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davec

Dave's Echo Cross Section - Finished

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Thanks for the likes and the kind comments.  I’ve added the bitt pins.  They look a little out of alignment in the pictures.  I will check when I get home tonight – I think it is distortion from taking pictures with my cell phone.  They looked square when I installed them.  I got to use some really neat brass clamps that I got a few years ago at a club auction - they worked perfectly.

It is nice to be back at work.  I switched to copper nails so I can blacken in place (thanks Ed Tosti and his incredible Young America log), which now that I have gotten the hang of, works really well.  The sheaves on the sides of the bitts were turned separately.  The ones built into the bitts are simulated.  Finish has been applied to the half of the deck that isn’t getting planked.  I have holly planks ripped and ready for installation on the main deck next.  I will probably not treenail as I didn’t on the lower deck. 

I had some difficulty with the jeer bitt pin locations. The mast step and well widths were made to the plans and agreed with the primary sources, but this ended up with the jeer bit pins sitting on top of the side walls of the well.  Not sure if I have them in the right place and the original shipwrights built the well around the bottom of the bitt pin or didn’t continue the wall up this high, or if I did something wrong.  In any event, I notched  the sides of the bottoms of the bitt pins so I could move them a little laterally and make everything fit right.  It was too late to modify the well without tearing out a huge amount of work.  I’m also trying to work around the rebates I cut for the binding strakes.  I thought it was a good idea to show them off on a cross section, but didn’t know enough about them when I cut them.  They don’t quite run just outside the hatches. 

Both decisions reflect a new approach to the project – I saw my first date stamp for my log (which actually started even earlier, before MSW went down in 2013) and realized I am over five years into this.  I've decided to live with small mistakes already made and not do unnecessary major redo’s moving forward.  This was supposed to be a focused learning experience (which it absolutely has been) and not a 6 year odyssey.   I would really like to mark the move to the new house by completing this project and being able to start a new project in the new workshop.  I have learned a ton on this, and it is time for a new project, especially as I don’t think I will have the long pauses that punctuated this project on the next one.

Dave

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Edited by davec

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Dave, Nice job.  I ran into a similar issue with the pumps intersecting the walls of the well.  You seem to have made a reasonable adjustment (and maybe not the last).

Maury

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The upper deck is planked. Cutting the planks around the pumps was interesting.  I wasn’t sure what supports the planks over the openings on either side of the mast step. I put some supports in even though I didn’t see them on any of the plans.  The planks are holly.  I will put some clear water-based polyurethane over them, which I used on the lower deck and didn’t change the whiteness of the wood significantly.

The treenails were my first experiment with bamboo.  Not sure what took me so long to try it.  I have been using the same type wood as the plank to minimize the contrast between the plank and treenail so it wouldn’t look too busy.  The bamboo is MUCH easier to draw through the drawplate. It seems to have a reasonable contrast with the background. I drew the bamboo down to the .018 hole (second smallest on the Byrnes drawplate) and used a .020 drill.  The other experiment was marking the locations on the model, then taking the planks off and drilling, treenailing, and sanding the planks prior to installing them on the model.  I was pretty happy with it – it was a lot easier than trying to navigate the drill near the bulwarks or bitt pins. 

I have a few more rows of planks on the bulwarks and outer hull.  I need to see how bamboo treenails will look on these planks.  It they look funny because they don’t match the pear, cherry, and boxwood treenails that I have already used, I will finish with the same.  If it isn’t too noticeable, I will finish with bamboo.  The next model will be treenailed with bamboo- just so much easier to work with. 

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When drawing bamboo down to 0.018" they are barely perceptible on the model, especially if you sand the plank before installing them on the model. On your next model, where you'll have thousands of them, make sure you bamboo stock is fairly uniform. I ran out while making my last model and the replacement bamboo was decidedly darker.

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Planked the quarterdeck bulwark with ebony and pear and installed the scuppers.  No finish applied yet.  Scuppers are 2 and 2.5 mm copper refrigerating tubing.  I’m becoming a big fan of copper – so much less finicky to blacken than brass.  I started working on the decorative moldings and fenders.  Spent most of the weekend making a planksheer hance that fit right.  Still having a lot of trouble scraping the molding neatly around curves, particularly the tight curve on the hance. Looking for suggestions.

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Somehow it has been a year since the last update.  We spent a year renovating a house and moved last February, and it took a little while to set up the workshop.   I seem to be back in some sort of building rhythm since last month.  Outside details are done including chain plates and all the moldings and rails.  Chain plates were a big step forward for me in terms of metal work and silver soldering.  They were an experiment in copper so I could shape them around the deadeyes and blacken them in place with liver of sulfur.  Deadeyes are ebony.

