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La Marine De Louis XVI by Patrick Villiers plans only - New ANCRE publication


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An email add came in from ANCRE yesterday.  I have no French, so I can only guess about them.

The subject seems to focus on the fleet of Louis XVI  that was involved in the battle at the Chesapeake Capes that allowed for the successful siege at Yorktown.

The text is French only, so I will wait for an English translation.

There also seen to be a set of what I guess are lines plans at 1/72 or smaller for many of the vessels of the French fleet.

I tried to use the main site  to translate, but the new product is not there yet.

My CC company added a new step with a password that I have no clue about - so my purchase failed.  I have to wait for PayPal to do a transfer ( with these ridiculously now interest rates, what is the point in PP taking a week to transfer funds? )  ( I neither have nor want the capability for text on a phone - but banks are seeming to act like EVERYBODY has active phone texting. )

I am really interested in seeing if this new set is really lines plans for a whole French fleet.  For one, the City of Paris is potentially a big deal here - being just down the road from Cape Henry.

Edited by Jaager
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1 hour ago, MEDDO said:

You can always copy/paste into google translate to see what they are saying

I did.  That is how I obtained the information that I posted.  I have the hope that someone with more knowledge will jump in an expand on this.

The postage on the plans is significant.  There seems to be some weight and volume there.   I am willing to take the gamble that they are what I think they are. 

 

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The most important parts of the blurb on the Ancre site are:

 

" This work of 480 pages hopes to reunite the history and construction of naval vessels while studying the important naval strategies and tactics. The second part is a maritime biography of the vessels and frigates which took part in this conflict while also publishing the original documents as far as possible.

 

"20 frigates and 35 vessels have particular attention paid to them, thus allowing a refreshing look at traditional maritime history.

 

"First part:

Ch 1: French naviy at the end of the reign of Louis XV

Ch 2: Sartine and the reorganisation of the navy

Ch 3: Naval material

Ch 4: The dockyards

Ch 5: Some major construction engineers

Ch 6: Sartine and the planning of the war: the ships

Ch 7: Sartine and the planning of the war: the personnel

Ch 8: How the war unfolded: 1775-1778

Ch 9: French Naval strategy

Ch 20: The naval battles

 

"Second Part:

110-gun, 80-gun, 74-gun ships as well as those with 70, 64 and 50 guns

12-gun and 8-gun frigates

 

"Box of plans sold separately or as optional extra: @ 1:72 in a cloth bound box (€94, or €175 with first part)

3 ships and 1 frigate with sail plans @ 1:144

2 110-gun ships, 3 80-gun ships and 11 74-gun ships

1 70-gun ship, 10 64-gun ships, 2 50-gun ships

10 12-gun frigates and 5 8-gun frigates."

 

Also in the newsletter are details of are sets of plans sold separately for La Renomeé 1:36, La Salamandre 1:36, L'Ambitieux 1:36, L'Amarante at 1:24

 

I hope this helps

 

Tony

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The book isn't really new. The first edition is from 1985, but difficult to get.
I am happy about the new edition, especially about the plan edition because I already have the first edition book.

Quote

"Second Part:

110-gun, 80-gun, 74-gun ships as well as those with 70, 64 and 50 guns

12-gun and 8-gun frigates

This part goes into the history of individual ships in detail. Such as the sister ship of the Hermione, the La Concorde.

I think it's very interesting. 

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Well,  PP completed the transfer of funds, so I made the purchase of the box of plans. Today, I was notified that the box has been shipped.  I paid for the

higher level shipping.  It should not be too long before I find out if these plans fit my requirements.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Update.
A box with 45 plans was on my doorstep this afternoon.
I have no French and have not done an on-line translation of any of the blurb on the package.

I will provide a brief description of each plan when I complete my review.

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This appears to be a snapshot of the major vessels of the French Navy from 1775-1793.  It is a compilation of the official plans with the addition of a few plans from the RN archives of captured vessels.  I suspect that there are more vessels that could have been included if their plans had survived.  This volume is similar to ANM in how useful its direct application is for a ship modeler.

I think this volume is a drafting of plans from the French Navy archives to a standard 1:72 format.  These are a bit different from the plans in the RN archives in the NNM.  There is less detail.  They seem to focus  on the interests of the naval architects. The swimming body and the run of the lines are complete.  The overall appearance of the vessels for historical preservation does not seem to be of much interest.  The construction details are not present.  

The following is my evaluation of each from the perspective of a POF scratch builder.

Plan 1  -  
La Bretagne 1762  110 guns
1:72  Body Plan, Waterlines Plan,  Profile
The wales, rails, gunports, headrails , mast locations at toprail.
Nothing on the stern, quarter galleries, figurehead or carvings.
There is enough information to frame and plank the hull. Everything else would be generic or spec.

