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HMS Victory by dafi - Heller - PLASTIC - To Victory and beyond ...


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...hihihihihihi...

 

As a starter just something, most of you should know:

 

huehnerstange.jpg


By the way a very interesting german site about the picture where it was taken and the story about.

 

But back to my own roost. Then there were three ... 

 

Victory-Crew-150510_0441.jpg

 

... seen by the german Assembly Act it already is a mob, but I needed more ...

 

Victory-Crew-150513_0445.jpg

 

... so knocked off some heads and limbs, twisted bodies ...

 

Victory-Crew-150514_0460.jpg

 

... and reassembled them. Some got some coattails ...

 

Victory-Crew-150514_0461.jpg

 

... and all a nice washing in 50 shades of dirty-white. And all these basically out of the three basic models :-)

 

In the meantime my small shipyard worker and his lovely assistant were on the quest for the perfect sea chest ...

 

Victory-Crew-150514_0455.jpg

 

... and looks like the quest was successful by the sparkle in her eyes :-)

 

XXXDAn

Edited by dafi
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Some small thoughts about the life in between the guns.

 

First about the personal belongings of the sailors. Classically one thinks of the sailors chests. But in clearing for action maneuvering 800 chests into the hold? Logistically not the easiest task. Masefield reports that only officers were allowed a chest, for the sailors it was just a bag/kit.

 

A small trial shows, that only about 8 chests fit in the space but about 20 hammocks were positioned in this area ...

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0473.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0471.jpg

 

... so 1 man 1 chest is impossible and confirms Masefield. Also 800 bags are more easily cleared. In the empty space in between the chests still are missing some barrels of the ready to use provisions.

 

Then the thoughts about the benches: how to store them when not in use - as contemporary drawings show them with fix legs - and where did the mess store the things of daily use? Personal conclusion is to skip the benches and use the chests for stuff of daily use and for sitting - also shown in contemporary sources.

 

Masefield also reports that sometimes the sea bags were stowed in the orlop, possibly in the area of the carpenters walk and access being restricted to two times a day. I think could have worked for two deckers, but from breeding my own little maggots I have seen the space it takes - for my own taste a bit too much for a three decker with double the compliment. Space taken, that could otherwise been very useful especially on long voyages.

 

That is why I decided to test fit 20 bags in the area of each mess and it is easily fitted in between the hanging knees where there are no hammocks anyway.

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0484.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0482.jpg

 

And the stage is set :-)

 

XXXDAn
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Dafi,

 

Interesting. I have seen references to the fact that sailing ships would take hours to maneuver in to position to engage other ships. I can see from your work and research that whilst this was being done a similar length of time would be needed to ready the decks for action. To be able to observe this must have been like watching a disturbed ants' nest!

Ian M.

 

Current build: HMS Unicorn  (1748) - Corel Kit

 

Advice from my Grandfather to me. The only people who don't make mistakes are those who stand back and watch. The trick is not to repeat the error. 

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Ok, time to take a seat :-)

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0488.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0491.jpg

 

In NMM is documented, that the marines were positioned in front of the gunroom on two deckers.

 

large.jpg


 

The Trafagar Companion localises them on the Vic in front of the wardroom, means the middle deck. I checked and found that if all 120 marines were positioned just there, it would fill the area up to the mainmast. As the marines were also used to keep an eye upon the sailors, I split the group and positioned half of them in font of the gunroom, so the lower deck could be observed too. 

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0495.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0498.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0501.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0503.jpg

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0505.jpg

 

And suddenly it gets packed :-)

 

Victory-Crew-150515_0508.jpg

 

Now just missing the food, not that the good mood tilts ;-)

 

XXXDAn

Edited by dafi
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That's incredible Daniel. You can almost hear the conversation, it's so life-like!

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Incredible!

 

It looks quite cosy, this way. On the other hand, what when you are in the midst of the atlantic, wind force 8, waves of about 10 meters high.

Life must have been absolute hell in there..... What these little diorama's show -apart fom how things were don - is the degree of overcrowding in these ships....

 

Jan

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"It looks quite cosy, this way."

 

... and dark and stifling and humid and oppressive and smelly and loud and claustrophobic and ...

Edited by dafi
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You forgot... it's also very noisy.  There's a quote, which I am unable to find from Benjamin Franklin about a ship being like a prison... crowded, smelly, etc. but without the 'security'.  

 

Wonderful Daniel.   I just love the way this is coming alive and letting us see what it was like.

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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I don't know how much truth there is in it. But I've seen images of mess tables with the obligatory square place setting (3square meals) and bench seating. Hung from the roof beams so that when the ship is in rough water everything can swing and so less is lost on the floor.

