Havelock Posted July 26, 2020 Share #1 Posted July 26, 2020 Reflections on the kit and build: I thought it might be more useful for others, who might be thinking about building this kit, to write a short summary about my experience, and put it in this first post so it is easier to find. First off this kit is meant for first time builders, which I am, and I think they got it right. Its detailed picture-based instructions and the accompanying videos make it very clear how to build everything. There is no guesswork involved. I had only a few moments with the final sail rigging where the instructions were a little too brief but even then the videos helped fill in the slight gaps. The quality of the kit was also very good except for the deck planking strips but for my level of building that is a nitpick. However, the thing that I most liked about the kit is its level of difficulty; it was definitely challenging but not overwhelming. I felt that the time put into the build (which was 77 hours for me) was truly well spent. It really has a bit of everything so that when I now look at other more advanced builds I have a good appreciation of what level of attention and effort is required to achieve good results (which is actually very humbling). The other thing about the kit is that it's fairly forgiving with mistakes. I made a bunch of them and didn't executed things as well as I might have hoped but the design and relative simplicity of the boat is forgiving enough that you still end up with a good looking vessel. All in all I'm very please with the experience. It has whetted my appetite for more and that is a good result for a beginner's kit. Now back to the actual build log. Enjoy.... Another first time builder here, attempting to build OcCre's beginner kit: Polaris. I know nothing about ships or their historical accuracy and such, just want to get my feet wet and the Polaris seems like a decent enough kit to start out with. [There is a MSW review of the kit: here] I've managed to assemble the bulkheads/ribs to the false keel. This was relatively simple using small metal angle plates with clamps to get each rib square using Titebond II: I have to say there was quite a bit of play in the joints and while I did get the ribs square to the sides of the false keel, I wasn't paying attention to making it square along the top: And you can see that false keel has a slight bend too. However, I'm thinking it's not a problem as tolerances for mounting the deck shouldn't be that demanding. Well, I hope so. Currently working on the decking: Again using Titebond for glueing the deck planks rather than using contact glue per the instructions. I'm able to get a thin bead of PVA onto both the plank and deck, using the dispensing bottle shown in the picture above, and smooth it over with a small brush to avoid beads of excess glue forming. Working out really well. I get down 2 or 3 planks at a time and then use heavy books to press the planks while they set. Not so happy about the planks themselves. They have a lot of large grain criss-crossing them and I think ruin whatever scale effect the planks might have had to begin with. Not really a problem as I'm not looking to create a realistic model this time out. I'll be glad to just have something that doesn't look like a dog's dinner at the end of all this! Diver, bruce d, Minalan and 3 others 6 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolin Posted July 26, 2020 Share #2 Posted July 26, 2020 Looks like you are of to a god start. Does the bend in the keel get better if you install the deck? With such a slight bend, that could be enough to get it straightened. I agree that the wood grain does not look good scale wise. I guess OcCre has chosen a cheap material to keep the kit price down. If I remember correctly it is only about 60 euro for the basic variant. Quote Current builds Meta - Billing Boats - Pentikontoros - Navarino Completed builds Swampscott Dory - BlueJacket - Will Everard - Billing Boats - Bohuseka (Swedish west-coast rowboat) - scratch build - Medieval long-ship Helga Holm - scratch build - Sloop from Roslagen - scratch build Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 27, 2020 Author Share #3 Posted July 27, 2020 19 hours ago, bolin said: Does the bend in the keel get better if you install the deck? With such a slight bend, that could be enough to get it straightened. Yes it does, Bolin. I wasn't too worried. Though, as you'll see in my next update, the deck doesn't install totally flush with the ribs, and the transom is not square either. Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 27, 2020 Author Share #4 Posted July 27, 2020 Got the deck planking finished and marked up. Decided to use a wipe-on poly to seal them: The WOP is really easy to use. Had to do a few thin coats; the wood really soaked it up. First time using this kind of product. I think I put enough down to protect the wood but not enough to make it look like a finish. I can always put more down later, right? Gluing the deck to the false keel/ribs was quite the effort. Did a dry fit (a few times) to see how well they mated. The slight bend in the false keel meant I had to twist things a bit to get all the rib keys to sit properly in deck rabbets. Used generous amounts of Titebond and tried using CA to tack down the deck while the wood glue dried. Should have used a medium CA but only had thick CA on hand and it wasn't very effective. In the end I was able to squeeze things together long enough for the glue to take. Titebond is relatively fast I'm finding: Happy enough with the results. However, the transom is not square with the deck: Thinking it's not the end of the world. Also somehow managed to lose one of the bow filler pieces (C1) and had to make a replacement out of 1/8" basswood. Still can't figure out where that piece got to.... All in all a very productive day and am pretty happy with the