020 Author Share #36 Posted April 21, 2020 (edited) Alright, think I am at the end of the road for this prototype. All outer bulkhead bevels added and the blocks shaped fore and aft. I am not beveling the deck portion on this build. I did have to add a 1/16" skin to a section of one bulkhead but other than that, everything worked out. The blocks I kept putting off thinking they will require lots of carving, sanding and other. In my mind they had grown into 1" by 3" by 5" monsters. The truth very different. Pretty straightforward. I might add some dowels through the keel to keep it in place. -Mark Edited April 21, 2020 by kruginmi Clarification of bevels added bruce d, egkb, tkay11 and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share #37 Posted April 23, 2020 Next step is to capture all the deltas in a new profile drawing (to include false deck and planking). It is important that all the prototype measurements align with this capture (as much as possible - there is a deck slope port and starboard). Once satisfied, I will start capturing the bulkhead profiles. These will include fore and aft profiles per (capturing bevel amounts). This will be the master to create the exploded component view - keel, fore&aft bulkhead, and eventually slot depths. Whoops - Forgot to add the false keel. Probably raise the height of the aft stem more into the hull (specific name escapes me at the moment). mtaylor, egkb, bruce d and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share #38 Posted April 23, 2020 Interesting question I had was how to draw this profile. I basically considered it a slice right through the middle of the boat. However, a side effect of this (with the deck camber) is that the railings shown should be reduced in height by about a planks height. If you look at the top of the quarterdeck you can see the delineation of the planking, then the false deck, then the underlying fore and aft bulkhead. By lowering the railings it would look like the railings are not on the same level with the quarterdeck which would be in error. Interesting. An option would be to omit the railing entirely but that might lead you to think the main deck was just like the quarterdeck (just flush). Just as the top down view shows a width to the widest point, which depending on the tumblehome, can be in a variety of locations. Drawing a set of plans for the first time has been very enlightening and I have a greater respect for the process. I think this reliance on just one view sometimes led to the issues I identified (and fixed) with the prototype. To jump start the bearding line I drew the main keel a plank's width below the lowest part of the bulkheads. The primary bulkhead will be an 1/8" while the keel will be 1/4" thick. My thought is that this will make planking cleaner. In fact, all planking can be done prior to the affixing of the keel itself (remember POB). Question: Should I keep it like this or move the thickness of the keel up to the bulkheads to allow the bulkhead to have the bearding line custom cut? mtaylor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 25, 2020 Author Share #39 Posted April 25, 2020 Realizing you have no idea what is in the basswood stash. So pulled out the big pieces and organized. this does not include the containers of smaller pieces. egkb, bruce d, GrandpaPhil and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted April 25, 2020 Share #40 Posted April 25, 2020 Hey Mark.. Ye USA Folks are so lucky, do you have any idea how difficult it is for us lot on this side of the pond to get specific Timber, always sounds like 'I'll just nip down to the Corner Shop and pick up some Holly Strips and maybe grab a coffee.. us lot over here literally have to go to our nearest Garden Centre and pick up some Holly Seeds, then wait a few decades .. Explains why my Ballier is taking sooo long lol Not Even A Bit Envious Of Your Stash Now where did I put that Acorn ... ... .. . Eamonn coxswain, kruginmi, tkay11 and 1 other 4 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 25, 2020 Author Share #41 Posted April 25, 2020 All basswood Eamonn. Wood frowned upon by many people for this hobby but it can be found (milled) in a few stores around here (in normal times). Knowing its strengths (and weaknesses) can lead to successful use. I pick up a piece here and there to spread out the cost over time, only way I could do this hobby. Druid is 96% basswood. I do have a limited supply of boxwood for the more detailed carving pieces (trim, figures, etc). It is nice to be able to run out if you are short a piece or two I agree. Mark GrandpaPhil, egkb, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 25, 2020 Author Share #42 Posted April 25, 2020 (edited) On to the next step of actually building a full hull (though POB). I need to use the frames on the 1/2 hull as templates for the full hull. However, they only show half a frame. Can't flip them over because they are beveled. You could do a bunch of drawing and meticulous duplication or.......make templates. Templates make sense for a number of reasons - need an accurate portrayal of what was built, need to transfer to plans, need to transfer to at least one build, need to remake bulkheads