Borodino by RN77 - Dom Bumagi - 1/100 - CARD

[RN77]

Hi Folks

Am new to this forum as I only registered a few months ago and this will be my first post. 

 

I have spent a lot of time drooling over some build diaries and am in awe of the amount of talent and skill on display. 
 

Thinking I may have left it a bit late in life to get into this hobby. 
 

Anyway I have been inspired by the build log of Captain Slogs Borodino. 
 

The way the “skeleton” is assembled keeping everything squarish seems like a good start.

 

Down side for me is the smaller parts. Seems like you need a lot of patience and good eyesight to achieve the desired effect. 
Plus the fact it is made of card keeping the build clean would be challenging for me. 

I managed to purchase 1/200 Borodino from the Ukraine

 

As I have access to a photocopier I have magnified the templates by 200% on to glossy card.
 

The templates for the hull were cut out and glued onto 2mm thick mdf and I am now in the process off cutting them out with a scroll saw and finishing them off with a disc sander. 
 

Will post pics of progress once I work out how to do it

 

Thanks for looking

[mtaylor]

Welcome to MSW.  I hope you'll do a formal into in the New Member Intro area to tells abit about yourself, etc.  https://modelshipworld.com/forum/3-new-member-introductions/

 

I'm looking forward to seeing your log.

[Keith Black]

RN, welcome to MSW. I look forward to seeing your work. 

[ccoyle]

When you say "from the Ukraine," I'm guessing that this is the Orel kit?

[Captain Slog]

I look forward to following this build log with Borodino being an obvious favourite of mine.

 

Chris, I am guessing this is the Dom Bumagi kit as I think Orel do a couple of the other 'Borodino' class ships but forget which ones.

 

Perhaps this log should be moved to the scratch build section as it sounds like he is using the Borodino kit as a basis for scaling up to 1/100?

 

Cheers

Slog

[ccoyle]

Ah, I forgot about Dom Bumagi. This log can stay in the kit section -- it's still the same kit, just bigger.

[RN77]

Hi Folks

Thanks for comments

 

Yes it is the Dom Bumagi version apologies for not being clear

 

Made a start on cutting out the templates

 

As you can see in the 3rd photo the line representing where you are meant to cut away the area on the two parts making up the keel does not align

 

I thought it may have been a hiccup when enlarging on the photocopier and was going to recopy them again tomorrow.

 

I checked the keel parts on the original template and found that the line did not line up either..so no worries there then lol

 

Will try uploading pics now

Thanks for popping in

[yvesvidal]

Very interest project of a great ship.

 

Yves

[GrandpaPhil]

Looking forward to seeing this build!

[RN77]

Good afternoon Folks

Thanks for comments and thumbs up...appreciated

 

Cut out the slots on the deck ....took longer than I thought using Swan Norton blades, fingers still intact but gained a blister after half an hour

 

I'm just a wee softy lol

 

As the templates were glued to the mdf with a carpet spray they peeled away quite easily

 

I did manage to break the fwd deck where frame 1 goes when trying to cut out the slots in the narrow area but just glued it together again

 

As that area will get filled not too concerned

 

The idea of doubling the size of the templates to 1/100 scale was to prevent me from making silly mistakes like that but heyho

 

Dry fitting parts to make sure they are not too tight a fit and are going to be square

 

Thanks for looking

[RN77]

Good Evening Folks

 

Continuing with the lower hull.....the lighting in my shed does nothing to aide my lack of photographic skills 😜

 

Progress so far

 

[Captain Slog]

Coming along nicely. Have you decided how you are going to ‘plate’ it when the frame work is done?

[RN77]

4 hours ago, Captain Slog said:

Coming along nicely. Have you decided how you are going to ‘plate’ it when the frame work is done?

Hi Captain Slog 

I will firstly put a reduced frame either side of each frame

 

This will give me an edge to lay “planks” on proud of the frames using balsa or mdf strips

 

This will then be sanded down flush with the main frames. Hence the red felt tip…STOP sanding 

 

This should hopefully give me a good surface for using thin planks of wood for “planking” the outer hull as concerned not to make it too thick increasing the size of the hull.

 

Also was thinking of “plating” as per the card model using the glossy card??

Not sure if that is a good idea but it would have a ready made smooth surface. 

 

Sounds a bit long winded🤒 but it keeps me occupied 

[Captain Slog]

Ah that’s good, planking between the ribs will give you a solid basis to cover without blowing out the hull dimensions.  Personally I think the second covering with some kind of sheet material (paper, card, styrene etc) would be quicker and easier to produce a smooth finish as you say.