deck, even with the horrible grain: Now on to doing all the fairing, ugh..... VTHokiEE, Jeff5115, BenD and 6 others 9 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 27, 2020 Author Share #5 Posted July 27, 2020 Bah humbug! I didn't pay attention to centering the bow point with the false keel: Going to require some creative sanding to center the bulwark later.... I think. bruce d 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LHsmith Posted July 27, 2020 Share #6 Posted July 27, 2020 I read somewhere here about how to unglue titebond. Do you think reinstalling the deck would correct the alignment at the bow and stern? The actual keel glues to the false keel and may look off center. Quote Current Build- OcCre Polaris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share #7 Posted July 28, 2020 LH, good thinking but I'm going to fudge along this time. I have to say though that my philosophy on this build is to not fret much on mistakes; at least I'm going to be telling myself that regularly. Learning a lot and that's what matters most for this build. Also curious to see how noticeable the errors will be at the end of the build. Also have to say how much I love working with wood. Built a few stick and tissue airplanes and there is something so satisfying about it, particularly after sanding. I can't say I like wood dust though... bruce d 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTHokiEE Posted July 28, 2020 Share #8 Posted July 28, 2020 2 hours ago, LHsmith said: read somewhere here about how to unglue titebond It should debond with isopropyl alcohol (I’ll pretend that I don’t have any experience doing that on my model 😁). Looks nice so far! If I may offer one small suggestion - it is a learning experience making a mistake and then working out how to correct it. I’m not trying to push you to realign everything, but you may want to take a shot at correcting a thing or two on a build like this (or maybe your next one) so that it doesn’t seem so devastating to do it later on a build that may be more “important.” Just a thought though, take it with a grain of sand. bruce d 1 Quote Current Build: HM Sloop Echo 1781 (First Scratch Build) Previous Builds: HM Cutter Alert, Sharpie Schooner, Chesapeake Bay Flattie, Half-Hull (NRG) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share #9 Posted July 28, 2020 36 minutes ago, VTHokiEE said: If I may offer one small suggestion - it is a learning experience making a mistake and then working out how to correct it. I’m not trying to push you to realign everything, but you may want to take a shot at correcting a thing or two on a build like this (or maybe your next one) so that it doesn’t seem so devastating to do it later on a build that may be more “important.” Just a thought though, take it with a grain of sand. For sure! VTHokiEE 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 29, 2020 Author Share #10 Posted July 29, 2020 Got the fairing done. For the stern I had to use sandpaper wrapped around a dowel: It worked really well. Happy enough with the results: Tried to get the transom to look fairly symmetrical but with it not being square with the deck in the first place, and not wanted to sand away too much, I felt I had to stop. Made sure to sand the edges of the deck to have a good contact surface area for the bulwark to glue to: Also decided to give the decking one more coat of wipe-on poly. It now has a very slight sheen: Next up will be attaching the bulwark and then attempting the first planking. However, I'm already anxious about damaging the bulwark while doing the first planking as it's only going to be glued on along a thin 1/8" of its surface. bruce d, CiscoH and VTHokiEE 3 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share #11 Posted July 30, 2020 After bending the bulwarks: Gluing them to the deck was quite an adventure. Did a lot of dry fitting and trying to figure out if there was a way to clamp them but because of the slight angle with the deck I didn't have any clamps that would do the job. In the end I glued them on in sections (from the stern to the bow) and held them in place by hand till the wood glue set. A long process and quite stressful. In the end I did manage to get them on well enough I think: Have to say that I'm very impressed with the PVA's gluing power; feels really sturdy. Next up is planking which I'm hoping is fairly straightforward. bruce d, VTHokiEE, tarbrush and 4 others 7 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahka_est Posted July 30, 2020 Share #12 Posted July 30, 2020 You are doing a really good job! Looks like really clean and neat! bruce d 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share #13 Posted July 30, 2020 Thank you, Wahka. It's coming along alright. Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted July 31, 2020 Author Share #14 Posted July 31, 2020 Was planning on laying down the first 6 planks on each side but ended up only managing 3 for now. Started by bending the planks first so that they conform better to the hull: Six of the planks span the full hull and required significant bending at the bow. The other six don't span the full hull and only require a slight bend. Not sure if one really needs to bend them in order to do the planking but it sure makes it easier to manage. In the OcCre videos they use a small brad pusher to nail the planks to the ribs. I don't have one of those so had to use a mini hammer instead. I did find that life is much easier if you first mark where the nails go in along the plank and pre-push the nails in: After that it was plain sailing, though I was a bit too judicious initially with the wood glue between the planks: It took more time than I thought but part of that was figuring out a process for both the plank bend and installation. The next pass should be more productive.... bruce d, Moab and Diver 3 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 