Glory of the Seas 1869 by rwiederrich - FINISHED - 1/96 - medium clipper

[rwiederrich]

2 hours ago, ClipperFan said:

Rob,

Here's another puzzle to resolve regarding cathead location relative to Glory's f'o'cstle deck. According to this very clear scene the placement of her starboard cathead is clearly positioned completely below her splash rail and apparently piercing her fancy rail below. Lifting Glory's f'o'cstle deck to the top of her fancy rail now means her catheads would be hidden or mostly buried by this new, higher deck. 

Several other images show her cat head just below the edge of the splash rail.   Meaning, as you say….. very little of the cat head body will be on the forecastle decking.  
 

Hear the decking being laid.  I have the paneled  cabins in too and the windless rigged, but I left for a birthday party before I took an image.   That will be later. 
 

Rob

[rwiederrich]

Adding the front cabin walls and overhauling the windless.  
 

Rob

[ClipperFan]

Rob,

You're doing an excellent job on the rebuild of the area under the f'o'cstle with impressive detail work on the bulwarks beneath. It's now far more faithful to the original now. For those who aren't familiar with the source which instigated Rob's courageous decision to completely tear down and rebuild this important section, the exact photo which provoked this action is shared here. Most of our previous focus naturally, has been on the wonderful information in the foreground. All specific details of her coach house railings with attendant turned rail stanchions beneath are clearly visible for anyone wanting to precisely replicate this area. 

However, once all this information is processed, look towards the very rear of the photo. Follow the large House astern of the foremast. Look at the lower port side corner of this structure. There you'll see the image of a sailor crouching on all fours attending to the ship, probably caulking. Towering behind him are the f'o'cstle walls with their distinctive vertical rectangular moldings. This tiny detail is our discovery that led to Rob's dramatic step to radically reconstruct this area. His resulting reconstruction with interior walls is now far more faithful to Glory of the Seas herself. It also consistently reinforces how roomy and spacious this vessel really was. Great work Rob! My hat's off to you for your insight to correct this area.

Another controversial area of discussion has been Mike's insistence of McKay's apparent use of substantial wooden mooring bits instead of more modern typical wrought iron ones. Mike finally followed up with an email with this 1915 image of a guy standing on the f'o'cstle of a large wooden ship, which Mike said is the Glory of the Seas. Knowing Mike's penchant for confirming details, I accept his word that this picture is from the deck of Glory. In the left foreground are the large wooden mooring posts (the stern portion of the 2nd post is just barely visible in the extreme left foreground). Mike described that these peculiar mooring bits had been in use on McKay Clippers going as far back as the famous Extreme Clipper Flying Cloud. My reply email to Mike while accepting the veracity of this photo, asked for additional background information, which Mike typically has. I will follow with an update when I get his response.

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by ClipperFan
additional information

[rwiederrich]

Rich…..have you considered my pm?

 

Rob

[ClipperFan]

13 minutes ago, rwiederrich said:

Rich…..have you considered my pm?

 

Rob

Rob,

Yes. You're right that this image alone cannot prove or disprove it came from Glory of the Seas. I only shared it to keep a promise I made to you guys to post it as soon as I received it from Mike. In my reply to his email, I asked for additional documentation, since he referred to this picture as being from 1915. He usually has additional information to support his images. While I revised my sketch to reflect Mike's update, since my deadline was coming up fast, you have no such due date. You can wait until you're fully satisfied with whatever decision you make. As I've always said, it's your model, not mine.

Edited July 2, 2022 by ClipperFan
grammar correction

[Rick310]

Good work guys!

[ClipperFan]

1 hour ago, ClipperFan said:

Rob,

Yes. You're right that this image alone cannot prove or disprove it came from Glory of the Seas. I only shared it to keep a promise I made to you guys to post it as soon as I received it from Mike. In my reply to his email, I asked for additional documentation, since he referred to this picture as being from 1915. He usually has additional information to support his images. While I revised my sketch to reflect Mike's update, since my deadline was coming up fast, you have no such due date. You can wait until you're fully satisfied with whatever decision you make. As I've always said, it's your model, not mine.

 

[ClipperFan]

To all Glory of the Seas build followers,

A Fourth of July treat for everyone! Mike sent me some beautiful pictures of a historically important Glory of the Seas model built by Frederick Pease Harlow (sailor who served on the sailing ship Akbar a similar three masted merchant vessel) constructed primarily from a cabin door removed from the actual ship before she was tragically burned for her metal in 1923. While this impressive model is of historic value, it isn't as meticulously accurate as those being currently built by Rob and Vladimir. Her bow isn't as sleek as we've discovered, she sports dual metallic capstans on her f'o'cstle, there's no overhang on the rear coach house and the mizzen mast is way too far forward. This is not meant to disparage the creator of this lovely model who I'm sure had obvious capabilities to create an exact replica given the proper information. All in all though, of all models I've seen of Glory of the Seas, this is definitely one of the nicest I've seen. I only wish there were some overall scenes of this magnificent large model. However, it does highlight the advances in our greater comprehension of every iota of McKay's final glorious Medium Clipper. Such advances in accuracy are based in major part due to the immeasurable contribution of Michael Mjelde's incredibly sharp images, which have guided us in every step of this magnificent project. So, I sincerely hope everyone enjoys these lovely images and to all, Happy 4th of July!