The pumps were a challenge.  Someplace along the way (probably about 3 years) ago I miscalculated on the path of the pump shafts and they ended up a few millimeters further inboard of the bitt pins than they should have been.  I also had some of the decorative shaping on the bitt pins at the same height that the rhodings needed to be attached.  I ended up adding some shims between the rhodings and the bitt pins.  Hopefully some 18th century shipwright had the same problem and solved it the same way.  The pump shafts and rhodings are brass.  My silver soldering continues to get better, and Greg’s post about metal blackening, particularly the sparex, was unbelievably helpful getting chemical blackening I was happy with.

I have an old Vanda Lay duplicator for my lathe.  It has sat in a drawer since a really frustrating attempt to duplicate brass cannon barrels on my last model, which was an epic fail.  I tried it again on the quarterdeck balustrades, and found that it works really well on wood.

Base, pedestals, and quarterdeck beam are also done.  I’m a gun, quarterdeck breastwork, and ladder away from finishing.

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Edited by davec

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I have been thinking about the next project, and avoiding ones with lots of guns because I am intimidated by the repetition.  I think the only thing worse might be building just one.  The workshop turned into an armory this month.  These guns have lots of parts- I think I count 44 not including the rigging and gun barrel.  After figuring out how to make each part, I realized making more than one of each wouldn't have been too bad.  The barrel is not scratch - it is an Admiralty Models one that I bought when I purchased the plans from David and Greg.  It is beautifully turned, and it didn't make sense for me to try to turn one when I already had such a good one.  The wooden parts are all swiss pear, and most of the metal work is brass.  I used a few pieces of copper when I wanted to blacken in place.  All plans and dimensions were from TFFM.  Andrey Kudin's  Le Fleuron videos were also helpful (worth watching if you haven't seen them yet), particularly for rolling the axle caps and milling the ogee under the quoin- he has lots of neat techniques.  Getting much happier with my metal blackening and silver soldering, and lathe turning the axles and wheels worked much better than previous efforts - way less in the scrap bin than usual.

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Lovely work Dave. Can you imagine repeating it for anything larger than a sixth rate?  Fully agree with you about Kudin’s videos. They’re a treasure.

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Very nice, Dave. I have had the same experience. After making several parts in what I have thought to be exactly the same way as on a previous model, somehow, magically, they seem to come out better than the earlier ones.

 

Tony

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Thanks everyone for the likes and kind comments.  Greg - definitely agree that for anything more complicated that a sixth rate (or maybe even just one side of a sixth rate) this would start getting very tedious.

 

I've decided to add the gangway to the finished side.  It turned out to be good practice with patterns to get all the angles and joints on the knees right, and will make this model a little bit different from the other finished echo cross sections. gangway.jpg.5db979f26c370c42939c6a718d6d0bff.jpg

Will hold on installing until the gun rigging is complete and the gun installed - don't want to make access to installing all the rings and ringbolts difficult.  Hoping to get the breeching and gun tackles rigged and installed today before going back to work tomorrow.

 

Happy new year everyone!

 

Dave

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Posted (edited)

The gun is rigged and installed.  Rigging is morope left over from a prior build.  I bought a rope rocket from Chuck to make rope, and started putting it together on New Year’s Eve.  Got to the part where you need the really small Allen wrench, and found mine got lost in the move.  While I was digging around looking for it, I found he morope.  I’d forgotten how nice it looks, and how hard it is to work with.  Led to a few compromises.  The breech rope is a little on the short side.  It is 3 times the bore length like it is supposed to be, but that isn’t long enough to really reload the gun.  I tried making it longer, but didn’t like the way it looked – the morope just hangs in a non realistic way.  I also wanted to have the gun run out.  Morope doesn’t coil well (won’t absorb dilute white glue), so I frapped the tackles.  This was probably done for storage, not when they were run out, but I wasn’t sure what to do with the ends.  Not sure there is a right answer – can’t imagine there were situations where the gun was run out, but the rope was left in a coil on the deck.  I’m also not really happy with the hooks.  Even silver soldered, they look like bent wire.  The ringbolts should be recessed, but I didn’t think of it when I had better access to the bulwarks.  I couldn’t figure out how to do it now that the pumps and bits are in place.  Looking for suggestions for doing any of these things better next time (other than the obvious – use different rope material and recess the holes for the ringbolts at the same time I drill them).

 

I’ve got the gangway and knees ready to install.  The holes in the bulwark are for the locating pins for the knees. Completion in sight – very short list of incomplete tasks: need to slightly extend the bit pins the quarterdeck beam sits on (sometime a few years ago I made them about 1/16” short), make the quarterdeck and gangway railings, and ladder to the gangway.

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Edited by davec

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Posted (edited)

These are the best looking I've seen: http://www.propblur.com/store/p80/RigH1.html.  I ordered some of the smaller size. I would just bend the round part 90 degrees to the hook. 

 

Morope does look great but handles very poorly. Chuck's line of rope is fantastic.

 

Edited by dvm27
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Greg - agree those are amazing looking hooks.  Would love to know how he is able to photo etch rounded edges.