1, 2020 Author Share #15 Posted August 1, 2020 Still working on the first planking but thought I would share two things: 1) Just noticed that one of the planking nails managed to penetrate up into the decking: Ugh! I was able to remove it and push down the "bump" so it's not terribly noticeable. Definitely a cautionary tale for other newbie's like myself. Thankfully it was only one and not a bunch of them. 2) I've been thinking about the second planking and using contact cement (CC) as shown in the instructions. Decided to do a test run on a scrap of wood to see how hard/easy it was as I've never used it before and people have mentioned it bounds too quickly and so is unforgiving when placing the strips. I also tested using PVA glue: I found laying down the strips on the CC was not too hard although, in reality, on the hull the strips will be much longer and have slight curving. Still I found that if I'm gingerly with laying them down then there is a some wiggle room for adjustments. My main concern with using wood glue is that there's not good way to "clamp" the strips down while the glue cures. I'd have to keep manually pressing them down and I think that will be too laborious for all the strips needed. I also noticed with the PVA'd strips that they "cup", as you can see in the photo above. Not sure if that is a deal breaker. I guess sanding will remove the cupping but I don't think I'd want to sand too much with these super thin strips. I'll see how much the cupping reduces over time as the strips dry out fully. Anyone have other suggestions for gluing the second planking? For now using CC seems the simplest. In other news: Had a pop inspection at the shipyard: The Admiralty were not impressed. They mentioned something about there being a lack of consumables... bruce d and Moab 2 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 2, 2020 Author Share #16 Posted August 2, 2020 Making progress but it's slow going. Doing the garboard planks and upwards was quite challenging at the bow. Luckily I got experience bending planks while trying to build Model Shipway's 18th Century Longboat. That build is proving too hard for me at present but it gave me enough experience to be able to pre-bend these planks to get an easier time of laying them down nicely. However, the very tippy part of the bow I had to soak and then bend and nail into place as it is simply too server a curve. Some pics of the progress so far: For fun I added a little "Built by..." message inside: Should add a little object in there too... so it makes an annoying rattling sound... 😁 So far spent 12 hours on this build. CiscoH, Duanelaker and bruce d 3 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweepHall Posted August 2, 2020 Share #17 Posted August 2, 2020 I used this stuff on my second layer of planks for my ocre build https://www.amazon.co.uk/UHU-purpose-adhesive-clear-glue and a bit of ca on the bends where I wanted an instant hold. It's a bit stringy and can get a little messy, but some nail varnish remover cleaned up any that got on the planks. Alternatively you could just use pva/wood glue and a load of elastic bands and push pins? Contact cement is great but it will shred the thin strips trying to remove them if you get them in the wrong place Quote Current build: AL HMS Bounty 1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 2, 2020 Author Share #18 Posted August 2, 2020 Thx, Sweep. I ordered some. Always interested in trying out new glues. Main planking done. Just need to fill in 16 holes: Side note: Thought I was following the planking from the videos but messed up with the 5th plank from the keel at the stern. Oh well.... bruce d 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahka_est Posted August 3, 2020 Share #19 Posted August 3, 2020 7 hours ago, Havelock said: Thx, Sweep. I ordered some. Always interested in trying out new glues. Main planking done. Just need to fill in 16 holes: Side note: Thought I was following the planking from the videos but messed up with the 5th plank from the keel at the stern. Oh well.... Your planking is good for 1st layer. Now you just have to fill those holes. Just a suggestion - maybe try not to push all those nails in. Many of us removes those before sanding and 2nd planking. Sanding wise is a nightmare. For sanding you can also try small delta sander. i have used that for major part and then difficult parts by hand. bruce d and clearway 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 3, 2020 Author Share #20 Posted August 3, 2020 14 hours ago, Wahka_est said: Just a suggestion - maybe try not to push all those nails in. Many of us removes those before sanding and 2nd planking. Sanding wise is a nightmare. Ah, my strategy was to push the heads in as far as I could but I think it's best to remove them as you say. I gave it a go and it's not too hard: A little bit of damage but nothing that should affect the second planking. Next time I will definitely not drive the heads in so far. Diver and bruce d 2 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahka_est Posted August 4, 2020 Share #21 Posted August 4, 2020 12 hours ago, Havelock said: Ah, my strategy was to push the heads in as far as I could but I think it's best to remove them as you say. I gave it a go and it's not too hard: A little bit of damage but nothing that should affect the second planking. Next time I will definitely not drive the heads in so far. Normal filler will correct those errors for second planking so dont worry about that. bruce d and Keith Mc 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share #22 Posted August 5, 2020 Started sanding the hull and boy am I glad I removed the nails! It would have been a nightmare! Thx Wahka! Also didn’t realize that it needs so much sanding. Some of the planks were noticeably thicker so require a lot more work. bruce d 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share #23 Posted August 5, 2020 Got the initial sanding done: Need to fill in some gaps, and do a final sanding... For the filling I plan on using Durham's (Rock Hard) Water Putty. Duanelaker, bruce d and CiscoH 3 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahka_est Posted August 5, 2020 Share #24 Posted August 5, 2020 For first sanding i have used small delta sander to get it more or less smooth. Try to dry fit keel at bow also before you start doing 2nd planing so it would fit nicely. Good progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce d Posted August 5, 2020 Share #25 Posted August 5, 2020 2 hours ago, Havelock said: For the filling I plan on using Durham's (Rock Hard) Water Putty. Hi Thomas, looking good so far. Just another unsolicited bit of advice: choose your filler to match the hardness of the wood surface. If one is harder than the other, sanding will be much more difficult because each stroke will remove more of the the softer material (whether it is the wood or the filler) and leave high spots and low spots. On the curved surface of a hull, the effect is even more pronounced. If anything, go for a filler that is softer than the wood. HTH Bruce Quote 🌻 STAY SAFE A model shipwright and an amateur historian are heads & tails of the same coin current builds: HMS Berwick 1775, 1/192 scratchbuild; a Slade 74 in the Navy Board style Mediator sloop, 1/48 - an 18th century transport scratchbuild French longboat - CAF - 1/48, on hold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 5, 2020 Author Share #26 Posted August 5, 2020 8 hours ago, bruce d said: Just another unsolicited bit of advice: choose your filler to match the hardness of the wood surface. If one is harder than the other, sanding will be much more difficult because each stroke will remove more of the the softer material (whether it is the wood or the filler) and leave high spots and low spots. On the curved surface of a hull, the effect is even more pronounced. If anything, go for a filler that is softer than the wood. Thx, Bruce. The wood is pretty soft. I'm guessing use sawdust with wood glue? Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 7, 2020 Author Share #27 Posted August 7, 2020 Ended up using Elmer's Wood Filler for what little filling I needed to do: Which was mainly where the bulwark doesn't quite meet the sheer plank. Added the stern planks: Trimmed and sanded them down: Noticed the stern post area is too thick so did more sanding: The post at the bow (don't know the technical term for it) was bit more of a challenge to figure out. Mine doesn't look like the pictures in the instructions but I think it works fine: Thinking I'm nearly ready to start the second planking. Going to go over the instructions and video one more time, and do some more dry fitting of the keel and the stern and bow posts. bruce d, CiscoH, SweepHall and 1 other 4 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce d Posted August 7, 2020 Share #28 Posted August 7, 2020 Hi Thomas, sorry for the delay in answering but it looks like you chose well. Your progress is good and you seem to be doing all the right things. The stern looks better after you thinned it down and the stem (that piece at the bow) looks alright to me (but I haven't seen the plans ). The stem is quite a big part of the distinctive appearance of these craft and I have spent quite a bit of time finagling the stem pieces on my Mediator. Quote 🌻 STAY SAFE A model shipwright and an amateur historian are heads & tails of the same coin current builds: HMS Berwick 1775, 1/192 scratchbuild; a Slade 74 in the Navy Board style Mediator sloop, 1/48 - an 18th century transport scratchbuild French longboat - CAF - 1/48, on hold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 7, 2020 Author Share #29 Posted August 7, 2020 Thx, Bruce. Your Mediator build is very impressive. I'll be following for sure. I planked the stern: The contact cement is horrible to work with. I've been using Weldbond from a bottle (you can see in the top right of the second image) but it's very thick and the built in applicator is a nightmare to use; very hard to apply well and goes on too thickly. I've also bought a quart of the stuff, i.e. in a can, and am going to see how much better it is to work with with a different applicator (brush). Will do some test runs to see if I can get better at applying the glue. bruce d 1 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havelock Posted August 8, 2020 Author Share #30 Posted August 8, 2020 Made some progress on planking the hull. It's been a learning process with using contact glue for sure. First though had to smooth the rough edges of the planking strips: Used some 400 grit sanding foam. Surprising how rough some of the dark strips where. Then setup a "jig" of sorts to stick down the strips using double sided tape: Was planning doing a bunch of planks but then decided to just do the port side bulwark and two sheer planks, so a total of 6 strips. Also remembered this time to separate the strips before the glue dries. When doing a test run before I forgot to separate them and it was a bit of a mess: Applied glue to the port bulwark.... and managed to get the strips on well enough: The main issue I'm finding with the contact cement is that it gets totally soaked up by the wood and needs two or three coats before I got a good application. So for now did a coat of glue over the whole hull: Will let it dry so that tomorrow hopefully I'll have an easier go of it. Can't say I like working with contact cement - it's horrible stuff - but do like that I'm getting some experience with it. Definitely has its uses. Diver and bruce d 2 Quote User: Havelock Build Logs -> Current: Taurus-MS-1:64 -> Completed: Polaris-OcCre-1:50 Stash: 18th Century Longboat-MS-1:48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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