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ClipperFan

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Everything posted by ClipperFan

  1. ClipperFan
    Keith, you're so right. Ironically due also to how poorly sailors were compensated, who manned these magnificent Clipper Ships, it was extremely difficult to man these vessels. Webb's monster Clipper "Challenge" had the misfortune of being scheduled to sail just after McKay's "Flying Cloud." Since the 'cream of the crop' were all sucked up to staff her, the Master of "Challenge" (then the largest sailing Merchant Vessel in the World, just edging out "Flying Cloud") had to dig up 'the dregs' to find enough crew to sail. Results were totally predictable. "Flying Cloud" went on to shatter sailing records in her inaugural voyage while "Challenge" had an arduously long Hell trip. To heighten poor Donald McKay's tragic circumstances was the fact that he himself was generous to a fault when it came to how he treated all the employees of his own Ship Building Community, which he viewed as members of his own family...
  2. ClipperFan
    Rob, in Richard McKay's terrific book "Famous Sailing Ships and their Builder Donald McKay" there are 2 images of a Builder's Model Half Hull of Clipper "Staghound" which the modeler, a relative of Donald says he rescued from a terrible fate in the McKay Farmouse. The modeler states it was the sole surviving example. However, the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston refers to the 2 examples I've shared as being originals too. They're located in the George P Putnam Hall and descriptions detail their provenance. Sadly, in his poverty and despair Donald McKay is said to have used all his others as firewood to heat his Farmhouse during cold Massachusetts winters, in the later days of his life. What a tragic loss to all humanity....
  3. ClipperFan
    Rob, in case you or anyone else wants to order prints of the images I've shared, they're from The Museum of Fine Arts, Boston, MA. Not the Museum of Science which I incorrectly identified before. https://collections.mfa.org/objects/38517/half-working-model-of-great-republic;jsessionid=E871F707D700A8817F818CEE87BF1FC9
  4. ClipperFan
    Rob, I don't know if you've ever seen this painting. It's probably one of the most dramatic scenes of Clipper "Glory of the Seas" rounding Cape Horn by Charles Robert Patterson. He was a Maritime man himself who was noted for his accurate portrayal of these vessels.
  5. ClipperFan
    Rob, from the same Boston Museum of Science comes this original Builder's Half Hull Model of the "Great Republic."
  6. ClipperFan
    The shackle I refer to is the connecting joint of the iron bar as it mounts into Glory's Hull just ahead of the "G" in her nameplate. There's an iron loop that the bar mounts into, instead of bolting directly into the wood. This feature allows for some flexing at this joint, minimizing potential wear and tear to the wood at this juncture. Another interesting feature that's visible too is that the round Bowsprit actually becomes oblong as it enters into the Bow. This makes for a stronger joint and eliminates any possibility of this massive piece rotating and causing havoc with all the chain link and rigging attached to it. FYI: I agree, there is still a treasure trove of images still out there. I'm pretty sure I found this in the Boston Museum of Science website. The same one where I found the Builder's Half Hull of "Romance of the Sea."
  7. ClipperFan
    The shackle I refer to is the connecting joint of the iron bar as it mounts into Glory's Hull just ahead of the "G" in her nameplate. There's an iron loop that the bar mounts into, instead of bolting directly into the wood. This feature allows for some flexing at this joint, minimizing potential wear and tear to the wood at this juncture. Another interesting feature that's visible too is that the round Bowsprit actually becomes oblong as it enters into the Bow. This makes for a stronger joint and eliminates any possibility of this massive piece rotating and causing havoc with all the chain link and rigging attached to it. FYI: I agree, there is still a treasure trove of images still out there. I'm pretty sure I found this in the Boston Museum of Science website. The same one where I found the Builder's Half Hull of "Romance of the Sea."
  8. ClipperFan
    This image taken from a children's book about McKay's Clipper Ships has one of the best reproductions of his Clipper "Lightning" I've ever seen. In all fairness, I drew some additional lines around the Bowsprit, which in the original book only has a single line, like the masts. Her Stern is incomplete, I sketched a stern to finish it. The gray lines on the far left are actually pages of the book. I copied the pages and drew on the copies. Otherwise this is Donald McKay's original lines, including an obvious blank area where the Cutwater and Naval Hoods would be. Finally there would be about a 2' Monkey Rail that mounts above the Main Rail and follows her Sheer and the respective 1' front Quarter Rail which typically ends just short of the Foremast.
