James H Posted May 30, 2020 Author Share #61 Posted May 30, 2020 53 minutes ago, BobG said: Thanks Chris for your reply. I haven't worked much with white metal so I respect your choice for using wood. The grapnels on the Medway Longboat by Syren were also made from wood as were things like the the pintles and gudgeons. I was able to make them look more like metal by painting them with Vallejo black acrylic and then using some Doc O'Briens Rusty Brown Weathering Powder lightly on them. That burnished them to look quite like metal. So I think this would work well for the anchors on the Flirt too. I have actually used iron pigment on them since painting too. JeffT and BobG 2 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted May 30, 2020 Share #62 Posted May 30, 2020 I’m totally stealing the blue paint. Then Flirt will somewhat match my Pegasus. Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted May 31, 2020 Share #63 Posted May 31, 2020 So there will be no Flirt build logs, James has set the bar too high 😂✅🤣 Ishmael and Jonny 007 2 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share #64 Posted June 24, 2020 Ok, this will be my last log update before I post the finished photos in a few weeks. I'm now on the rigging stage, but thought I'd keep you up to date with what to expect of HMS Flirt, when the kit is released. Flirt will come with an optional launch, except for the Master Shipwright version which will have it as standard. This is built on an upside down jig and planked into 1mm x 2mm pear strips and then fitted out, including anchors, rudder, pikes, oars etc. I admit I loathe making these little things, but I'm happy with the result! The launch will only temporarily sat on the model as it will be removed for the kit instructions and box art. Now it's time to concentrate my efforts on the lower mast tops. These are different in size, so it's important not to get them mixed up, as I almost did! All mast sections are now tapered, squared-off etc. and then test fitted. More woodwork as the yards and booms are made. When finished, all parts are coated with polyurethane varnish and then masked before areas are sprayed in Plastikote Black. A further coat of varnish is applied over the black areas so they have the same sheen as the bare timber. Mast bands etc. are added using black cartridge paper. The masts and yards can finally be fitted out with blocks. Rigging begins with the bowsprit, spritsail boom and boomkins. This differs a lot to the Speedy kit. Note also there is no flying jibboom on Flirt. There are different, significant changes between Flirt as she's depicted in her early rigging style, and the later rig depicted in the Speedy kit. The masts are then drilled to accept the yard pins which will help keep everything in place whilst I rig. The yards are only temporarily fitted for this post. The masts are then glued into position, pending the shrouds being fitted. Catch you when I've rigged her... 😆 ccoyle, DavidM, coxswain and 22 others 25 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mugje Posted June 24, 2020 Share #65 Posted June 24, 2020 It would be great if that nice little launch could be bought as a seperate kit so you can use it on different ships. It think there is a good market for! Great progress on the Flirt! Curious at the end result! BobG, VTHokiEE and Edwardkenway 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share #66 Posted June 24, 2020 47 minutes ago, mugje said: It would be great if that nice little launch could be bought as a seperate kit so you can use it on different ships. It think there is a good market for! Great progress on the Flirt! Curious at the end result! Maybe @chris watton can verify about the launch? Lovely model, and sits comfortably on my worktop.....unlike the Victory which will eventually sit there! mugje, BobG and coxswain 3 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 24, 2020 Share #67 Posted June 24, 2020 The 18 foot cutter will soon be available to buy as a separate part very soon, it will include all laser cut wood, PE and 2x1mm wood strip for the planking, but need to sort out separate instructions for the mini build.. VTHokiEE, BobG, JeffT and 4 others 7 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobG Posted June 24, 2020 Share #68 Posted June 24, 2020 I really like this ship. Is the approximate release date still late July or August? Quote Bob Garcia "Measure once, cuss twice!" Current Builds: Hms Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 - Vanguard Models Pen Duick - Artesania Latina 1:28 Completed: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Co. Member of the Nautical Research Guild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted June 24, 2020 Share #69 Posted June 24, 2020 3 hours ago, BobG said: I really like this ship. Is the approximate release date still late July or August? Yes, I am just waiting for the finished model to complete the box art and manual. BobG, hollowneck, Kevin and 4 others 7 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share #70 Posted June 24, 2020 6 minutes ago, chris watton said: Yes, I am just waiting for the finished model to complete the box art and manual. No pressure then 😆 BobG, Jonny 007, Kevin and 2 others 5 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffT Posted June 24, 2020 Share #71 Posted June 24, 2020 18 minutes ago, James H said: No pressure then 😆 no pressure at all. get er done 🙂 hollowneck 1 Quote Jeff In progress: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Company -1/2" scale USS Constitution - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Granado - CAF Model - 1:48 HMS Sphinx - Vanguard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobG Posted June 24, 2020 Share #72 Posted June 24, 2020 26 minutes ago, James H said: No pressure then 😆 ...the MSW posse is getting restless!! 