Plan 2  -
Generic 3 decker and 74
1:144
Spars, sails, rigging  side view
quarter galleries and side view of figurehead

Plan 3  -
64 gun ship (Artsien) and 12lb frigate (Hermione)
1:144  
Spars, sails, rigging
both are smaller scale copies of what is in their respective individual monographs available from ANCRE

Plan 4  -
Le Ville de Paris  1757 100 guns
Body Plan only
This is the same as the information that I received from G. Delacroix when I asked about what was available for this ship.  It was the flagship of  Rear Admiral Francois Joseph Paul, the Comte de Grasse.  
Not enough information to model except to get the correct hull shape.

Plan 5  -
Le Duc de Bourhogne  1748  80 guns  
1:72  
Body Plan, Waterlines, Profile has rails, gunports, deck locations,  no wales, stern, or bow

Plan 6  -
Le Languedoc 1762  80 guns
Waterlines, Profile Plans same data as Plan 1, but no Body Plan  
The hull could be built using current methods.  I could not frame using just this information.

Plan 7  -
Le Tonnant 1742  80 guns  
Body Plan, Waterlines, Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 with some carving detail

Plan 8  -
Le Bien Aime  1767 - La Victoire 1768   74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 9  -
Le Bourgogne 1762  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

 

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Plan 10  -
Le Cesar 1767,  LedEstin 1777 74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 11  -
Le Fendant 1772  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 12  -
L'Hector  1751  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 13  -
L'Intrepide  1747  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines

Plan 14  -
Le Neptune  1777  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 15  -
Le Sceptre 1778  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 16  -
Le Souverain 1755  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 17  -
La Victoire 1781  74 guns
Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Deck locations  -  the same status as Plan 6

Plan 18  -
Le Zele 1762  74 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 19  -
Le dauphin Royal 1735  70 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

 

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Plan 20  -
Le Caton 1770  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 21  -
Le Fantasque 1756  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 22  -
Le Jason 1777  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 23  -
Le Lion 1749  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 24  -
Le Prothee 1772  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
These are RN dockyard plans of a capture done 1781
There is more detail. The interior work sand the stern.
The Body Plan has the additional technical data of English plans from this time.
Overall, the plans for this ship are much more complete.

Plan 25  -
Le Provence 1762  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 26  -
Le Brillant 1774 , Le Reflechi 1773 , Le Solitaire 1772   64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 27  -
Le Triton 1745  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 28  -
Le Vaillant 1752  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 29  -
Le Vengeur 1765  64 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1. There is interior detail.
The channels and deadeyes are present.

 

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Plan 30  -
L'Amphion 1748  50 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 31 -
Le Fier 1745  50 guns
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 32  -
La Charmante 1777 , La Junon 1777  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 but zero bow data

Plan 33  -
La Concorde 1783  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1  plus stern, internal detail, channels

Plan 34  -
L'Engageante 1765  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 35  -
La Magicienne 1777  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1  plus figurehead and quarter gallery

Plan 36  -
La Nymphe 1780  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 plus stern, internal detail, channels

Plan 37  -
L'Oiseau 1772  12lb  frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 plus stern, internal detail, channels
These are RN dockyard plans of a capture done 1772
There is more detail. The interior works and the stern.
Overall, the plans for this ship are much more complete.

Plan 38  -
La Renommee 1767  12lb  frigate
Waterlines, Profile Plans same data as Plan 1, but no Body Plan  
The hull could be built using current methods.  I could not frame using just this information.

Plan 39  -
La Sultane 1765  12lb  frigate
Waterlines, Profile Plans same data as Plan 1, but no Body Plan  
Internal data, figurehead, quarter gallery
The hull could be built using current methods.  I could not frame using just this information.

 

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Plan 40  -
La Surveillante  1778  12lb frigate
Stern, aft profile above LWL
akmost no useful information - essentially a place holder

Plan 41  -
L'Alcmene 1774 , L'Aimable 1776  8lb frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 plus  internal detail, channels quarter gallery, figurehead
No stern
These are RN dockyard plans of a capture done 1781
There is more detail.
.
Plan 42  -
La Danae 1763  8lb frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1 plus  internal detail, channels quarter gallery, figurehead, stern
These are RN dockyard plans of a capture done 1779
There is more detail.
.
Plan 43  -
La Gracieuse 1749  8lb frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 44  -
La Migonne 1767  8lb frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

Plan 45  -
La Pleyade 1754  8lb frigate
Body Plan, Waterlines,  Profile Plan
Same data as Plan 1

 

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I am not disappointed by this purchase at all.  It is more of an addition to my historical archives than for a direct model application.  This provides necessary but not sufficient information to model a ship from the Navy of Louis XVI.

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  • Jaager changed the title to La Marine De Louis XVI by Patrick Villiers plans only - New ANCRE publication

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