 

When you come to construct the upper hull framework just be mindful of ribs OSp 12a & OSp 12b.  These are doubled together when fitting and although different in shape its not clear from the plans the order. The rear one dictates the curved tumblehome on the rear section of hull.  I had them wrong way round when dry fitting but noticed in time when it came time to glue.

[RN77]

Good Afternoon Folks

 

Thanks for the "heads up" Captain Slog very much appreciated

 

 

Decided to continue with the lower hull rather than continuing with the upper decks framework

 

I photocopied the frame templates at 196% and glued them to 3mm mdf

 

I considered removing the horizontal decks but I must have got glue on them as they would not slip out

 

Now I have to quarter each reduced frame thats eight pieces per frame. Lucky me🤪

 

Maybe just as well as the deck helps keep the frames squareish.  That should keep me busy for a while

Thanks for lookin'

[RN77]

Good Afternoon Folks

As this part of the build can get a bit tedious for me I thought I would spread it throughout the week, doing a wee bit at a time.

 

This would then give me my Sunday morning time in the shed listening to the radio to start filling in the hull.

 

Unfortunately the clocks went back an hour last weekend so by the time I get home its dark.

Makes it less appealing for me to head to the shed after tea. Too comfy in the house.🤗

 

The styrene tube is only there at the moment so I don't clog up the holes with glue.Giving it a wee twist now and again as the glue dries.

 

Being a Scotsman I didn't want to throw away the sawdust.🤑It can be mixed with glue and used as a filler when required.

 

The bow and stern sections will be filled in completely with balsa

 

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by RN77
spelling

[kriszmesz]

Oh, I've realized just now that this is a new line of  reports . I wish you a lot of success especially with skinning the lower hull. This is my most worrysome section. 

[mikegr]

nice clean work. Hull looks not easy for a beginner. I suggest you work with balsa than MDF for plating the hull as the latter has some issues with humidity and need some special treatment. Balsa is the no1 alternative for us that our modelling wood market is restricted.

[RN77]

14 hours ago, mikegr said:

nice clean work. Hull looks not easy for a beginner. I suggest you work with balsa than MDF for plating the hull as the latter has some issues with humidity and need some special treatment. Balsa is the no1 alternative for us that our modelling wood market is restricted.

Hi mikegr

Yes I have some sheets of balsa that I am cutting into strips, this should give a smoother hull once sanded

than if I used mdf. (Out to the shed at the weekend to start gluing)

When sanding mdf I think the fibres separate leaving a “fluffy” surface. 
 

As for this particular model being suitable for a beginner, I am building in stages so if I make a pigs ear of it I can try that section again as I have copied the templates. 

I most certainly could not build this model out of card using the original parts, as I would only get one shot at getting it right. My lack of skills, patience and heavy handedness would soon see it in the waste paper basket.

Thanks for looking

[mikegr]

8 hours ago, RN77 said:

Hi mikegr

Yes I have some sheets of balsa that I am cutting into strips, this should give a smoother hull once sanded

than if I used mdf. (Out to the shed at the weekend to start gluing)

When sanding mdf I think the fibres separate leaving a “fluffy” surface. 
 

As for this particular model being suitable for a beginner, I am building in stages so if I make a pigs ear of it I can try that section again as I have copied the templates. 

I most certainly could not build this model out of card using the original parts, as I would only get one shot at getting it right. My lack of skills, patience and heavy handedness would soon see it in the waste paper basket.

Thanks for looking

I am building my first project from a card model to wood and there are some things to be considered for a successful make. 

Spare plans is a must. I already ruined a complete hull(for other reason) so i restart now.

One key factor is to adjust thickness of wood accordingly. For example if you use a 3 mm wood for deck you need to calculate this to the total hull height (as paper deck has almost 0 thickness). Otherwise you need to use thin woods. There are quite thin and strong woods to work with starting at just 0.4 mm. However they are not available in many countries and the cost is considerable. Balsa below 1.5mm thick is very fragile unless you harden it with chemicals, like resin or other.

Edited November 12, 2021 by mikegr

[RN77]

Thanks for your concerns mikegr

 

Another one of my reasons for scaling up to 1/100 is the wooden decking.

 

If I lay the deck template flush with the top of the frames rather than sitting on top this should allow me to use 2 mm planks without gaining any height.

