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ObviousNewbie

HMS Terror by ObviousNewbie - Occre - Scale 1:75 - First wooden ship build

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2 hours ago, mtdoramike said:

Beautiful job on the deck and work so far, but I would suggest adding some blocks of wood in-between the hull framing to expand the frame edge area to help give the planking a smoother appearance when applied and will make planking a lot easier.

mike

Thnx for the tip, so basically get some balsa wood and sand it into shape after inserting it between the bulkheads?

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Yes, you don't need to completely fill the gap, but with the amount of space between those frames would make it more difficult to plank.  

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Some testing today, tried out the colourless matt varnish as well as the brown stain:

IMG_6654.thumb.JPG.240f1fe88279390b4c3bafe0e69e1356.JPG

First coat for both colours. I really like the brown stain, after one coat it gives this warm dark tint without hiding the wood structure. The colourless one is, well invisible 🙂 Coated the deck with a first coat of colourless, while giving the test batch a second layer. I am going to use the dark brown on the sides of the bulwarks and the inside of the mirror. Waiting for everything to dry and then: attaching the deck to the hull..

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Busy week last week, managed to do some work nonetheless.. And my first blunder 🙂

 

After testing the varnish, I planned to move ahead: glueing the deck on the bulkheads, bending, painting and attaching the bulwarks. First experiences with the CA glue were... interesting. Mind you, I got the thin CA, which was not really suited for attaching the deck. Friend of mine gave me some advice to try this out:

 

IMG_6655.thumb.jpeg.b2e0efe80963149cc05411a92a8117ce.jpeg

CA glue, but a gel, easy to apply even with a spatula if necessary. In short, good stuff. After some tests I attached the deck without any issue. Next up, bending the bulwarks.  Did a lot of reading and asked for advice (thnx Wahka_est!) and went for it: put the 2 bulwarks in piping hot water and let soak for an hour. Then bending them around a tin can:

 

IMG_6664.thumb.jpeg.678de640b511b630b33d4095e0e09f24.jpeg

Worked like a charm... But after allowing them to dry I realised I apparently choose to neglect my marks on the wood and bent both bulwarks in the same direction. After a brief moment of panic and a dash to find the Occre support contact, decided to simply put the wood back in the water, and try and bend it the other way. To my surprise, not a minute after re-immersing the bulwark in the water, the curve straightened itself out. Let it soak, bent it carefully the other way, let dry.  What a material, you try doing that with plastic 🙂

 

After varnishing the bent bulwarks, planned the assembly to the hull. Stern fitted perfectly, some CA was going to be needed for the front, and here we are:IMG_6695.thumb.jpeg.25f0ed724df8295bdb12200065643822.jpegIMG_6694.thumb.jpeg.054b9579ece847752ed6486ba4412695.jpeg

Far from perfect, but a good first try, I think. I'm going to let the hull dry overnight and then fairing commences 🙂

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Really nice job! Coming along really good!

 

With planking use the same tin can, seems like perfect for the job :).

Bend evening dose of planks overnight. I usually put like 10-15 planks there for overnight. Had electric bender but didnt use that.

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Hi all, quick question: I've been experimenting with sanding/fairing in preparation for the first layer planking, trying out a pin pusher (works really well), and the plank bender.  Test fitted one plank:

IMG_6698.thumb.JPG.944a1e0078836cc9baa2d2744897834f.JPG

Now the question: the plank fits snugly with the bulwark, but as you can see I didn't sand that much. So what has priority: maximum contact between plank and bulkhead (and sand off the excess bulwark later) OR alignment with the bulwark and lesser contact? (Test fitting came a bit loose, but trust me, the plank fitted 🙂 )

IMG_6699.thumb.JPG.1f9c053acf71254eea9042acfd6210b9.JPG

 

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I would say both are important. You will sand youself nuts later. Its ok it planks go over a bulwark a bit then you have room for sanding and getting it nice. If its same line with bulwark then you might sand bulwark off also too much.

 

You still have a oppertounity to add extra pieces under planks that was suggested before-then you have more contact.

regarding nails-try changeing those to pin that i used. And dont install it trough olank but on the sude so it pushes planks together-try it if it suits you(you might not like it.

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Well, the planks align as they are now, I'm worried the planks will recess too much and I'll need to attack the bulwark with my sander.

 

Tried the pins you used to attach the bulwarks to the hull, maybe they're the wrong kind, but I had difficulty insetting them into the wood, nails seem to work better for me. But thnx for the tip, I will use them for other stages in the build, I'm sure.

 

Regarding the balsa wood, I'm a bit of two minds, as so far no build log or video has shown them being used. With your experience, why would you use them, if you had to do it again?

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Balsa would give more contact surface for the planks and also would follow the hulls curves more.

they are not shown in video but are widely used by builders. If you look the video then front of the ship is basicly done like that with plywood. But offcourse its your decision-only sugestion.

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Hi all,

 

First planking is finished!