😎 hollowneck 1 Quote Bob Garcia "Measure once, cuss twice!" Current Builds: Hms Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 - Vanguard Models Pen Duick - Artesania Latina 1:28 Completed: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Co. Member of the Nautical Research Guild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted June 24, 2020 Share #73 Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, James H said: No pressure then 😆 Here we are...just sitting and waiting...money in hand...just need James to finish... just sitting and waiting...😂🤣😂 BobG and Jonny 007 2 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share #74 Posted July 9, 2020 Well, this is it folks, it's all done. It's taken me just under 11 weeks from start to finish, and that's around 10 days longer than I planned, simply because I've had to re-learn rigging again. The last time I did a fully-rigged warship was about 13yrs ago, so I was just a little rusty. I rigged this model in about 12 or 13 days, in total. I actually re-learned swear words that I'd also long forgotten. I have cut corners, there's no doubt, but that's more through necessity as I know Chris needed to get this kit sorted. Ordering the boxes is by far one of the longest jobs when it comes to wait times. But I can tell you that the model will now be available in early August (tentatively), and in standard and Master Shipwright editions. Please ignore the strange rear shroud line in this first photo. They don't cross. It was just me moving blocks etc. And here is the finished model, in various angles. Remember that the launch is only in one shot for effect as that will only be included in the Master Shipwright edition, and not shown on the box art. And here's the manual's cover... For me now, it's a very short break before I plough into the Amati Victory which I've just been told is being kitted for me at this moment. Hope you liked the Flirt build! I know it's abridged, but you can see the full manual in the kit Siegfried, coxswain, JeffT and 26 others 29 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Posted July 9, 2020 Share #75 Posted July 9, 2020 Nicely done Jim!!! 😀 chris watton 1 Quote Chuck Passaro - MSW Admin Sloop Speedwell - POF scratch Block Island Boat - POF scratch HMS Winchelsea - POB scratch build HM Cutter Cheerful - POB scratch build Royal Barge - POF scratch Medway Longboat- POF Scratch SYREN SHIP MODEL COMPANY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzdal Posted July 9, 2020 Share #76 Posted July 9, 2020 10 minutes ago, James H said: I actually re-learned swear words that I'd also long forgotten I'm was getting worried that the Flirt was being forgotten with in the Victory. I want to Flirt around as soon as I've finished Lady Eleanor. Since the Victory has a bit more rigging then the Flirt and if your worried about not having enough swear words, I'd be happy to translate your list into to french. Am waiting with a great deal of expectation, as I am sure are many others, on your Victory build. Je vous souhaite la meilleure construction possible. Richard James H and BobG 2 Quote Richard Current build : Victory cross section / DeAgostini, Lady Eleanor / Vanguard Models Other builds : N scale computer controlled model railroad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobG Posted July 9, 2020 Share #77 Posted July 9, 2020 Beautiful build, James! This may well be my first ship with guns. glbarlow and VTHokiEE 2 Quote Bob Garcia "Measure once, cuss twice!" Current Builds: Hms Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 - Vanguard Models Pen Duick - Artesania Latina 1:28 Completed: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Co. Member of the Nautical Research Guild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted July 9, 2020 Share #78 Posted July 9, 2020 Such amazing work James. When I do my build log how about I just use your photos since I can’t match your quality🤣😂 Do you mind my asking, is building And photographing models your work, or are you just this good in your spare time? BobG 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted July 9, 2020 Share #79 Posted July 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, BobG said: be my first ship with guns. Couldn’t choose better for your first, my only issue with this and Speedy is the historically accurate but very tiny guns. I hope you also put Cheerful on your list Bob. BobG 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobG Posted July 9, 2020 Share #80 Posted July 9, 2020 12 minutes ago, glbarlow said: I hope you also put Cheerful on your list Bob. The Cheerful is on the list at some point, Glenn, but I would need some more tools...a table saw at the very least. Quote Bob Garcia "Measure once, cuss twice!" Current Builds: Hms Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 - Vanguard Models Pen Duick - Artesania Latina 1:28 Completed: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Co. Member of the Nautical Research Guild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted July 9, 2020 Share #81 Posted July 