[Wawona59]

Hello everyone who is following this outstanding build of the Glory of the Seas.  I used to live in West Seattle and am very familiar with the Fauntleroy-Brace Point area where the remains of Glory of the Seas are.

 

Here's a local blog I came across which I thought you might be interested in.

 

Here's the link:

https://batgurrl.net/2021/07/03/demise-of-a-clipper-ship-on-endolyne-beach/

 

I'm really enjoying following this build.

 

Wawona59

 

 

[rwiederrich]

39 minutes ago, Wawona59 said:

Hello everyone who is following this outstanding build of the Glory of the Seas.  I used to live in West Seattle and am very familiar with the Fauntleroy-Brace Point area where the remains of Glory of the Seas are.

 

Here's a local blog I came across which I thought you might be interested in.

 

Here's the link:

https://batgurrl.net/2021/07/03/demise-of-a-clipper-ship-on-endolyne-beach/

 

I'm really enjoying following this build.

 

Wawona59

 

 

I’ve read this before. My own expedition was a low minus 3.3 tide on May 18 2018 were I acquired relics for my collection.  
 

Thanks for posting………. 
 

Rob

[rwiederrich]

Beginning to work again on the forecastle.  
 

I’ll be laying decking soon. 
 

Rob

[ClipperFan]

2 hours ago, Wawona59 said:

Hello everyone who is following this outstanding build of the Glory of the Seas.  I used to live in West Seattle and am very familiar with the Fauntleroy-Brace Point area where the remains of Glory of the Seas are.

 

Here's a local blog I came across which I thought you might be interested in.

 

Here's the link:

https://batgurrl.net/2021/07/03/demise-of-a-clipper-ship-on-endolyne-beach/

 

I'm really enjoying following this build.

 

Wawona59

 

 

Wawona59

Thanks for your expression of appreciation for Rob & Vladimir's Glory of the Seas builds. Thanks for sharing the link too. It seems there's growing appreciation for McKay's last, wonderful clipper ship. Too damn bad his spectacular vessels weren't better understood for their value 100 years ago. What a pity, we might have had at least one of his magnificent ships to behold in person.

[Mirabell61]

Very interesting blog Wawona

 

Nils

[rwiederrich]

Adding decking and some trim. 
 

Rob

[rwiederrich]

Began to add the starboard cat mods.  It is clear her cats are not square, nor without equipment appendages.  I’m replacing the other type of anchor release mechanism I used previously.   Evidence shows she had a latch and chain mechanism.  Another issue, I find, is that the bottom edge of her cathead is resting nearly on the main rail trim and the upper portion is roughly resting at the height of the splash rail edge.  And with the angulation of the cathead, it would appear that very little of the body of the cathead was actually exposed on the forecastle deck.  this would in essence clear the decks of unwanted structures and *tripping* hazards, that is why I reduced the exposed cat body to a thin sliver.   Of course this is all based upon an educated evaluation of the existing structures in many images of Glory's catheads.

I had to slightly modify this arrangement to accommodate the pre-existing catheads and their associated bullseye lanyards for the bowsprit guys/shrouds.  I wasn't going to remove and remake all of those structures.
 

Rob

Edited July 5, 2022 by rwiederrich

[Rick310]

Looks really good Rob. I think you nailed it!!

[rwiederrich]

3 hours ago, Rick310 said:

Looks really good Rob. I think you nailed it!!

Thank Rick…….doing the best I can. 
 

Here are some more changes and additions to the forecastle.  
 

Rob

[Keith Black]

Great recovery, Rob.

[rwiederrich]

47 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

Great recovery, Rob.

Thanks Keith.  Just couldn’t live with the error.  Break it up now with a little pain or live with it wrong, for a lifetime    I’m replacing all the iron bits for wooden ones too……..while I still can reach them.  
 

Rob

[BANYAN]

1 hour ago, rwiederrich said:

Thanks Keith.  Just couldn’t live with the error.  Break it up now with a little pain or live with it wrong, for a lifetime

Great attitude Rob, the forecastle look's good.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[rwiederrich]

Now I’m adding a new railing that more closely mimics the one in her photograph. 
 

Rob

[Rick310]

This is really well done Rob!!  Has a nice clean look to the forecastle.   I especially like the way you made the cut outs (chocks?) for the mooring lines in the splash rails. Great attention to detail!

