Martes

There was another, even more extreme option - when the gun was stored parallel to the hull, lashed sideways. It allowed more space (and thus was used on indiamen), or in very heavy weather, but it effectively disabled the gun for the foreseeable future, since you would need very favourable conditions to bring it back to firing position.

I guess this is the closest to what you were looking for

Obviously, plus the tackles.

If I recall correctly, stowing the guns lashed to the sides was almost exclusively done when expecting very heavy storm, or on indiamen, because it is a difficult, dangerous and long process of getting them back to position if needed. Later carronades and even heavier guns had pivoting mounts, but that's more into the 19th century.

One of the units that was very needed, but eluded me for some time was a sloop. Small ships should be relatively frequent, but somehow I haven't got around to making one for a long time. I looked at the Bonne Citoyenne and Fylla, then I thought I needed something that can (at least potentially) be made in both open and quarterdecked variant and turned my attention to Cyrene, but still somehow held off. Then I found a plan of a Russian corvette, the Spitzbergen of 1803: And the more I looked at the plan, the more something rang very familiar in the shape of this hull. The lines looked like something I definitely saw already. Endymion. No surprise here, the Speshny class was already in series, and highly regarded. But it definitely gave me an idea. And since scaling the design up and down was something not unknown of, I thought I might just do the same. So I took Endymion's hull, scaled it down, slightly squeezed from the sides, replaced the deck, fitted a different stern and adapted head, applied a new texture... and got a ready quarterdeck corvette. The differences between the resulting ship and the original draught of the Spitzbergen (straight rudder-post, inclined keel and slightly different shape of entry) are negligible enough and certainly a small price to pay for getting a new ship with so little effort And so, I got a neat little 110ft corvette, of sufficiently French lines and Regency finish to be able to represent a ship of this class in almost any European navy, fit for escort duty, surveying, gunboat diplomacy and exploration voyages. What else would I want? A bomb vessel, of course! Well, I did have some sort of it, restoring a shabby model of a transport from game files and utilizing an unused gun caliber to make some sort of bomb vessel capability, but looking at conversion plans for Meteor (ex-sloop Star, a ship of very similar size): I thought it perfectly possible to follow the scheme, and make a bomb vessel of my own:

It's either camera angle, or she looks somewhat undermasted. Niagara, being very different from British architecture, is hardly a suitable prototype. Check against this, : https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sophie_(1809)_RMG_J0135.png and this: https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-66685

On a slightly ironic side note it does look like it happened exactly overnight on January 1st, 1700. Or maybe 1697. Based on surviving plans anyway.

Yes, it looks very interesting, and I think comparing the model to the plan can give the answer to the sternpost question. I shall check it sometimes

It's not just that plan, see for example this: Or even the stern of the Sovereign of the Seas from Boston Museum: and my attempt to solve it: https://modelshipworld.com/topic/23981-early-17-th-century-pseudo-perspective/?do=findComment&comment=708359 https://modelshipworld.com/topic/23981-early-17-th-century-pseudo-perspective/?do=findComment&comment=708755 (Sorry for linking posts, it would be a little difficult to recreate the formatting again)

About that early 17th century English drawing standard, maybe you know how to interpret it. While the plan appears to be a profile with turned bulkheads, the sternpost is somewhat obscured by a part of the hull in pseudo-3d fashion: Should one assume that to recreate the real profile the sternpost and rudder should be moved slightly back?

Well, Lord Danby certainly didn't lack neither imagination nor resources, since he apparently was able to build the ship.

Yes, it's very revealing about the practices of the time. 17th century was very different from 18th

I think I have missed this point. Still, it's something very puzzling.

As far as I remember, the "as taken" plans were taken by measuring a number of points along the frames (with or without planking, depending on the depth of refit the ship was undergoing) and connecting them. I definitely remember somewhere this process was described in detail, and that with planking stripped it should have been more or less reliable form of recording the ship as actually built. It is possible they put some additional reconstruction along the way, but still. By the way, is it possible to tell if La Prompt had square or round-tuck stern from? But what nags me with the Danish ship (by the way, was she built by private or government shipyard?) is that the designer certainly meant something with the inward arc, and it's very difficult to imagine it was negated just like that.

Surely the designer would provide some documentation to the shipyard? There are many relatively complex shapes recorded in "as taken" plans of captured French warships from 18th century in Admiralty archives. See La Prompt, 1702 (earliest recorded prize, I think): https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-87615 https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-87616

@Waldemar, concerning the Danish design you reconstructed - are you sure that the red curve was not intentional and would not be copied at the shipyard? Why go to such lengths to create a relatively complex shape for all of it to be simplified and shaven off during construction? Could it be possible that the shape as designed was in line with even more extravagant experiments, like the later Lord Danby's Maggot: https://www.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/rmgc-object-385580 (oh, how I'd love to see the planking plan for that one!) and had some hydrodynamic meaning?

I once posted them here: https://modelshipworld.com/topic/24626-plans-found-in-hermitage-collection-st-petersburg/ and there was a comment that it's early 17 century English style, but I did not know about Balfour at the time. Also, did you see these plans: https://www.rct.uk/collection/1047387/the-ship-london-on-her-first-voiadge

It's a part of a very obscure set of 3 plans that are now in the collection of the Hermitage museum https://www.hermitagemuseum.org/wps/portal/hermitage/digital-collection/02.+drawings/500128 https://www.hermitagemuseum.org/wps/portal/hermitage/digital-collection/02.+drawings/500129 https://www.hermitagemuseum.org/wps/portal/hermitage/digital-collection/02.+drawings/500130 I am not sure if their origin was ever determined, but they look very similar to Balfour's plans from the Danish archive. May be his work or copies.

Let's say I felt a need for a distinct adversary craft.

Could be RN, could be Russian - it was, after all, Russian territory at the time, and the construction was very similar. Well, should they dig it out, we'll see.

I know. A spinoff of Naval Action. It's positioned as a remake of AOS2, but inherits the worst parts as well - and adds very limited editability. Horrible controls, no scenario editor, same problem with damage and maneuvering as with everybody else. Calculates wind better, has land combat, but otherwise... Ships can't even tow a boat. Anyway, with all my woes with modern naval games, I am quite content with this old engine and what I did with it, and when it won't be enough, I know which way to approach this subject in Unity. This thread here is to show off the ships

I looked at the gameplay trailer, and that "rig sails for speed" command knocked me out, literally. And sinking ships, again. Hell, wooden ships sank in combat so rarely, nobody really remembers when and if it happened. They could burn, they rarely exploded, usually they were captured, but to sink one was while not impossible, but extremely difficult. And the square rig is so fascinating system, it's just a pity modern games use it as a graphical representation of a screw engine, not even understanding it was a thrust-vector. And I can go on and on about this. All the concepts of age of sail combat are different from what we know from later.

That's as far from historical reconstruction as one can only imagine.