 

I’ve been working on the quarterdeck breastwork.  I turned the spindles on my lathe with a vandalay duplicator.  Was pretty pleased with how it worked.  It has been sitting in a drawer since a frustrating attempt to use it to turn brass cannon barrels 7 or 8 years ago.  Works much better on wood.spindle.jpg.2bbb99b2a218551e024dec5871a17056.jpg

 I cut the upper tenons with my preac table saw, then reset it and did the half lap joints.2023360274_cuttingtenon.jpg.09099707827d15828f7be8b47272b6b4.jpgtenon.jpg.b1568106c493dbf622d62ae31eba3169.jpg827874444_halflap.jpg.9ca7581637360302538530d2f9f4319d.jpg

The railings took a while.  I cut them to shape and scraped the molding around the edge.  I also used some escapement files on the molding around the end grain.  I drilled 1/16” holes at the centers of the posts, then filed square openings.   A square drill bit would be a really useful invention.  I bent the upper rail to shape.  The lower rail was much more delicate, and broke at one of the openings when I tried bending.  The curve is gentle enough that it held shape with the glue joints.

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I cut a form the shape of the quarterdeck beam and used it to glue the upper rail to the posts in a curve.  Once it was dry, I used spacers and glued the lower rail in place. I clamped it to the upper rail so it followed the same curve.  I glued it to the quarterdeck beam that I made a few years ago, drilled for the bolts, and brushed on minwax wipe on poly.

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I’m considering redoing.  I will be installing the gangway.  When I looked at the breastwork as drawn, it was a little narrow and left a gap between the end of the rail and the edge of the gangway.  I used the drawing in TFFM, which looked closer.  The clearances at the sides look a little narrow.  After I finished, I realized it was probably drawn on the NMM plans.  Sure enough it was, about halfway in between the two drawings in length.  I have the breastwork leaning in place in the picture.  The bit pins supporting them are a few mm too short, and will need some extensions.   I think I will install the gangway, and see how the spacing looks.  I’m assuming the crew was pretty thin – if it looks like it was usable, I will install it as is.  If not, will need to go back to filing square holes, which I’m not looking forward to.

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Michael - many thanks!

I need one waist stanchion, so spent the morning doing some metal work.  Very gratifying – got to use the taper attachment on my lathe for the first time.  The post is turned from 1/8” brass.  This was a major advance for me – no chatter, and got an acceptably smooth finish that took only a little sanding to get smooth.  Usually turning metal on the lathe is an exercise in frustration.  I cut the piece off about a scale 1” from the end of the taper to form the base.  The bracket that holds the rail was made from 1/8” bar stock.  I used a slitting blade to cut the slot, then raised the blade and parted the piece off.  Even the soldering worked right the first time.  I wanted to do more, but had so much go smoothly that I thought I should quit while I was ahead.  Will hopefully go back to the workshop later and mill the quarterdeck waterway, install and blacken the bolts in the quarterdeck breastwork, and blacken the stanchion.

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Breastwork installed.

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Quarterdeck installed on finished side.  I made and installed the waterway, then glued the planks together.  I made a cardstock pattern for where the notches for the stanchions needed to be.  I double back taped the decking to a piece of sacrificial wood, then made the notches with the table saw.

 

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Gangway knees, gangway, newel post, and railing installed.

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I'm working on the ladder to the gangway now.  Just the ladder, finish to the newel post and rail, stand, and touch up to complete.  

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20 hours ago, Chuck said:

It really looks fantastic.  Sharp looking model. :)

Chuck, 

 

I hope it will motivate you to resurrect the Cross-Section kit that you had in the back of your mind, at one time.

 

Yves

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Something very odd has happened.

 

My box of parts to install is empty.  I’ve come to the last page of the instructions.

 

Apparently – I’m done. It’s a little bit hard to believe.  I started the model Christmas 2012.  The build log started so long ago that it was on the initial MSW and was lost in the crash.  It was supposed to be an easy, short project to get me ready for building a full plank on frame model.  I thought it was only going to take a year or so, and was so overconfident that I started it before finishing Hannah. 

 

I was going back through my log, and found Ryland’s post really amusing:

On 2/25/2013 at 2:27 PM, Ryland Craze said:

Thanks for supporting the IPMS Show in Richmond this past Saturday. Maybe you can enter your Echo cross section in next year's show. :dancetl6:

He was correct, only 6 years off.  The model will be at the show in 2 weeks.

 

I was really happy with this as a project.  Many thanks to David and Greg for developing the plans and doing the framing workshops.  I learned an incredible number of things building the cross section, and am in a really different place as a modeler than before.  It made a great project incorporating a lot of different techniques and was nice because the incremental progress was always visible even though I had so many other things going on that I couldn’t work on it very regularly.

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Edited by davec

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Dave this is outstanding!  It came out really nice.  As a current member of the takes forever club I can understand taking a long time.  It is going to make a great showing at the IPMS.

 

So with all these new skills do you know what's up next?

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Good things take time. The important things are the journey and completion. Well done, Dave! That is a lovely result. Of course, the question now is, "what's next?"

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