that are screwed up (highly likely). So I took some 1/32" basswood and traced both the forward and aft of each frame onto it. Then I cut close to the line. To finish, I affixed to the frame itself and sanded to shape. For the purists, yes, this introduces a 'small' inaccuracy, however it is well within the tolerances I find acceptable. The reason the deck side was not beveled was to allow these two templates to be aligned exactly in the ‘y’ direction. When you overlay these two templates the bevel introduced is readily seen: This gives you a great indication of what will be required sanding wise. Each frame will be handled this way, then the biggest template for each frame can be used on both sides of a centerline to truly mirror image the frame. The power of my 1/2 hull construction can be seen in its deconstruction: Using the designed bulkhead spine I have also rubber cemented the requirements onto the 1/8" board: It will take a little time to get all these templates knocked out but using 1/32" basswood is pretty fast. Hoping in the next day or two to start getting some full bulkheads cut out and slotted. -Mark Edited April 25, 2020 by kruginmi Clarification on using deck edge for alignment (not beveled) egkb, bruce d, gieb8688 and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted April 26, 2020 Share #43 Posted April 26, 2020 17 hours ago, egkb said: Hey Mark.. Ye USA Folks are so lucky, do you have any idea how difficult it is for us lot on this side of the pond to get specific Timber, always sounds like 'I'll just nip down to the Corner Shop and pick up some Holly Strips and maybe grab a coffee.. us lot over here literally have to go to our nearest Garden Centre and pick up some Holly Seeds, then wait a few decades .. Explains why my Ballier is taking sooo long lol Not Even A Bit Envious Of Your Stash Now where did I put that Acorn ... ... .. . Eamonn Even here in the States, woods other than basswood (lime) and bulsa have be special ordered. Go to the Wood Discussion area. I believe there are some exotic wood places in the UK or at least accessible online for you to use. And some woods are just getting impossible to find. egkb and kruginmi 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted April 26, 2020 Share #44 Posted April 26, 2020 Thanks Mark (Oregon Mark) .. I think I'll do that .. Will just plant that Acorn .. You Know.. Just In Case Can't even easily pick up a nice display board over here (Ireland) without getting completely specialised (having to have a saw mill in the back shed) and/or costing a fair chunk of the National Debt But I guess it's a case of the grass always looks greener .. etc Oh Well ! It's weird to think that most of our native hardwood forests etc went to build the Navy vessels a lot of us model on here and at that quiet a lot literally went past my front door (I live very near Arklow's once thriving local harbour) All The Very Best & Please Stay Safe and Well Eamonn PS Those Templates are looking Well Mark (Michigan Mark) kruginmi and mtaylor 2 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 26, 2020 Author Share #45 Posted April 26, 2020 Well, it has been a long time coming, but I think I have the outer hull dimensions complete with good tracings to use. Now to forge ahead and start getting these full bulkheads cut out. Also, on the off time, make up a good set of plans for the future. GrandpaPhil, mtaylor, bruce d and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 28, 2020 Author Share #46 Posted April 28, 2020 (edited) Well, if I didn't know better I would think I know what I am doing LOL. I finally have a sheet of bulkhead plans that I am confident with for posterity. I cleaned up my drafting table prior and filed quite a stack of previous designs getting to this point. Pretty happy with that. Also uncovered my early on profile shot. The masting is all drawn out and triple checked on a separate drawing. What is seen here is pretty close. A pretty good day on my day 'off'. Found out my supply of 3/16" wood is only good for a couple of full bulkheads and currently have no way to get more easily. I might work on consolidating the masting designs onto a similar sized sheet for copying in the future. I also need to create a good Title Block for each page. Stay Safe, Mark Edited April 28, 2020 by kruginmi Incomplete sentence egkb, mtaylor, bruce d and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted April 28, 2020 Share #47 Posted April 28, 2020 Depending on what wood you need, do some Googling. There's lots of places still open online and will ship. kruginmi 1 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 28, 2020 Author Share #48 Posted April 28, 2020 Thanks Mark. Really hoping some places around here will be open by the weekend. Time will tell. Enough work to do on other things in the meantime. -Mark mtaylor and Matt D 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted April 30, 2020 Author Share #49 Posted April 30, 2020 It is getting real people. How many find drafting relaxing? I really enjoy this part. bruce d, mtaylor, GrandpaPhil and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted April 30, 2020 Share #50 Posted April 30, 2020 Those Drawings could be art