IMG_6743.thumb.JPG.446d5328c3a226198c98907ac9301a9a.JPG

IMG_6746.thumb.JPG.feae07c961b23fa52aa0bcad554e2de0.JPG

 

Again, this is my first time, so be gentle 🙂 . Used a combo of plank bending pliers for the easy bends, and steam for the garboard and the planks lower to the keel. The advice I read over here: "Treat every plank as it's own project", helped.

 

Made some mistakes I will need to correct during sanding and filling, most notably on the bow, where I did not bend the planks enough:

IMG_6745.thumb.JPG.d96ee196373482a687079e076dd125b4.JPG

Will think about how to solve this later, but any advice is welcome!

 

Started sanding as well:

IMG_6744.thumb.JPG.a7b738370902503c2b2b927a5bd3c48e.JPG

Question:

From the Occre videos, I saw the heads of the nails need to be filed down. 1) What is the best tool for this? and 2) How much do the nails need to be sanded down? Tried on a row with some sanding paper:

IMG_6740.thumb.JPG.da56a43eeb36810530d01b08e46e9cb2.JPG

Top row is sanded, bottom row not sanded. Is this enough, or do the nails really need to be flush? Quick note: there's a thin layer of second planking coming on top of this, not sure how much that will show nail bump-wise.

 

As always, thnx for your input! 

IMG_6741.JPG

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37 minutes ago, ObviousNewbie said:

Is this enough, or do the nails really need to be flush?

Yep, they really should be flush, which is why I don't use them. If not flush, that thin second-layer planking will want to show the underlying bumps. Do you have a rotary tool, like a Dremel? You might want to try some kind of grinding attachment to get those taken down easier -- sandpaper alone, as you no doubt have realized, will just want to remove the softer surrounding wood.

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Hi,

 

Not bad for first time planking.

I felt my nails half out so i could remove them. If your gluing is good then remove the nails. Much easier on the sanding.

 

Wahka

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16 hours ago, ccoyle said:

Yep, they really should be flush, which is why I don't use them. If not flush, that thin second-layer planking will want to show the underlying bumps. Do you have a rotary tool, like a Dremel? You might want to try some kind of grinding attachment to get those taken down easier -- sandpaper alone, as you no doubt have realized, will just want to remove the softer surrounding wood.

Thnx for that advice, MR. Coyle. Indeed, I stopped sanding very quickly when I saw the result of working on the nails. I do have a Dremel with a hose attachment, so will try that out on some test nails later today. I can fiddle out some of the nails, but removing them all is going to damage the planks too much in some places I fear.

1 hour ago, Wahka_est said:

Hi,

 

Not bad for first time planking.

I felt my nails half out so i could remove them. If your gluing is good then remove the nails. Much easier on the sanding.

 

Wahka

Thnx for the support 🙂 Glue is holding on the nails I removed, but some are just too deep to be taken out without damaging the wood. Will try the Dremel approach later today. As Belgium will be put on lockdown due to the Corona virus as of midday today, I think I'll have plenty of time on my hands...

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Great progress. I too left some nails in and had to use a Dremel grinder bit.  BTW, parts F44 and F45 are listed as sapelli but are actually the ramin strips.  I had sent occre a question about this. They really do respond quickly. 

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Hi all, it seems I do have more time on my hands: as the nails kept bothering me, instead of putting the Dremel on them I decided to remove them completely, and manually. That took some time, but here's the result:

 

IMG_6761.thumb.JPG.9b7187994de93244189a4255751c5ec4.JPG

A more smoother surface, and about 300 nails recuperated 🙂

 

Sanding has commenced, starting with the bow:

IMG_6760.thumb.JPG.82361ebbdc4674b8fd65e204ba5cab23.JPG

That was... interesting 🙂 As the plans call for straight pieces of plywood to be stacked and then sanded down, I used the Dremel with the hose to get the chunck off, before moving to the finer finish with the sanding blocks. I really need some Dremel 101 because I managed to make 2 small dents in the bow wood on the starboard side, which I can fill with wood filler of course (got my hands on that before the lockdown went into effect). Another lesson learned.

 

After that manual sanding, and I found the P180 is doing a much better job than the P60 I was using before. Conitued using that on the hull:

IMG_6764.thumb.JPG.bf9891dc5300e051ff4950dd7d7bb545.JPG

Still a working progress, but am I correct in assuming there's 3 phases to hull sanding:

 

1: Basic levelling, exposing areas that cannot be sanded down and need to be filled with wood filler

2: Use the wood filler

3: Sand down the wood filler and finalise.

 

Also, I found the best way to discover unevenness is to use your fingers and go by touch. That led to some strange looks from the Admiral and the Rear-Admiral (17-year old daughter) 🙂 Am I missing a technique I haven't read about?

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Posted (edited)

I don't think you're missing anything! My experience at this stage was the same: I could feel bumps that I couldn't see. I used a sanding block where possible and some other bits of round scrap with sandpaper glued to it on the convex parts at the rear of the hull. That first layer of wood is quite thick, so you can sand the heck out of it to make sure everything is smooth and the curves all run fair from bow to stern. It's a lot of work but if you miss a bump or a bulge, one day when the sun hits the model in just the right way you'll see it and it will drive you nuts. I think running your hands over it is the best way to see that the curves are fair.

