Anyone use a 10" table saw for detail fine wood cutting?

[clogger]

I have a 10" table saw and wondered if anyone uses these large tablesaws  (as opposed to the Brynes/Proxxon types) for fine wood cutting?

Does anyone recommend a saw blade for such work? What would be the pros and cons?

[allanyed]

Clogger

I use a 10" table saw to rip billets that can then easily be handled on my small (3") saw.  The waste in the form of saw dust from the 10" saw, if cutting thin sheets, can be as much as the yield of wood to be used.   I suppose it can be done, but I feel a lot more comfortable handling small pieces with the 3" saw compared to the 10".   If you want to rip small strips, say 1/8 X 1/4,  I think this would be difficult as well as possibly dangerous with the big saw.   I am curious to read replies from others.

[Thistle17]

Clogger I just can't bring myself to waste precious material by turning the kerf into saw dust. Having bought a boxwood billet recently (approximately 2 X 4 X 24) for $100 I find it a crime to cut that on conventional equipment even with a thin kerf saw blade. You would be better off cutting rough stock on a band saw and sending it through the Byrnes sander a few times as most of us do not have conventional wide belt thickness sanders in our shop.

Joe

[Matt D]

I used my 10” Jet table saw to mill all of the planks for my HMS Winchelsea.  It’s not ideal, but it can be done.  The hard part is that the fence is useless for trying to cut really thin pieces.  So I built an accessory table on top of the saw with a homemade fence.  I only needed two thicknesses: 3/64” and 1/16”, so the fence piece was just screwed in place.  As Joe said, I lose a lot to the wide kerf.  One thing I considered was buying a thin kerf 7-1/4” blade for it, but I haven’t made that move yet.  If your choice is to make due with the saw you have or don’t make a model, then make it work with the 10”.  Eventually, I will buy a model saw - probably a Byrnes.

[Ron Burns]

Hey guys,

Although I don't have a large table saw and a Byrnes saw literally coming in 4 days from now (thanks Jim and Donna!), I watched a video that was rather intriguing.  Kevin Kenny of Maximum Guitar Works is a luthier that first got my attention with his Byrnes saw review. He does a pretty good video on resawing and micro kerf large blades. Have a look here Maximum Guitar Works. The blade he is using is pricey. I think it was a 12 inch however, smaller ones are available. Looks to me that if one was to invest in a good blade it would last years and do all you need. I can only imagine the danger and pucker factor cutting 3/64 planks on a 12 inch blade!

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

Kerf width (directly related to sawdust production) should be kept too a minimum, and thinner blades take less effort to remove material.  Yet thin bandsaw blades have a tendency to 'wander' a bit unless highly tensioned on a machine made for cutting thin pieces.  A favorite of mine has been a 60 tooth 7 1/4" diameter carbide table saw blade with teeth (2.6 teeth per inch) that are a mere 1/16" wide.  The alternating off-set adds a little to this, but it cuts smoothly and easily - as long as the feed rate is on the slow side.  I've found these blades under a variety of trade names in hardware stores and supply centers.  

 

  I've recently seen a thin 60 carbide tooth blade that was 6 1/2" in diameter, which is about 2.9 t.p.i., and a 70 tooth 7 1/4" blade having 3.1 teeth per inch.  There is a large range of thicknesses that can be cut, and on a table saw that runs true (most are pretty good, but are some better - for more money, though) the cut is pretty smooth.  Yet there are still fine 'saw marks' that can be lightly sanded or scraped smooth.  Sharpness is essential, but the blades are not that expensive and can be resharpened - Harbor Freight sells a sharpening rig for D.I.Y. use.

 

  Now the best table saw blade for cutting thin strips from stock no more than 1 1/8" thick on a table saw (in my experience) is the Sears Craftsman 'Kromedge' veneer saw blade.  It has 200 teeth on a 7 1/4" diameter blade (8.8 t.p.i.) and is precision ground (likely a double disc process)  on both sides of the periphery to 3/32".  The teeth have the slightest off-set, since they are fine (something like 1/8" gullets) but the kerf is still less than 1/8".  The body of the blade is a little thicker, so there is a 'shoulder' where the diameter thins around the periphery when ground on both sides - limiting the depth of cut to about 1 1/8".  The thicker body of the blade is more stable in use than thinner bodied blades, and the centripetal force makes the blade 'want' to stay straight when spinning.  I don't know if they are still making this blade - perhaps available on line?  Resharpening might be possible a couple of times, but by a pro with the right piece of equipment since the D.I.Y. sharpener only works on 'common' blade types with deep gullets.