[rwiederrich]

2 hours ago, Rick310 said:

This is really well done Rob!!  Has a nice clean look to the forecastle.   I especially like the way you made the cut outs (chocks?) for the mooring lines in the splash rails. Great attention to detail!

“Fairleads”.  The splash rail is opened up and the metal failead is inserted………giving the ropes protection from marring on bear wood.  I wanted them to look intentional and detailed……something different.  The little details make all the difference. 
 

Thanks for the compliment. 
 

Rob

[Vladimir_Wairoa]

On 6/28/2022 at 11:47 PM, ClipperFan said:

Rob, Vladimir, Druxey, Banyan, et all,

Here for everyone to read is my manuscript and Appendix I as submitted today to Paul E. Fontenoy, Editor of the Nautical Research Journal. How or if it will be published in the Winter 2022 issue is yet to be decided. However, having never attempted anything like this before, it's thrilling just to have gotten this far. I want to publicly acknowledge the invaluable assistance of Druxey my silent, behind the scenes editor. He very patiently waded through my raw manuscript and especially when it came to my notorious penchant for "run-on" sentences, expertly guided me through the process of wrestling them under control. Anyone familiar with the brilliant tv show CSI will recognize this analogy. When I first received the initial revised manuscript back, there were so many red lines, it immediately reminded me of a bloody scene from that investigative procedural. Ha, ha! Unfortunately, time ran out before I could implement every single one of Druxey's insightful recommendations. However, meeting the July 1st deadline was of paramount importance and I felt that as written and illustrated, it was sufficiently ready to send it in. Anyways, knowing to some degree the restrictive nature of publications, I felt this group would appreciate seeing the entire manuscript, as submitted.

05-06-22 Reconstructing McKay Clipper 'Glory of the Seas' - Appendix I final.docx 449.69 kB · 13 downloads Reconstructing McKay Clipper 'Glory of the Seas' REV DA5 REV.docx 13.67 MB · 10 downloads

Hooray ! Confratulations . 

[Vladimir_Wairoa]

I have not Been here for some time, wow very interesting reads and visuals. Rising fcastle was definitely thing that Haunted and disturbed me for longer myself...sure great Job Rob. 

 

 

[rwiederrich]

1 hour ago, Vladimir_Wairoa said:

I have not Been here for some time, wow very interesting reads and visuals. Rising fcastle was definitely thing that Haunted and disturbed me for longer myself...sure great Job Rob. 

 

 

Thanks for stopping in Vlad.  Yeah...I just had to do it.  With my own conscience nagging me...along with Rich's continual prompts to stay true to her design....I had to act and break out the demo hammers and saws.

The pain is over now...and all that is left is to finish up the port cathead mods with its anchor release mechanism and glue a few things down.  Still have to add the fore stay anchor bolts/fixtures too.

 

Have to gotten the bug yet to begin the final masting and rigging of your Glory?

 

Rob

[ClipperFan]

Rob,

 Your Glory of the Seas now looks like a far more accurate replica of the real vessel herself. The one confusing item was that troubling forward bulkhead. It's hard to underestimate the impact revising it has done to the real sense of this Ship. I congratulate you on your bold decision to remake this area. A particularly satisfying development is the new angled interior forward bulkheads, just hinted at by Mike's plan view.

As I said in my email, Mike is glad that you concurred with his position that McKay clippers, from at least as far back as Flying Cloud were all equipped with wooden rectangular bitts. 

Mike gave additional background about the sailor posing with the port wooden rectangular bitt on Glory's  f'o'cstle. His name was Frederick Pease Harlow who sailed on the Clipper Ship Akbar. I found this beautiful China Trade painting of her on-line titled "1869 Clipper Akbar off Hong Kong."

Edited July 6, 2022 by ClipperFan
Misspelled word

[rwiederrich]

Spent some time finishing up items on the new forecastle.   Still have to finish up the port cat head. 
 

Rob

[rwiederrich]

I also replaced all the iron bits with wooden bitty……..to keep to the documented historical practice of Donald McKay for many of his clippers.   
 

Rob

[ClipperFan]

1 hour ago, rwiederrich said:

I also replaced all the iron bits with wooden bitty……..to keep to the documented historical practice of Donald McKay for many of his clippers.   
 

Rob

Rob,

I never get tired of seeing progress photos on your magnificent model. Even the number of rungs on the newly installed ladders emphasizes how high the new bulkheads actually are. It's almost a shame they have to be there, as they now block most of the lovely molding behind them. I also applaud your thoroughness in replacing all iron bitts with wooden ones.

Once again, having input from Michael Mjelde, a man who through his single-minded devotion to researching clipper Glory of the Seas beginning in 1957 has given us unique insights into her historical accuracy. After all, nothing beats first hand accounts of men who actually served on these wondrous vessels. It's yet another reason why I call Glory of the Seas the "Rosetta Stone" of Donald McKay's clippers.

Edited July 7, 2022 by ClipperFan
Misspelled word