in themselves Mark .. Worthy of Framing with the Model .. Can almost see them now, lightly stained with a Tea Bag and some foxing here and there by Coffee Grounds .. Giving a nice Ye Olde feel All The Very Best Mate Eamonn kruginmi and mtaylor 2 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted May 3, 2020 Author Share #51 Posted May 3, 2020 Working through the data. I have the original ship plans but a number of things have been replaced / upgraded and/or changed. So you use the original data as a start, then figure out everything else. I still discover things seemingly every time I look at a photo I have taken. Biggest a-ha for me is the amount of wrap (copper and leather) used to keep chaffing and wear to a minimum. Never had thought about it in depth before. Makes a lot of sense, but most buried under rigging and never seen. The masting will definitely fit on a 18 x 24 inch piece of paper. This will make duplication pretty straightforward. Still need further work on the main mast, main boom and gaff. And now that I look at them, probably need titles for each component (for people not as sophisticated as us - haha). mcpwilk, gieb8688, mtaylor and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share #52 Posted May 4, 2020 I have been doing some quality control checks. First issue is how to capture the correct diameter dimensions. In 1:48 scale 3" is 1/16 inch. So I decided to add a table per masting piece defining key actual dimensions. This does impact the drawn sheet - where and how to put. Secondly some of the added information looks confusing to me at first glance. Now that it is in front of me I have a bunch of "Wish that I had done it another way." Third, looking at the actual pics of the ship I see additional details that contradict the actual plans that I didn't see before. For instance, where the yard arms transition from octagonal to circular. So....on to version 2, I am going to redraw this sheet. No wasted effort, it is a process. It will be worth it in the end. mtaylor, egkb and bruce d 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share #53 Posted May 5, 2020 Current updated plan status. Advice / comments welcome. The big issue I had was the inability to properly give diameters correctly. Lengths are easier to show at this scale. So I tried to draw them better (within the tolerance available) but also provided the full size dimensions at key areas. There are also areas that they use alternate methods to build (such as the yard arms) that yield discrepancies with 1800 build practices. For each case I weight the pros and cons. Most of the time I tweek to look more original (I have changed the whole lower hull for Pete's sake LOL). Cheers - Mark bruce d, mtaylor, egkb and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted May 7, 2020 Author Share #54 Posted May 7, 2020 After some very focused effort I have reached a good conclusion (until I start seeing all the errors LOL). Still have some annotation to do (copper wraps and such) but pretty happy right now. The GAFF and Main Boom: The Yards: Finally a look at the whole thing: And yes, Eamonn, will be looking for making some copies and probably hang one at work at least. After putting in a title block. Mark GrandpaPhil, egkb, mtaylor and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egkb Posted May 10, 2020 Share #55 Posted May 10, 2020 Should Look Brilliant Framed Up Mark .. E kruginmi and mtaylor 2 Quote Current Build : HM Schooner Ballahoo In the Pipeline : HM Cutter Sherbourne, HM Mortar Convulsion, Emma C Berry & C18th English Longboat.. Eventually That Is..🙄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kruginmi Posted May 10, 2020 Author Share #56 Posted May 10, 2020 Still have some time on my hands (haha) so worked up the detail page for the hull innards. Still a few notations to make but the pieces, dimensions and how they fit together should make sense. The only other page I 'have' to make is one showing the outside / finished details in both profile and deck. I have already worked these up on separate drawings. These four pages and the rigging book should document my build adequately. Hopefully highlight the last page in a couple of days. Also need to ponder the imponderables and think what I could add. Like I just thought a good rear design drawing is needed. Stay Building My Friends - Mark GrandpaPhil, mtaylor, coxswain and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archjofo Posted June 23, 2020 Share #57 Posted June 23, 2020 Fantastic work ! mtaylor 1 Quote Best regards Johann Video: La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette of 1827 - naval artillery La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - Construction of long boat La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - Construction of the masts La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - 2019 La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - standing rigging - part 1 La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - standing rigging - part 2 La Créole - Scale 1/48, French corvette - standing rigging - part 3 See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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