I am not too concerned about gaining or losing a mm here or there on the hull as I am doing this for enjoyment to see how I get on—and a learning curve😋plus I won’t tell anyone 😂

 

Using a thin veneer,if any sanding is required then I think I would lose the caulking effect between the planks and the deck would become one piece.

 

I can get confused with the debates I have read —some say that at such and such a scale you would not be able to see the separate planks.If that is the case then why can I see rivets etc.

 

Or in this model the card shows small details on the upper hull but the lower is plain.

 

Thinking about it too much makes me dizzy.

 

More than happy just to go along with the designers interpretation perhaps using a bit of modellers license if I get brave enough

 

[RN77]

On 11/10/2021 at 3:16 PM, kriszmesz said:

Oh, I've realized just now that this is a new line of  reports . I wish you a lot of success especially with skinning the lower hull. This is my most worrysome section. 

Mine too

Have made a start with filling in between the frames.

Now beginning to realise that she is pretty big. Who's idea woz this to double the size🙄

This stage will take longer than anticipated.

 

The planks are glued down only where the elastic bands are

 

Thanks for lookin'

 

 

[RN77]

Good Evening Folks

 

Found this stage to be a bit of a slog (sorry Captain)filling in between the frames.

 

Nearly there but thought I would post my progress so far and had a slight mishap when lifting into position for photo shoot.  Nothing that can't be fixed tho 🤔

The planking is very thin after sanding in some areas

 

I could have avoided this by

1. making the frames smaller and thicker to allow for planking on the outside

2.being more careful in the first place when fitting the edges to each side of the frames to make sure planks would  not be too proud of the frames

 

Thinking about covering the hull in thin paper once planking is complete to offer support to any area that is thinly planked.

Pretty sure I read that idea somewhere

 

Still have to spend a lot of time slowly going round the aft area by the prop shafts

 

Thanks for looking' and if I don't speak to you soon have a Merry Xmas and see you's in the New Year

[GrandpaPhil]

Looking good!  

That’s unfortunate about the section that staved in.

[lmagna]

Very nice work on getting the hull shape RN

I think that if it was me, (After getting the hole in the hull fixed) I would be tempted to use some VERY thin fiberglass cloth and cover the entire hull. That would restore some of the thickness you feel you have sanded away while restoring some strength. At the same time it would create a surface that when sanded down would create the smooth surface you want.

 

Either way good luck and hope your Christmas is all you hope for.

[Captain Slog]

Well done for sticking it out, its looking great.  I know what a slog it is as I half heartedly attempted the same with a paper Bismarck I started years ago but got fed up with it. Saying that my next paper hull will get the same treatment to prevent denting the paper and having to fill and paint.

 

Good idea about the fibreglass. Perhaps its possible to just use the resin component of it although have zero knowledge in all things GRP.

 

Cheers

Slog 

[RN77]

Evening Folks

Thanks for comments and thumbs up

 

I have been making slow progress with shaping round the prop shaft area ...don't think I will get that finished till sometime next year🙄

 

Made some thin sanding sticks to make it easier sanding round this area...nearly there

 

Decided to start planking the outside of hull before I put my fingers thru the thin balsa again😝

 

I am using 1mm thick strip wood and when this is sanded should not make the hull too "fat"

 

Definitely feels a lot more sturdy in the areas that have been done

 

Best wishes for the New Year

[RN77]

Good Afternoon Folks

thought I would post my progress after 4 weeks since my last post and still not completed the outer planking but getting there ever so slowly

 

In order to stop me sanding flat spots on the circumference of the prop shaft I added a metal washer.

Stop sanding when you hear that 'horrible screech of sandpaper on metal🤮

 

The original model templates show no depth of detail for the lower hull but I have come across RGL's model at 1/350 scale with some nice hull plate detail etc

Thinking about having a go at mimicking the detail

Or maybe less is best incase I get carried away

 

Have sanded some of the hull and I think I can get away with adding more depth to it

Thanks for lookin'

[mtaylor]

Looks to be going well.   BTW, what this that mallet used for?   I hope not driving in your planking pins.

[RN77]

18 hours ago, mtaylor said:

Looks to be going well.   BTW, what this that mallet used for?   I hope not driving in your planking pins.

Hi Mark thanks for looking

Couldn't find my big hammer which is just as well as I can be a bit heavy handed at times

 

Taking a break from the lower hull I spent a pleasant afternoon cutting out the frames for the upper hull