  9. ClipperFan
    Good catch! That long iron bar, which bolts into the "Monkey Rail" just ahead of Glory's letterhead appears to attach to the outer end of the Naval Hood. It doesn't look like it goes to her figurehead. The figurehead would be securely mounted to the Cutwater between the Naval Hoods as well as the carved arch pedestal she stands upon. What's interesting is about a quarter of the way out from the shackle mounting point, there appears to be a shiny area, almost like an adjustable screw section which would enable the Naval Hoods to be tightened in differing climactic conditions. When you read descriptions of this particular area of McKay's Clippers, especially detailed in his first Clipper "Stag Hound" Duncan McLean explains in scientific eloquence how this rugged construction is so strongly reinforced that even the loss of her Cutwater wouldn't severely damage the underlying Stem or the vessel herself. This brilliance of designed reinforcement is a nautical invention that I believe Donald McKay was very careful to protect. Just look at his Clipper "Lightning" which literally ends in blank open space right at this critical juncture.
  10. ClipperFan
    Impressive work, Rob. I'm nearly done recreating Ledger page 1 Bow enlargement of Glory. In my ongoing effort to be as precise as possible, I'm doing the equivalent of taking "offsets" of the vessel's dimensions in the photo and reproducing them on paper. It's painstakingly slow work but the results are worth it. The biggest challenge remains her underwater Hull, which isn't fully visible in any other image than the one of her launch. Another obstacle is recreating her Naval Hoods, carved arch of her Cutwater and her Goddess Athene figurehead. Once page 1 is complete, I'll share it here. Pages 2 and 3 will go much quicker, since those images are clearer and her sheer is clearly visible. Once all 3 images are complete, I'll mail you a set of copies.
  11. ClipperFan
    Hull plans of twin Clipper Packets "Star of Empire" 1853 and "Chariot of Fame" 1854 drawn by Donald McKay himself again show a graceful curving entry at the Bow. Both of these vessels were 3 decked, just like "Glory of the Seas." According to an April 1853 Boston Daily Atlas article, "Star of Empire's" Keel was 208', length on deck 230' and width 48'. In reconstructing Glory's underwater structure, I am working with these various sources.
  12. ClipperFan
    This large working Half Hull model of McKay's 1853 Clipper "Romance of the Sea" shows that when it came to Clipper ships, the Bow and Stem weren't verticle. While the area below water wasn't changed significantly, the Cutwater above, which isn't depicted in half hulls sweeps up in dramatic fashion in a graceful curve. Romance of the Sea was 235' on deck, 38 1/2 ' wide with 20' depth of hold. The vessels depicted in McKay's 1839 book are 30 years prior to "Glory of the Seas." I believe with his initial 1851 Clipper "Stag Hound" (which has images of her Half Hull) in another Biography of McKays Packets and Clippers, shows a near verticle stem, again without the Cutwater .
  13. ClipperFan
    Rob, It's hard to comprehend the blistering pace you are proceeding at, for a guy unfamiliar with wood working. In an effort to keep up, I've jumped to full scale, relying mainly on the 3 ledger sized sections shared recently. Once I nail down her distinctive, yacht like upper bow, the rest will flow quickly. You're right too about her Hull below water, it is practically vertical in the image. I'm still working on reconciling that with her launch photo, which to me, when compared to the almost vertical tall pole behind, appears to have a slight incline back from straight vertical. I hope to have initial work on the Bow done soon.
  14. ClipperFan
    Back at Staples, I enlarged the 1907 San Pedro dockside shot breaking the image into 3 equal sections. These were all printed on Ledger sized paper, 12" ×17". Stern and Midsection fill almost entire page, Bow itself is about 7" to Knightheads. That's roughly 41". Taking into account the white borders, this should be very close to Rob's full scale. Which means this will be a very large replica indeed. Remember, this is primarily the Hull above the waterline. There's slightly more craft below the waterline and her Masts all tower above the Hull. I'm determined to do Donald McKays beautiful last Clipper justice.
  15. ClipperFan
    Just for fun, I took a shot of the original sailplan next to the 1/2 scale one. It's hard to imagine how the full scale one will dwarf both. A challenge I'm finding is to stay true to the graceful sheer of the vessel as I can see it in the many images now available.
  16. ClipperFan
    Rob, this doubles scale of first plan and is half way to ultimate scale. First effort was 1mm=1', this is 2mm=1', final will be double to 4mm=1'. 24cm Keel of original is 9 & 1/2 inches, 27 & 1/2cm Taffrail to Naval Hood Tip is 11 & 3/4 inches. Keel on new sketch is double, 19 inches. Doubling that gives a Keel of 38 inches, Taffrail to Naval Hood Tip 55cm & 23 & 1/2 inches. That should mean the ultimate length would be around 47" Taffrail to Naval Hood Tip (just behind figurehead) not including Bowsprit or Gaffsail Boom.