 

If you have wood-filler, you may find you need some to fill in some gaps in the planking, but I would advise that you just sand and sand and sand first. In my experience if you overdo it with the filler you'll get a satisfactory surface before you have really finished shaping the hull. You can take off a lot of material on that first layer of planking without sanding through it!

 

Take what I say with a grain of salt though- I've inly built one of these things myself.

 

Edited by Keith S

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After a lot of sanding and corrections with wood putty and then some more sanding, I think we're there:

IMG_6769.thumb.JPG.68d7d2f6de733c597251affebbb4d7f5.JPG

Had to do some major work on port side because of the Dremel Incident and some misaligned strips of wood the were too low to just sand flush. Filled up some of the bigger holes, repaired a misalignment on the stern, got the lower bow sorted out and cleaned up the shipyard 🙂

 

Aaaand I'm stuck.. Next step would be second layer of planking, but as I don't have any cobbler's glue, and the stores that sell it are all shut, I can't just pop out and get some. Will keep my eye open in the supermarket to see what they have. Thought of continuing with other parts of the ship, but I don't have the paint for the masts yet, and I don't want to start on the small items of the superstructure because I know myself: these things need to be built and glued into place before they go missing/get damaged. So I'm on hold for a couple of days.

 

I hope you're all doing well and keeping healthy in these weird times..

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Nice progress. Nownit really looks like a ship-thats a good feeling when you het there. 

After 2nd planking you will start treating like a baby cause its so beautiful and smooth-you just slightly move your hand over it and feel proud as hell for the first build. I constatly rannto Admiral also to show her my work :) 


If i may then one suggestion-it looks like it might need more sanding... Regarding glue-use pva. Instarted with superglue but result was terrible. Pva and piece of cloth to remove extra glue works like a charm. At bow and stern use some little amount of super glue to keep it positioned. Just a suggestion from experience.

 

Keep up with good work! Any eues on second build yet?

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Thnx for your comments! I know, I've been feeling her all the time, looking for edges to sand off, in the meantime being astounded that something as simple as sanding paper can really sculpt a shape into it. She feels smoother than she looks, but I'm going to go over her with some P240 to smoothen even more.

 

Interesting, I had the same idea when it came to second planking😄 . Saw some videos online where the guy used pins to set the veneer, but when I tested that the veneer just split, so that's a no go. Probably the pins I'm using are too wide. Will try that out later today.

 

As for the second one, although it's early days, I still feel I'm hooked, so looking at something else already: either the Occre Beagle, or when I'm feeling very ambitious, the Occre NS Mercedes. But let's finish this one first 🙂 Seems though stock is running out on these kits pretty fast, so I might move too buy and then stock until the time is right...

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I wound up regretting that I had used cobbler's glue (contact cement) on mine. Every now and then, a board springs loose on mine. The "wood prep" solution I applied prior to staining seemed to loosen it up. It's not a tragedy but is somewhat annoying. I think you're better off with the PVA if I'm honest.

 

When you get to the stage where you are ready to mark out the location of the ice-chocks (the broad band of planking that looks like a bumper), consider placing it 5mm lower than the measurement depicted in the plans. If you look carefully at pictures of the completed model, you'll see a discrepancy. It's easy to spot if you look at the placement of the small metal panel beneath the first opening in the bulwark back from the bow. I wrote to OCCRE and they confirmed that the measurement in the instructions is a typo.

 

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Thnx Keith! (The name is Robert, by the way 🙂 ) Very helpful indeed, I'm keeping this link for when I get closer to the deadeyes. Looked at the pictures on both the site and the box, and indeed, there is a discrepancy, best item to see that are the catheads. Thnx for the heads-up, will keep that in mind when I start on the bumpers!

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Posted (edited)

Hi Robert! Here is the measurement in the plans I am referring to. This "15mm" should be 20mm. You can tell by looking at the planks above it-  they are 5mm wide and there are four of them. Like I said I emailed OCCRE and they acknowledged it's a typo. It doesn't make a lot of difference but I am always looking at my model compared to pictures of the model made by Matthew Betts and the shipyard drawings, and I spotted the error. I had to tear off my chock channels and do them over. 

CC9BB4E3-85CD-4780-8620-AE0443C83CD0.jpeg

Edited by Keith S

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Yep, that's where I got the 15mm from. I should study Matthew Betts' site a bit more in detail, did he even finish the model? I read it was 1/48th scale, but he got delayed when they hired him as an expert on the TV show..

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He deliberately stopped working on the model when it got to the stage where it looked like a shipyard model- I gather that the shipwright or designer in the old days would prepare a model for the Navy, before building the actual ship, which had some basic details but not fully built. Matthew Betts says in his blog that he took his model to this level of completion because it was going to be displayed alongside an actual shipwright's model of Erebus from 1829. 

 

I get the impression that when the model is returned to him, he intends to continue the model to a higher degree of completion. You can see on his blog that he's done a lot more research on parts that do not appear on his ship as she currently stands. I presume that's because he's got more he wants to do.

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