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Milling machine from Little Machine Shop, anyone??


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I am interested in getting a small mill. Looked at several and am favoring the LMS model 4660.

 

Does anyone have experience with this relatively new mill?

 

What I like about it is that it has a maximum speed of 5000 rpm, a wider table than others I have looked at, a solid fixed column, and other features that might be right for modeling projects. Having a high speed is important to me.

Here is the web site https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=4660&category=

 

Comments please . . . . Oh, the price is about $100 less than the Microlux from MM.

Jay

 

Current build Cross Section USS Constitution  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10120-cross-section-forward-area-of-the-uss-constitution/

Finished USS Constitution:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/103-uss-constitution-by-modeler12/

 

'A picture is worth a  . . . . .'      More is better . . . .

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Looks interesting, Jay.  The only thing I can see that raised my eyebrows was motor size.. 250 W vs 500 W for many others.  Definitely get the tool package as the accessories can get pricey really fast. 

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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Therein Is part of issue I have with Proxxon... size.  Not much movement in any axis.  I do love the speed as there's really not any mills straight off the shelf that hit that kind of rpm, sadly.  And, any mods to up the speed, usually kill the warranty as eating bearings becomes a real possibility.

 

<rant on>  Why can't we have a good size, good table movement, good head movement, AND rpm?  Oh.. and accuracy of movement.  I saw a HF unit that had so much slop in the table movement, it was useless.  <rant off> <walks away grumbling and kicking scrap wood>

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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<rant on>  Why can't we have a good size, good table movement, good head movement, AND rpm?  Oh.. and accuracy of movement.  I saw a HF unit that had so much slop in the table movement, it was useless.  <rant off> <walks away grumbling and kicking scrap wood>

 

Mark,

 

You might consider a portal milling machine. I have this one (German made). I don't know if they export to the States though, but there may be similar ones at your end.

 

Lou

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I've linked to this one before, looks like a very nice small mill to me. If 5k rpm is fast enough for your needs I'd say go for it. The MF70 is not in the same class as this machine. At only 7kg it's easy to move around if you're short of space and the 20k rpm will be good for some jobs but the 5k rpm lowest speed is a bit limiting if you ever intend to cut metal. At 48kg the Micro Mill is not something you'll want to move around very often but mass is a good thing to have in a milling machine although you'll still need to bolt it down. As said by many others before, you can do small stuff on a big (ger) machine but but you can't do big stuff on a small one. Don't forget that what you're buying is a machine tool, albeit a small one. And if you buy the right one you'll soon find out how useful it is to make your own jigs and tools with it. My only concern is which model to buy, the one with the ER16 Collet or the Number 2 Morse Taper? If you're in any doubt try and find some reviews on the net and see what others have to say about the machine.

 

Update. I forgot to add the link for those in the UK interested in this machine.

 

http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Machines-Accessories/Milling-Machines/SIEG-Super-X1LP-Mill/SIEG-Super-X1LP-Mill

Edited by Q A's Revenge
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Thanks you all with those comments.
 

When I looked at 'various machines' I was comparing the MM Microlux with similar models from Harbor Freight and Grizzly.

At least the LMS version has twice the speed of others, has the rigid column and larger table with more movement in the X and Y.

I am aware of the small motor, but since this is not for 'production' and I know I will be taking small bites at a time, I think (and hope) that I can get by with it. I am going to raise this issue with LMS though.
 

Reading about the spindle type and the difference in the Morse taper and ER016 design, it seems that the ER-16 is a more secure way to hold the tools and if I am going to run the machine mostly near the high speeds I am inclined to spend the extra $40.
 

One of the first things I intend to do is design and make an adapter for my high speed Dremmel type tool. I did that on my old drill press and it worked fine but not with great accuracy. I would be able to use the table movement and the Z axis for the Dremmel without running the mill. So the very high speeds used for small drills and others could still be handled on a mill/drill-press. I cannot imagine that cutting grooves with end-mills smaller than 1/8 inch is practical, or is it??? There is always a possibility to do that with round jewelers saws. Now I am talking about wood and perhaps brass but not steel.

 

Lots to learn, but I am still in favor of the machine from LMS.

Q. I have a large assortment of router bits. Can I use those on a small mill? The shaft sizes are both 1/2 and 1/4 inch.

 

I don't have a lot of space and a larger mill is out of the question. It has to be able to fit on an existing bench.

Jay

 

Current build Cross Section USS Constitution  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10120-cross-section-forward-area-of-the-uss-constitution/

Finished USS Constitution:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/103-uss-constitution-by-modeler12/

 

'A picture is worth a  . . . . .'      More is better . . . .

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Jay, I have used carbide router bits on brass and aluminum on my regular mill.

 

Michael

Current builds  Bristol Pilot Cutter 1:8;      Skipjack 19 foot Launch 1:8;       Herreshoff Buzzards Bay 14 1:8

Other projects  Pilot Cutter 1:500 ;   Maria, 1:2  Now just a memory    

Future model Gill Smith Catboat Pauline 1:8

Finished projects  A Bassett Lowke steamship Albertic 1:100  

 

Anything you can imagine is possible, when you put your mind to it.