  

[Roger Pellett]

My 10in Delta Contractors Saw is my go to tool for all ripping.   I have a lifetime supply ship model quality hardwood in my stash (If I run out, I'll consider my self fortunate!) so I'm not concerned with saw kerf.  Relative to other woodworking activities that I've engaged in during my lifetime, dust is not excessive, although I just modified the saw to collect it.

 

The Sears Kromedge Thin Rip Veneer blade described by Snug Harbor Johnny above was the blade used by modelers like Harold Hahn before availability of the Preac and Byrnes minirature saws.  I still have a couple and they can be found on EBay.   There are also many quality new blades on the market that you might consider. I also have and use a Rockler Thin Rip guide that mounts in the mitre groove and eliminates the need to have the thin strips between the fence and the saw blade.  IMHO the Rockler guide also makes this potentially dangerous tool easier to use.

 

I have a Byrnes saw too.  For a new prjoject that I am considering I will use the 10in saw to cut leaves from hardwood billets and the Byrnes saw to cut the planks from the leaves, but there is no reason why with the proper setup, zero clearance inserts, and saw blades your 10in saw cannot produce quality ship model planking.

 

Roger

Edited April 10, 2021 by Roger Pellett

[TBlack]

I, too, have a 10" Rockwell Delta saw (for 50 years!) and have not worried about kerf loss, but I've never spent $100 on a 2' piece of wood. I'm learning 

a lot about saw blades and Thin Rip guides.

Tom

[Blackreed]

I didn’t see any mention of heat, the thinner the blade, not only wander but heat as well.

Good blade is the key.

I wouldn’t hesitate to grab a piece of walnut from the fire wood pile and run it through my big table saw, that’s where beautiful wood comes from.

You need to make yourself a zero tolerance spacer for the blade.

The better the blade the better the product, the faster the product and usually the cooler the blade stays.

I even order my lexan and plexiglass based on the width of my blade and most often adjust accordingly from there and never based on my saw dust.

97% of my wood is hardwood and is free.

I’ve even cut veneers that were 4 inches thick 16 inches wide and 8 feet long into 1/8 inch thick slices 4 inches wide and 8 feet long. I make all my wainscoting, flooring, steps, door trim, wagon parts, model truck beds, rail loads...

my small saw is a dremel and that to has a $40 blade(micromark) My only dislike is that the height of the blade is not adjustable, other than that it’s awesome.

 

[grsjax]

Using a hollow ground planer blade in a table saw you can cut pieces as thin a .04" thick.  A zero tolerance insert and a precision fence is required.  Using a sliding table is better.  Still have a large kerf but for some common woods that isn't a big problem.

[Bob Cleek]

One important feature that doesn't seem to have been mentioned is maximum depth of cut. To me, that's a significant  consideration in choosing a small table saw. I believe the 8"  thin-kerf blades are only thinned on their outside edges sot they won't cut any more than the 3" saws, either. It would seem the stock 4" blade on the Byrnes saw gives an inch more depth of cut than any of the other options.

[clogger]

Grsjax

1 hour ago, grsjax said:

Using a hollow ground planer blade in a table saw you can cut pieces as thin a .04" thick.  A zero tolerance insert and a precision fence is required.  Using a sliding table is better.  Still have a large kerf but for some common woods that isn't a big problem.

What/How? do you use a hollow ground plane blade?

[Roger Pellett]

There is little question that the best combination for producing ship model timbers and planking would be a high quality 14in or larger bandsaw outfitted with the necessary fence and rip blade, a Byrnes thickness sander, and a Byrnes table saw.  Jim Byrnes describes the process for using these in his post above.

 

Not everyone is able to afford these high quality tools, or wants to buy them.  In my case I don’t think that Galloping Gertie, my 1975 14in Sprunger Bros bandsaw can be tuned up to produce the necessary accuracy, and at this stage in my life don’t want to invest in a new one.

 

So, the question being considered is whether quality ship models can be built using ordinary shop power tools.  The answer is that exceptional models have been built in the past using these tools and still can be.

 

I would not try to rip a 2in thick billet of pear wood using a hollow ground veneer blade.  Fortunately, some things change for the better. For example, Woodcraft has just announced a new line of 10in saw blades in their proprietary Wood River brand.  The description of one would indicate that it might meet our needs.  I intend to order one and to give it a try.

 

Roger

 

 

[mnl]

On 4/11/2021 at 12:43 PM, Roger Pellett said:

I don’t think that Galloping Gertie, my 1975 14in Sprunger Bros bandsaw can be tuned up to produce the necessary accuracy,

 

 

I expect it could be fairly easily. The first thing to check is the speed, it is probably turning way too fast, aim for 500ish ft/min, change motor and/or drive sheave accordingly. Better guides are also probably in order. At that age you may also need to replace the tires.