 

Like I say I only remember this and cannot confirm it.

Edited by Izzy Madd

Ongoing builds,

 

SCutty Sark Revell 1/350 (Mini Nannie)

Cutty Sark Airfix 1/130 (Big Sis)

Will (Everard) Billings 1/65 but with wooden bottom, because I can

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awesome Daniel.........so much imagination in such a small space!  ;)

I yam wot I yam!

finished builds:
Billings Nordkap 476 / Billings Cux 87 / Billings Mary Ann / Billings AmericA - reissue
Billings Regina - bashed into the Susan A / Andrea Gail 1:20 - semi scratch w/ Billing instructions
M&M Fun Ship - semi scratch build / Gundalow - scratch build / Jeanne D'Arc - Heller
Phylly C & Denny-Zen - the Lobsie twins - bashed & semi scratch dual build

Billing T78 Norden

 

in dry dock:
Billing's Gothenborg 1:100 / Billing's Boulogne Etaples 1:20
Billing's Half Moon 1:40 - some scratch required
Revell U.S.S. United States 1:96 - plastic/ wood modified / Academy Titanic 1:400
Trawler Syborn - semi scratch / Holiday Harbor dual build - semi scratch

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You forgot... it's also very noisy.  There's a quote, which I am unable to find from Benjamin Franklin about a ship being like a prison... crowded, smelly, etc. but without the 'security

.....and with the option of drowning......

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Keep it up Daniel, can smell the broth from here.

 

Marines only had short dress coats, the tails were for officers.

 

Unless they are earlier than 1800, then fusiliers were stationed onboard.

 

but lovely detail.

 

frank :piratebo5:

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Sorry to throw a spanner in the works but most sea chest had rope beckets for handles didn't they? So that a single rope could then be threaded through one handle of say twentyor more then safely hauled aboard. As the becket would flex to hang best and would be fixed as each sailor made his own so as to know his stuff didn't end up in the harbour. And while they are a swine to make they are extremely rugged with there four or more layers of differing materials from leather to sailcloth as well as rope.

Ongoing builds,

 

SCutty Sark Revell 1/350 (Mini Nannie)

Cutty Sark Airfix 1/130 (Big Sis)

Will (Everard) Billings 1/65 but with wooden bottom, because I can

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Thank you guys for the feedbacks and the open eyes!

 

@ Frank: Thank you, the scissors already are working their way through the compliment :-)

 

@ Izzy: Beches still will be hanged on the inboard side - but still missing the beam ...

 

@ all: was the out side fixed on the hull or was it hanged too?

 

@ Izzy and Jan: Thank you for the nice pictures of the handles. I actually decided on the wooden handles, as the rope ones were too invisible. Will be a nice detail on the show chests.

 

Actually the pictures of Bray show plenty of chests used for people sitting around.

 

Cheers, Daniel

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From these images it seem just about everyone is right as there are bit of just about all comments within them.

 

From the hanging, but hinged swinging table, through both becketed and wooden handle boxes to benches and more. It's no surprise there are so many thoughts on the subjects.

 

post-18378-0-95122200-1432209202_thumb.jpg

 

post-18378-0-76139800-1432209218_thumb.jpg

 

post-18378-0-67999400-1432209234_thumb.jpg

Ongoing builds,

 

SCutty Sark Revell 1/350 (Mini Nannie)

Cutty Sark Airfix 1/130 (Big Sis)

Will (Everard) Billings 1/65 but with wooden bottom, because I can

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Even a better source is Bray´s album in NMM

 

Shows chest everywhere and being seated on :-)

large.jpg

 

large.jpg

 

large.jpg

large.jpg

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For that there will be no mutiny because of the empty plates, here is the proposal for the menu, according to historical sources:

 

First Course


Hors D'Oeuvres


Oysters

Second 

 

Course


Consommé Olga


Cream of Barley



 

Third Course


Poached Salmon with Mousseline Sauce, Cucumbers



 

Fourth Course


Filet Mignons Lili


Saute of Chicken, Lyonnaise

Vegetable Marrow Farci

 



Fifth Course


Lamb, Mint Sauce


Roast Duckling, Apple Sauce


Sirloin of Beef, Chateau Potatoes

Green Pea


Creamed Carrots


Boiled Rice


Parmentier & Boiled New Potatoes



 

Sixth Course


Punch Romaine



 

Seventh Course


Roast Squab & Cress



 

Eighth Course


Cold Asparagus Vinaigrette

 



Ninth Course


Pate de Foie Gras


Celery



 

Tenth Course


Waldorf Pudding


Peaches in Chartreuse Jelly


Chocolate & Vanilla Eclairs


French Ice Cream

 