  17. ClipperFan
    Rob, comparing this section of Glory's Hull (top from 1907 San Pedro dockside & bottom from 1869 fitting out when just launched) it appears that there is a noticeable break in her sheer, about a third of the way from the prow of the white lifeboat on her deck. It's where the gradual slope goes up and then back down. The Main Shrouds interfere the view but the lower part of the Hull at this same section also seems to have a reverse curve too. When compared to her smooth, unbroken sheer in 1869, the defect, subtle as it is, becomes more apparent. Obviously at 38 years old, she's still serviceable in 1907 but for our purposes of reconstructing her original appearance, it means that other earlier images take on more significance in getting her graceful sheer accurate.
  18. ClipperFan
    Rob, while seeking for a way to dramatize the impact of perspective distortion, I reviewed various images of the dramatically sharp Bow of the US Navy's Arleigh Burke Class Destroyer. It now occurs to me that it looks remarkably similar to Glory's Bow, both in the sharp projection and the quick sloping sheer. McKay's Clipper appears to be just a little more modest but only slightly. I'm curious what you think.
  19. ClipperFan
    Rob. I've seen the remarkable pace you work at once you initiate a project. While not compromising on the quality of our subject matter, I will attempt to keep up with you.
  20. ClipperFan
    Glory's underwater Hull where the Stem joins the Keel looked a little dumpy and nothing like the sharp, crisp line clearly visible in her 1869 PEM launch. I've reworked that area to match that section more closely. Next step will be to get a more accurate reproduction at 1/2 the ultimate scale Rob intends to build her at. Each time I intend to refine her so that we can reproduce this vessel in her ultimate glory.
  21. ClipperFan
    In pursuit of improving Glory's hull, I've decided to do a 1/2 scale of your ultimate full scale replica. After working at 1mm=1', doing 19mm=1' will feel expansive indeed. I will concentrate on the hull to be sure she really captures Glory's full beauty.
  22. ClipperFan
    Rob, thanks for your compliments on my Clipper Flying Cloud sketch. I built Revell's Flying Cloud as a youth and loved her lofty sail plan, which always impressed me as being so beautiful. Even as a kid, it puzzled me how her winged angel figurehead wouldn't fall off, since it was just sort of tacked on. Now I realize that all published images of McKay's Clippers (Except Great Republic, which had indepth illustrations of her) only show the Stem. For some reason, the entire advanced structures of Cutwater, Carved Arches and Naval Hoods have all been excluded. Interesting.
  23. ClipperFan
    As discussed, I reworked Glory's bow, shortening her prow substantially, while angling her figurehead to more accurately reflect the 1907 image. Her Goddess Athene remains 90", the arch supporting her is now between 8 - 9 feet. Her Chainlink Bobstays now mount much higher above her waterline, reflecting her 1869 PEM launch image. This appears to approach the Bow more accurately but the beauty of her prow still remains elusive. I think moving to a larger scale might make it easier to achieve. One other factor I noticed while looking at the waterline fade of the 1907 dockside image is the slight possibility of some "Hogging" occurring. There appears to me at least to be a reverse curve around the center of the vessel. It's a natural occurrence of wooden vessels. It's why their masts are constantly reduced in height, to lessen strain which leads to this phenomenon. Being 38 years old at the time of this photo, it wouldn't surprise me. It means that I need to attempt to incorporate the graceful continuous curve she reveals at her much earlier San Franciso Wharf image and the broadside of her fitting out.
  24. ClipperFan
    Rob, 40" is 101.6 cm (centimeters & millimeters are more accurate, being smaller & broken into 10ths) 265' (Glory's length from knightheads to taffrail, translates into 3.83 cm to 1'. If I use 38 mm it results in a total length of 39.64". Let me know if that's close enough to meet your goals.
  25. ClipperFan
    McKay Clipper "Flying Cloud" 1mm = 1' drawn to same scale as "Glory of the Seas" with all dimensions reproduced precisely as described in Duncan McLean's, Boston Daily Atlas description at her launch. Her Bow may actually be more accurate than Glory's as the carved arch is almost equal to her winged figurehead. I know our focus is on getting the most precise reproduction of Glory but I thought you'd appreciate this other work too. As I've said, due mainly to McKay's own slavish devotion to secrecy, no models yet exist that precisely duplicate his marvelous vessels. I believe you and I can finally correct that with our collaboration on "Glory of the Seas."

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