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The smallest end mill I've used in my mill is 1/16" and it worked fine, bearing in mind the highest speed on my mill is about 2400 rpm. I've used router bits in my mill as well but only on wood. Not sure about the the ER16/MT2 option. Tool changing should be quicker with the ER16 but I'm not sure it's any more secure. MT2 could actually be a bit more rigid and may give you more options for tooling - not sure what's available in your area with straight shanks otherwise. Using a drawbar with the MT2 could be a bit of a pain if you're only using end mills/slot drills. The biggest collet for MT2 is 12mm or 1/2". The biggest collet for ER16 is 10mm or 3/8".

Good idea on the Dremmel adaptor, I've seen that done before and plan to make one for my mill!

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This is an example for tooling.

 

http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Cutting-Tools/Slitting-Saws-and-Arbors/Stub-Milling-Arbors

 

Most of them are MT2/3 fitting with some R8 at the bottom. They have added a new parallel shank one but it's 1/2" so too big to fit into an ER16 Collet.

 

This is only one example from my area, so best check to see whats available where you are. I find Slitting saws very useful by the way!

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Thanks again 'Revenge'.
 

I live in the US and LMS also offers a tooling package that includes just about everything I will need. The drawback is that the maximum collet size is 3/8", so my 1/2 router bits won't fit. I do have several with a 1/4 inch shaft. Thanks Michael for your comment.

 

One more comment about the Little Machine Shop. I have dealt with them before when I needed replacement parts for my mini lathe. The company specializes in that but also offer some mini lathes and mills. As a result they show lots of details on their web site about other manufacturer's products. They also have a great series of 'how to do' or teaching aids. The latter is the main reason I mention this.

Jay

 

Current build Cross Section USS Constitution  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10120-cross-section-forward-area-of-the-uss-constitution/

Finished USS Constitution:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/103-uss-constitution-by-modeler12/

 

'A picture is worth a  . . . . .'      More is better . . . .

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You could use your 1/2" router bits if you went for the MT2 version. You could always add a MT2 to ER collet chuck for quick cutter changing.

 

http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Collets/ER-Milling-Collet-Chucks

 

You can choose from MT2 to ER16, ER20 or ER25.

 

Assuming tooling like this is available where you are*

 

From what I've seen on other sites LMS have a pretty good reputation.

 

*Update. Yes they are available, at least in ER25.

 

https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2230&category=-421559299

Edited by Q A's Revenge
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Thanks again Revenge.

Now this makes a lot of sense to go with the MR2 version. It seems that with this 'adapter' there are more options. I wonder if this takes up more Z axis space. I will have to look into this more.

Jay

 

Current build Cross Section USS Constitution  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10120-cross-section-forward-area-of-the-uss-constitution/

Finished USS Constitution:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/103-uss-constitution-by-modeler12/

 

'A picture is worth a  . . . . .'      More is better . . . .

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I expect the ER16 version of the mill takes up more Z than the MT2 with a finger collet fitted. I also expect the MT2 version with an ER collet chuck fitted takes up a bit more Z than the ER16 version if that makes sense! Only way to tell though is to go see one or ask LMS if they can provide the info.

For what it's worth I have an MT3 ER32 Collet chuck for my mill but have never used it. I'm so used to just putting cutters straight into finger collets. It takes more time to change cutters but it's more rigid and preserves the Z. Depends how you work though and what your expectations are.

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Sold.
I am not going to use this for a production operation and to change from one collet to another should not be a big deal. I have done it several times on my lathe. The cutters I have (besides the router bits) are all 3/8 inch shaft, so that will be the mainstay.

Jay

 

Current build Cross Section USS Constitution  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/10120-cross-section-forward-area-of-the-uss-constitution/

Finished USS Constitution:  http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/103-uss-constitution-by-modeler12/

 

'A picture is worth a  . . . . .'      More is better . . . .

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Looking at the design & spec it looks like it's a rebadged version of this machine:

 

SEIG Super X1LP

 

It's one of the many coming out of China but it is one of the better machines.  We've several Seig dealers in the UK and the customer feedback is generally very positive.

 

Regards,

 

Row

1:28 Scale J class yacht 'Enterprise' (R/C)

Build log currently at: http://www.rcsailing.net/forum1/showthread.php?6264-1-28-J-Class-Enterprise-build-log

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It's an interesting machine that only seems to be sold by a couple of companies at the moment, LMS in the US and Arceurotrade in the UK.

The spec between the X1LP and the £110 more expensive X2P is very similar. The X2P has about an inch more "Z" and a similar increase in throat. The table sizes and movements are the same. The X2P also has a 500W 2500 rpm motor compared to the 250W 5000 rpm on the X1LP. The X2P is also 10Kg heavier and curiously out of stock in both versions at Arceuro. Arceurotrade also sell a cheaper X1L machine but this has a (not very rigid) tilting column and a two speed gearbox that some complain is quite noisy.

 

All in all the the LMS HiTorque Micro Mill or Arceurotrade X1LP looks like a pretty good machine for the money, especially if the higher speed appeals. Not sure how long this machine has been on the market though so we'll have to see what buyers have to say about it once they've had time to play with it for a few weeks!

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