 

*dream*

 

XXXDAn
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What???  No gruel???  No salt beef?? No salt pork???  No ship's biscuit with extra portions of weevil?????  :o   I'm appalled.  :(   NO.. make that I'm aghast!!!!  :stunned:

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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after a repast like that.........I don't think I'd be able to move  :D  :D   you feed your men very well....is there a sign up sheet? ;)

I yam wot I yam!

finished builds:
Billings Nordkap 476 / Billings Cux 87 / Billings Mary Ann / Billings AmericA - reissue
Billings Regina - bashed into the Susan A / Andrea Gail 1:20 - semi scratch w/ Billing instructions
M&M Fun Ship - semi scratch build / Gundalow - scratch build / Jeanne D'Arc - Heller
Phylly C & Denny-Zen - the Lobsie twins - bashed & semi scratch dual build

Billing T78 Norden

 

in dry dock:
Billing's Gothenborg 1:100 / Billing's Boulogne Etaples 1:20
Billing's Half Moon 1:40 - some scratch required
Revell U.S.S. United States 1:96 - plastic/ wood modified / Academy Titanic 1:400
Trawler Syborn - semi scratch / Holiday Harbor dual build - semi scratch

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after a repast like that.........I don't think I'd be able to move  :D  :D   you feed your men very well....is there a sign up sheet? ;)

There is always a place for volunteers. The only thing is you'd have to loose all but a few grams of body weight AND put up with the screams of other volunteers being redesigned and being redesigned by Barron Von Frankenmodeler. I just wonder if he's got the obligatory Igor hump and all in the right scale

 

No offence intended Dafi. Sorry if I have.

Ongoing builds,

 

SCutty Sark Revell 1/350 (Mini Nannie)

Cutty Sark Airfix 1/130 (Big Sis)

Will (Everard) Billings 1/65 but with wooden bottom, because I can

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what hump?

I yam wot I yam!

finished builds:
Billings Nordkap 476 / Billings Cux 87 / Billings Mary Ann / Billings AmericA - reissue
Billings Regina - bashed into the Susan A / Andrea Gail 1:20 - semi scratch w/ Billing instructions
M&M Fun Ship - semi scratch build / Gundalow - scratch build / Jeanne D'Arc - Heller
Phylly C & Denny-Zen - the Lobsie twins - bashed & semi scratch dual build

Billing T78 Norden

 

in dry dock:
Billing's Gothenborg 1:100 / Billing's Boulogne Etaples 1:20
Billing's Half Moon 1:40 - some scratch required
Revell U.S.S. United States 1:96 - plastic/ wood modified / Academy Titanic 1:400
Trawler Syborn - semi scratch / Holiday Harbor dual build - semi scratch

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And what does one do, if one has a bunch of hungry marines waiting for food and sitting in front of the gun room? Of course, one should take precautions.

 

Preparations include getting the equipment ready ...

 

Victory-marines_0662.jpg

 

... and the arms too ...

 

Victory-marines_0660.jpg

 

Victory-marines_4333.jpg

 

Victory-150525-crew_0640.jpg

 

... and to dress the guards.

 

Victory-150525-crew_0636.jpg

 

Ok I missed the epaulets ...

 

... but I shortened the tails according to the 1803 regulations. Just the officers had long tails, thanks to Foxy for that detail!

 

Victory-marines_0648.jpg

 

Victory-marines_0647.jpg

 

Victory-marines_0650.jpg

 

Victory-marines_0657.jpg

 

Larger than life :-)

 

And very important: place them in front of the gun room ...

 

Victory-marines_0721.jpg

 

Victory-marines_0693.jpg

 

Victory-marines_0737.jpg

 

... for that the Haute Volée can stay in peace and quiet. And the long tails of the to red men in the background clearly show. Yes, we are officers :-)

 

Cheers, DAniel
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Dafi, you may have answered this elsewhere so I apologise if you have....but...what are you going to do when the lower deck is 'done'?  Are you going to somehow keep the upper decks open so the detail can be see or will this be buried like the Pharaohs in the pyramids?  Love your work, you should consider publishing book with your photos to bring the Georgian navy to life.

Cheers,
 
Jason


"Which it will be ready when it is ready!"
 
In the shipyard:

HMS Jason (c.1794: Artois Class 38 gun frigate)

Queen Anne Royal Barge (c.1700)

Finished:

HMS Snake (c.1797: Cruizer Class, ship rigged sloop)

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Thank you Jason and Jan.

 

The return question is: Will the lower gun deck ever be 'done' ...

 

;-)

 

XXXDAn

Edited by dafi
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