palmerit Posted March 5 #1 Posted March 5 (edited) I am starting to build another Dory, this one from Midwest Products (a division of Model Shipways / Model Expo). I think I read that Model Shipways / Model Expo bought the designs for the Midwest Products kits and have been reissuing them with better materials. I think I also read somewhere that the old Midwest Products kits might have used balsa wood - this one uses basswood - but I don't know how long ago that was. I'm planking my Ranger slowly and researching and reading how to rig my Sherbourne. I didn't want to start another complicated kit and remembered that I had bought this kit in my buying frenzy during a Model Expo sale in the fall. It will be interesting to see how this build differs from the other Dory I build. Unlike the other Dory, this one is larger scale (1:12 instead of 1:24) and has a sail. These easy kits can be completed quickly and let me try out different approaches that I likely will be able to use on more complicated kits, and maybe be able to make progress more quickly on those than I might if I had just plunged into larger complicated kits more quickly. Like some other builds, I'm putting some notes here about this kit for future builders: - Like the Model Shipways Dory (and other Model Shipways kits) the written instructions don't always match the supplied materials. I imagine that the instructions were written years ago and that over the years the suppliers have changed and the methods used to cut the wood have changed. Unfortunately, the instructions are rarely updated to reflect those changes. So it's easy to be confused and to make a mistake. - Unlike the Model Shipways kits (or the Vanguard kits), in this Midwest kit, there are neither written (laser etched) labels or numbers on the sheet identifying the parts. The only way to know what part is what (and lots of parts are pretty similar, especially the frame pieces and the stem), you need to rely on the instructions. Well, when the instructions don't match the parts, you have a problem. - Before I realized the disconnect between the instructions and the materials, I was adding the stem (made from two pieces glued together) and was following the instructions that indicated that the stem piece was next to the transom on the sheet. Well, later when I was starting to work on the frame pieces, I realized that the instructions didn't match the sheets and I had inadvertently used frame pieces as the stem pieces. The stem was on the opposite corner of the sheet from the transom, contrary to the written instructions. - I did then discover that the sheet in the box that listed the pieces in the kit also at the bottom had a map to the parts on the sheets. If I had discovered that earlier (and had paid closer attention) I made not have made that error. - Also, be careful around sharp blades. After I made my error and had to loosen the glue using some alcohol, I was using a flat-bladed hobby knife to loosen the part some more and the knife slipped and went into my hand. Thankfully I was able to avoid a trip to the emergency room. Edited yesterday at 05:08 PM by palmerit eatcrow2 and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 5 Author #2 Posted March 5 (edited) There are a couple other build logs of the Midwest Dory (more of the Model Shipways Dory, which is part of the Shipwright Series; there is also a Bluejacket Dory): Edited March 5 by palmerit Duanelaker and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 5 Author #3 Posted March 5 And this had some photos of a real Dory: robert952 1 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Kenchington Posted March 5 #4 Posted March 5 Your build will be interesting to watch, Palmerit. And I agree that photos of full-size banks dories will help. One of Capt. Kelso's gave me the idea of how to add a mast step to my version of the Model Shipway's kit. Looking at them again now, I am struck by the "snub nose" appearance where everything comes together at the top of the stem. I chose to give mine a more elegant stemhead but the stubby look is more realistic: More robust when banging against the side of the schooner and less likely to get hooked up when the dories are stacked. In their 1887 account of the "salt bank" cod fishery, Goode and Collins even made an obscure mention of a boot heel being nailed on -- bit like the old tractor tires that could once be seen on the bows of tugs! There are lots of other photos of modern dories available on the WWW. The Lunenburg Dory Shop (https://www.doryshop.com) is a good place to start. You could even come to Nova Scotia for a week and join in the building of a full-size one! In contrast, photographs of the real thing in use in the banks fisheries are harder to come by. John Clayton made a few trips to sea around 1950, and has left us a large collection of images. Many were published in John Garland's 1985 "Adventure: Last of the Great Gloucester Dory-Fishing Schooners" (with at least one later edition). Before that, Frederick Wallace made a few trips on Nova Scotian schooners pre-1914. A selection of his photographs are in M. Brook Taylor's "A Camera on the Banks" (Goose Lane Editions, Fredericton 2006). palmerit, robert952 and JacquesCousteau 3 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
robert952 Posted March 5 #5 Posted March 5 Tagging along for the ride. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Robert Chenoweth Current Build: Maine Peapod; Midwest Models; 1/14 scale. In the research department: Nothing at this time. Completed models (Links to galleries): Monitor and Merrimack; Metal Earth; 1:370 and 1:390 respectively. (Link to Build Log.) Shrimp Boat; Lindbergh; 1/60 scale (as commission for my brother - a tribute to a friend of his) North Carolina Shad Boat; half hull lift; scratch built. Scale: (I forgot). Done at a class at the NC Maritime Museum. Dinghy; Midwest Models; 1/12 scale (Does LEGO Ship in a Bottle count?)
