Randy Todd
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My primary reference is William Crothers The American-Build Clipper Ship, p196. He cites a WH Webb text 'Plans of Wooden Ships...from 1840-1869' published in 1895. I was betting that Webb would have advanced to the Lloyds System for his last extreme clipper. After reading Crothers, it is apparent that the Admiralty System was very much alive in 1850s ship construction. Damn.
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Hi Ed, Iron bracing revisited. So I have my framework off my shipway and I have been fairing the outer hull (happy to see how sturdy the framework is at this point). I was intending to start the iron strapping next (before returning the model back to the shipway and finishing the hold) but now realize Young America's iron bracing was likely the Admiralty System rather than the Lloyd's. While there appears to be no documentation for YA (other than the latticework was present), Webb's ship Ocean Monarch, built in 1856, used the Admiralty System. It appears that builders were transitioning out of the Admiralty System in the 1850s and by the 1860s Lloyds came to predominate. It appears your educated guess was correct. Now I am trying to decide what to do. I think it is too late to pull up the hold planking now, especially with the copper bolting of the hold ceiling. I can stick to my plan and proceed modeling the Lloyd's bracing system, but now I have strong suspicions that this is historically incorrect. I can still brace the remaining of the internal hull and try retrofitting copper bands between the frames externally at the hold level (as fore and aft, at least, these areas are still very visible). Or could leave off the iron latticework altogether. No option seems satisfying. Damn. Thanks for letting me vent. Randy
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Ed (or anyone following)- Any recommendations on milled wood vendors? Thanks, Randy
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Ah. That makes perfect sense. Thank you.
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Interesting- I just realized that Drawing 6 is split: the upper part of the drawing is the middle deck and the lower part, the lower deck. Now I can plan out the lumber. I am still missing Drawing 8- can you tell me what is supposed to be there?
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I can't seem to find the lower deck plans drawing. I believe the base plan is drawing 2B. I have hard copies of the middle and upper decks and no hard copy of drawing 2 (for which I have a pdf) and drawing 8 (which I assumed was for the lower deck). It makes sense that the lower deck plans would come as a hard copy like the other two decks. I can not find a pdf for the lower deck drawing either. While I still have work to do before starting the lower deck, I'd like to use the lower deck drawing to estimate the lumber that I will need. With respect to my earlier question, there is a figure in Crothers' book (p.111) that directly addresses my query.
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Hi Ed, Yes- that helps. Thank you. I used the term 'limber channel' to simplify things as this is the term used on the List of Dimensions. I saw how you cut the actual limber channel later in the book. As you recommended, I left a 10" space by the keelson. I'll add a plank of that dimension into the space. Once I've completed the hold, I plan to take the structure off the shipway and fair the outside of the hull. I think the framing is now strong enough to do so. I found my packet of the Volume 1 drawings is missing #8 (which I am assuming is the plans for the lower deck as I can't find it anywhere else). I put in an email to Sea Watch books to get a replacement but haven't heard back yet. I hope it will not take too long as I am trying to get the lumber ready. Happy New Year! Randy
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Hi Ed, Is the limber channel left open? Some figures in the book show a covering (like figures 10-23 and 10-24) but nothing appears on the List of Dimensions for the hold. I must admit, I'm not used to seeing the limber channel exposed, but I'm not sure that accounts for much. If something other than the mast steps and base for the water tank covers the limber channel, could you provide the dimensions (and wood type, though I'm sure it must be castello). Thanks, Randy
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Ed. That seems perfectly reasonable (and also reassuring that I was missing something in executing your instructions). Very interesting read and thanks again for your feedback. Randy
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Hi Ed, If you look at the first photo you sent me on this page: it shows the aft deck clamps, bilge ceiling and deck planks. You can see the bilge ceiling stops at roughly the aft-end of the view opening- then there is planking the rest of the way back. (This is roughly where my BC also stops, finishing into the lower deck clamp but does not seem to extend to the last few frames at the stern.) Your photo (post #3505) nicely shows the heigh difference between the bilge ceiling and the planking. Am I making sense? Randy
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Hi Ed, As I am working on the bilge ceiling, I've noticed it does not extend all the way aft. I think I understand the concept of the bilge ceiling, but I am not sure why it doesn't run the entire length. Does the deadwood at the stern serve the same function and carrying things all the way back only needlessly add to the weight? (Or have I goofed somewhere on my model?) Randy
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Hi Ed, Thank you for all our input. You have been very generous with your advice and have saved me a lot of time an aggravation. I would gladly share my log with you but I have never kept one. I'm afraid the amount of time spent on these projects compared against the end result would only be depressing. Also, I think I spend infinitely more time reading/planning than executing, and am not sure how to document that. I'd be happy to upload any pictures or provide other info if you'd like. It would be good to have an expert set of eyes to keep me on track from time to time. Randy
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Hi Ed, I'm working on Chapter 8 now. I am thinking about modeling the strapping on the external hull rather than internal. I am also considering placing the deck clamps before the bilge ceiling- it seems it will be helpful to have the lower deck clamp already in place when adding the bilge ceiling. Does this seem to be a reasonable approach or am I setting myself up for failure. Also, do you have a picture at the stern showing the clamps for the lower, middle, main, cabin and poop decks? Good to be back at work, Randy
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Thanks, Ed. I was really looking for the best type of drill bit. The first I tried broke. I tried a carbide bur and that did not work well either. Is there a key to the material the bit is made of (or did I just use an old bit)?
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Hi Ed, When making the planking clamps, what is the best way to drill the 1/16" hole through the brass strip? Randy
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Hi Ed, After reading your three volumes, it seems clear to me that I will need a milling machine and lathe- both for this and future projects. I have no experience here and looking over my options, find this a bit intimidating. This leads to a couple questions: [1] Looking around, I am leaning towards a Sherline 5400 series milling machine and 4400 series lathe. I know you like to avoid making specific recommendations, but are these appropriate choices for now and the future- or is it too much/little. Better yet, can you make any recommendations. [2] As I said earlier, I am have not experience and am a little intimidated. I read one book on home milling machines but it still seemed a little abstract. Do you have any recommendations about a book and/or video that might serve as a useful introduction for someone with my limited skill set? Thanks!
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Hi Ed, I am getting ready to fabricate the stern cant frames. In the List of Dimensions, the middle futtock siding is listed as 11" while the drawings consistently list 12". I remember you saying to always follow the LoD but I just wanted to confirm: the stern cant frame middle futtock (as seen on the 'aft' drawings) are 11" siding, correct? Thanks in advance for your help. Randy
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Hi Ed, Based on the shape emerging after placing the fore frames and my experience fairing the inside of the hull to place the keelson, I don't think it will be an odious task fairing the outside. As your approach to frame construction was new to me, I think I tended to be a little more generous with the first few frames, but came much closer to the pattern edges with the rest. I suspect most of my work will be along the same areas as well as at the keel rabbet. I am inexperienced with the copper bolting and how it might impede my ability to sand. So let me ask my question a different way: what is the latest point in the book/construction where I can fair the exterior hull? Again, thanks! Randy
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Hi Ed, I am finishing up Chapter 6 and have the long ribands ready for the beginning of chapter 7. My question is regarding when to fair the exterior hull. While you do some external fairing around this time in the blog (and I'll admit, having the opportunity of add some strength to the keel-half frame interface while the hull is inverted is tempting), in the book you recommend waiting. Given the length of the lever arm of the unattached riband, I am not inclined to fair the external aspect of the frames as the book recommends. I remember reading when you do recommend fairing the external aspect of the frames but can't find it now. When do you recommend sanding the external surfaces of the frames? Thanks in advance for your help, Randy
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