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, BobG said: ...a table saw That’s really all you need for Cheerful, but you do need that. Chose the Byrnes saw when you’re ready, best modeling tool I own. BobG 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James H Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share #82 Posted July 9, 2020 44 minutes ago, glbarlow said: Do you mind my asking, is building And photographing models your work, or are you just this good in your spare time? Pretty much. I've been doing book and magazine work for about 10yrs in a lot of international titles, but that was in plastic modelling. I just needed to adapt it to wooden ships, which takes up far more space 😆 EricWilliamMarshall, glbarlow and BobG 3 Quote SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS. KEEP IT REAL! On the bench: HMS Indefatigable - 1794 (production prototype), Vanguard Models - 1:64. On Hold: HMS Winchelsea Double Capstan - Syren Ship Models - 1:48 Finished US Baltimore Armed Privateer Schooner Grecian 1812 (prototype) - Vanguard Models - 1:64 'Zulu' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 Fifie' fishing boat, Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Flirt 1782, Vanguard Models - 1:64. Duchess of Kingston c.1780 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 HMS Sphinx 1775, Vanguard Models - 1:64 ERYCINA - Plymouth Ketch-Rigged Trawler 1882, Vanguard Models - 1:64. 'Nisha' - The Brixham 'Mumble-Bee' - Vanguard Models 1:64 'Saucy Jack' fishing boat - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Ranger 'Barking Fish Carrier' - 1864 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Indeterminate: Tender Avos - Master Korabel - 1:72. H.M.S. Victory (production prototype) - Amati - 1:64. HMS Granado 1742 (cross section) - CAFModel - 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted July 9, 2020 Share #83 Posted July 9, 2020 You're quite handy at doing it - amazing work. More amazing is how little time it takes you to do it! BobG 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris watton Posted July 9, 2020 Share #84 Posted July 9, 2020 OK, I have just finished the Flirt box art, ready to be sent to the printers. I now have to wait until I have the plans, manual and boxes done for me. For the Master Shipwright version of Flirt, I have decided to ditch the maple veneer deck due to high scrap rates, so have ordered 1mm thick maple sheet instead. As soon as that arrives, I can do the MS decks. Everything else is done, laser cut wise, and waiting to go into the boxes... ccoyle, egkb, BobG and 16 others 19 Quote Vanguard Models on Facebook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffT Posted July 9, 2020 Share #85 Posted July 9, 2020 She is a beauty. I don't know how you build so fast 🙂 BobG 1 Quote Jeff In progress: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Company -1/2" scale USS Constitution - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Granado - CAF Model - 1:48 HMS Sphinx - Vanguard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mugje Posted July 9, 2020 Share #86 Posted July 9, 2020 Well done! The model turned out great!! BobG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted July 9, 2020 Share #87 Posted July 9, 2020 Yay! chris watton 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: HMS Winchelsea Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearway Posted July 10, 2020 Share #88 Posted July 10, 2020 another one down the ways well done and great job Keith chris watton 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sjors Posted July 10, 2020 Share #89 Posted July 10, 2020 Ok, i have to ask Anja if I can get my pocketmoney that i get each month I can get it for the whole year! August......mmmm first vacation and then 🙃. It’s a beauty Chris! Sjors chris watton and coxswain 2 Quote Currend builds: USS Constitution by Sjors - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Victory by Sjors - Jotika - Scale 1:72 On hold: VOC Reconnaisance yacht Duyfken by Sjors - Kolderstok - Scale 1:50 Finished builds: HMS Snake (1797) by Sjors - Caldercraft - Scale 1:64 Nuestra Señora del Pilar by Sjors & Anja - OcCre - Scale 1:64 H.M. Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 by Sjors - Vanguard Models - Scale 1:64 HMS Agamemnon by Sjors - Caldercraft / Jotika - 1:64 San Ildefonso - OcCre Le Mirage - Corel Smit Rotterdam (sea tug) - Billing Boats - 1:75 Sovereign of the seas - De Agostini Spirit of Mississippi - OcCre Santissima Trinidad - OcCre Corsair - OcCre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sjors Posted July 10, 2020 Share #90 Posted July 10, 2020 And James (or Jim ) great work! Sjors chris watton 1 Quote Currend builds: USS Constitution by Sjors - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Victory by Sjors - Jotika - Scale 1:72 On hold: VOC Reconnaisance yacht Duyfken by Sjors - Kolderstok - Scale 1:50 Finished builds: HMS Snake (1797) by Sjors - Caldercraft - Scale 1:64 Nuestra Señora del Pilar by Sjors & Anja - OcCre - Scale 1:64 H.M. Brig-Sloop Flirt 1782 by Sjors - Vanguard Models - Scale 1:64 HMS Agamemnon by Sjors - Caldercraft / Jotika - 1:64 San Ildefonso - OcCre Le Mirage - Corel Smit Rotterdam (sea tug) - Billing Boats - 1:75 Sovereign of the seas - De Agostini Spirit of Mississippi - OcCre Santissima Trinidad - OcCre Corsair - OcCre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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