palmerit Posted March 6 Author #6 Posted March 6 The instructions and other build logs seem to require using the plans to line up pieces for gluing. So I took the plans to the FedEx near my office and had a couple copies made for around $5 (I probably only needed one copy). Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 6 Author #7 Posted March 6 Scribing lines from the plans onto the bottom plank. robert952 and Ryland Craze 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 6 Author #8 Posted March 6 The instructions show the layout of sheet #1 and shade in the transom and stern cleat but the actual sheet is organized in a different way. Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 6 Author #9 Posted March 6 Instructions say “there are two, Number Two (#2), die-cut sheets”. There’s only one #2 with twice as many parts. Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 7 Author #10 Posted March 7 The stern and bow knees are made by gluing two pieces together. After drying overnight I sanded off the char and glued the stern knee to the stern transom. The instructions for the front stem knee require measuring and marking two dots 1/8” inches from the front edge of the stem. But the stem is in total 1/8” wide. So I’m guessing it should be 1/16”. The instructions unfortunately don’t specify how far from the top and bottom to mark these two dots. Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted March 7 Author #11 Posted March 7 Gluing the transom to the bottom. Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Kenchington Posted March 7 #12 Posted March 7 7 hours ago, palmerit said: The instructions for the front stem knee require measuring and marking two dots 1/8” inches from the front edge of the stem. But the stem is in total 1/8” wide. So I’m guessing it should be 1/16”. The instructions unfortunately don’t specify how far from the top and bottom to mark these two dots. What a strange way to mark a bevel line! I suppose they have skipped the need for a separate template by shaping the curve of the stem to match that of the bottom boards, near the bow. It may not matter just where you measure the distance in from the edge of the stem, if the curve of the bottom is steady over the whole area near the bow. (It won't, of course, be steady throughout the length of the dory.) But I would think long and hard before assuming that 1/8 was an error for 1/16. They may be telling you that the upper part of the stem needs to be bevelled to a triangular section. Get that wrong now and there will be trouble later. robert952 1 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
Kenchington Posted March 7 #13 Posted March 7 7 hours ago, palmerit said: You have nicely photographed something that I worried over with the Model Shipways dory and I'm still not sure of the answer. When you have bevelled and faired the bottom boards, transom and knee, ready to receive the garboards, the aftermost, lowest point must be one of three things: 1: A narrow flat formed by the lowest point of the transom, reaching to the underside of the bottom and covering the end of the bottom boards; 2: A similar flat formed by squaring off the very end of the bottom boards, with the transom on top (and also squared off); or else 3: A point, where the tips of the bottom and the transom just meet. I think that full-size dories are built on their bottoms, so I would doubt #1 in the prototype, though that may not matter in a model. What might matter is if an offset from the kit-designer's intent caused later problems when bringing the planking to the sides of the transom. Your kit has a squared lower end to the transom, in its laser cut. (The Model Shipways one comes to a point.) You have aligned it so that the inboard face of the transom meets the tip of the bottom, which will mean bevelling the transom away to nothing at its lower end. I think I might have set the transom and its knee a little further forward, so that the outboard face just meets the tip of the bottom (meaning that the outboard face of the transom would be bevelled away to nothing but the inboard would still have width). But I still don't know which would be "right", let alone which the kit-designer intended! Whichever it should be, better to be sure before proceeding any further. Trevor robert952 1 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
palmerit Posted March 7 Author #14 Posted March 7 1 hour ago, Kenchington said: Whichever it should be, better to be sure before proceeding any further. Do you mean where the knee is attached relative to the point at the bottom? The instructions provide a drawing that I tried to follow. robert952 1 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Kenchington Posted March 7 #15 Posted March 7 Nice instructions! That diagram would have been useful in the Model Shipways version. Looks like you are spot on with the kit-designer's intentions, which is what matters most, I suspect. But there's going to be a whole lot of wood to remove when bevelling. robert952 1 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
palmerit Posted March 9 Author #16 Posted March 9 Anyone have pointers on paint color options for a Dory? The Midwest kit doesn’t come with paint. I might have some paints I can use, but if I want some new colors I’d like to order so I have them in hand when I’m ready to paint. robert952 1 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Kenchington Posted March 9 #17 Posted March 9 Dories could be any colour you want, though far and away the most common is on overall coat of some variant of "dory buff", with a streak of contrasting colour along the rail -- most often a green for some reason. Or are you looking for specific paint brands and colour designations? palmerit and robert952 2 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
palmerit Posted March 9 Author #18 Posted March 9 2 hours ago, Kenchington said: Or are you looking for specific paint brands and colour designations? Just wondering what color combinations make sense. I usually use Vallejo air brush paints. robert952 1 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Capt. Kelso Posted March 9 #19 Posted March 9 Looks like the old Bluejacket Kit I built several years ago. I have built a couple of boats and used "The Dory Model Book" by Harold Payson for reference. There are different versions of the Dory, Clam, Banks, etc.., which did not have a standard color scheme. So, if you are building a working Dory or recreational version your choice of paint color is open. Consider the color scheme of the Midwest Sea Bright Dory Lifeboat (I built that as well), sometimes a combination of bright colors with white makes the model stand out. palmerit and robert952 2
palmerit Posted Friday at 07:31 PM Author #20 Posted Friday at 07:31 PM (edited) Another bit of a mismatch between parts, plans, and instructions. This Dory does have somewhat clearer instructions, better drawings, and far better plans than the Model Shipways Dory. But the drawings show that the stem should run up against the lines for the (1) cleat I drew before (the matched the plans). But clearly it won’t. So I’m going to follow the instructions and the inset drawing to have the stem flat flush with the point of the bottom (which is what I also did on the other end. Edited Friday at 07:35 PM by palmerit Ryland Craze, robert952 and Kenchington 3 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted yesterday at 03:06 PM Author #21 Posted yesterday at 03:06 PM Okay, so we have a case of modeler error (actual two errors) and kit error. In the previous post, I lamented that the stem didn’t seem to be the right size given the illustration. Then as I was getting the frames together (next steps) I noticed that the illustration in the instructions showing where the numbered parts are on the sheets (the sheets do not have part numbers like the Vanguard models or part labels like the Model Shipways models). The instructions say that there are three sheets with frames but in the kit there is only one (larger) one. So now I was confused. How was I going to figure out which frame was which on the sheets now. Well I discovered that there was a kit contents sheet in the box that didn’t only list the parts but also illustrated the layout of the sheets (with part labels). I then discovered that the parts I had cut out and glued on wasn’t the stem (from the previous post) but was one of the frames. Earlier in the instructions, it showed a sheet that had the knee and stem next to each other on one corner of the sheet. So I assumed the knee (which has a district shape) and stem were next to each other. Well no. The stem was actually on the opposite corner of the sheet. Because of course it would. Ugh. In my defense, the stem pieces and the frames pieces are very similar. So now I had to first unglue the parts I thought were the stem. Thanks to a few applications of alcohol, the glue started to soften. I was wedging in a flat square tipped hobby blade to loosen the part, which then slipped and stabbed me in the hand. I’m now like the kid in Bad Santa who painted the carved wooden pickle he made for the Billy Bob Thornton character. Thankfully, I didn’t have to go to the emergency room and was able to get the bleeding to stop. The “stem” now had to be separated back into the two frames. I left the pieces in a small bowl of alcohol overnight, was able to (safely) separate them in the morning and add the actual stem pieces to the model. JacquesCousteau, robert952 and Ryland Craze 1 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Kenchington Posted yesterday at 04:20 PM #22 Posted yesterday at 04:20 PM Ouch! robert952, palmerit and JacquesCousteau 3 In progress: Norwegian sailing pram, by Model Shipways Completed: 1880 Gloucester halibut dory, based on Model Shipways Lowell banks dory
Ryland Craze Posted yesterday at 04:32 PM #23 Posted yesterday at 04:32 PM Good recovery on the stem. I can see where there would be some confusion. JacquesCousteau, robert952 and palmerit 3 Ryland Member - Hampton Roads Ship Model Society - Ship Model Society of New Jersey - Nautical Research Guild Current Build - Armed Virginia Sloop, 18th Century Longboat Completed Build - Medway Longboat
palmerit Posted yesterday at 06:30 PM Author #24 Posted yesterday at 06:30 PM (edited) Got the frames in place to glue. I had made a couple copies of the plans so I could cut them up as needed. It’s nice to have plans to scale. The Model Shipways plans in the instructions books were unfortunately a few percent off. Edited 21 hours ago by palmerit robert952 and Ryland Craze 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
palmerit Posted 14 hours ago Author #25 Posted 14 hours ago Adding the frames. Only the center frame is vertical. The others need to “lean” a bit because the bottom will be bent later. It wasn’t clear how much to allow them to bend. Ryland Craze and robert952 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
Capt. Kelso Posted 7 hours ago #26 Posted 7 hours ago Looks good! You may want to consider removing the laser burn from the parts to be painted prior to gluing. Laser burn can be difficult to paint over. robert952 1
palmerit Posted 4 hours ago Author #27 Posted 4 hours ago 3 hours ago, Capt. Kelso said: You may want to consider removing the laser burn from the parts to be painted prior to gluing. Laser burn can be difficult to paint over. Ugh. I do know that from other models but somehow completely flaked on this. That's what I get for working on a model late at night. robert952 and Ryland Craze 2 Current Builds: Sherbourne 1763 (Vanguard Models), Ranger 1864 (Vanguard Models), Grand Banks Dory (Midwest Products) In the Queue: Zulu 1900 (Vanguard Models), Endurance (Occre), Syren US Brig 1803 (Model Shipways), Duchess of Kingston (Vanguard Models) Completed Builds: Lowell Grand Banks Dory (Model Shipways), 18th-Century Merchantman Half-Hull Planking Kit (NRG), Norwegian Pram (Model Shipways), Endurance (Lego), Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack (Model Shipways)
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