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Posted

A few quotes from the literature on emergency steering chains.

“The rudder tender to lift out of its Irons In rough seas but was prevented from doing so by means of a wooden block known as a wood lock. Strong ropes and chains were fitted to the rudder as a secondary precaution and provide a means of control in the event of damage to the tiller. These were attached to the rudder and the stern, and were known as the rudder pendants.”

(See drwg)

From:  Historic ship models by Wolfram zu Mondfeld.

“Another iron fitting, known as the spectacle frame, was fitted just above waterline, usually at the level hancings, to act as emergency steering chain.

It consisted of a pair of rings, one on each side of the rear face of the rudder.

These were linked by bar of iron, which also extended round the sides of

the rudder, and was bolted firmly in position. Chains were fitted to these

rings, to give some control over the rudder in the event of damage to its head. They also prevented the rudder from being completely lost, should an accident break the gudgeons and pintles. Ringbolts were fitted on the wing transom , just under

the stern galleries, to hold the other ends of the chains were not in use”

From: The Arming and Fitting of English Ships  of War 1600-1815 by Brian Lavery

 

Tadeusz

 

post-8878-0-16506200-1411904652_thumb.jpg

  • 3 weeks later...
Posted

Another important use of the pendants was mentioned by peternalis in our german forum: They too were used as lifts to reship the rudder back onto the pintles if unshiped. And of course to unship it for repair reasons.

 

XXXDAn

To victory and beyond! http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/76-hms-victory-by-dafi-to-victory-and-beyond/

See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: http://www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com/

Finest etch parts for HMS Victory 1:100 (Heller Kit), USS Constitution 1:96 (Revell) and other useful bits.

http://dafinismus.de/index_en.html

Posted

Some more findings


NMM Royal George SLR0336 http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/66297.html
f844t3413p49257n2_nrQXjmWF.jpg

NMM "Barfleur" SLR0453 http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/66414.html 
f844t3413p49257n3_zlqFoVhY.jpg

"So called"-Vic SLR0513 http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/66474.html
f844t3413p49257n5_itBFNJuG.jpg

HMS Victory 2003 a bit free flying ...
f844t3413p49257n4_FlLQWUEh.jpg

and Bellona even more on the loose side of life ...
Bellona SLR0338 http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/66299.html 
f844t3413p49257n7_GPFOWpos.jpg
 


Lee describes the pendants as seen on the first two pictures on page 130.

XXXDAn

 
 

To victory and beyond! http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/76-hms-victory-by-dafi-to-victory-and-beyond/

See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: http://www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com/

Finest etch parts for HMS Victory 1:100 (Heller Kit), USS Constitution 1:96 (Revell) and other useful bits.

http://dafinismus.de/index_en.html

Posted

Greetings Dafi,

 

Your picture of the actual Victory is the money shot. This picture coincides with Longridge's description in his book and his photo of the Victory. Frankly, the way the Victory's rudder is rigged makes perfect sense as to the reason for these chains.

 

wq3296 

Posted

I think they do coincides because Longridge´s description is based on the Vic in P. ;-)

 

To me it looks strange that so much chain would drag in the water ...

 

Dirk/Dubz started a interesting conversation about the use of chains in our german forum.

 

He realised that Lees was taking on page 130 first about about chains and then, on the eyebolt/hook beside the stem already talks about the pendants. He found Steel also saying the same - witch contradicts the contemporary models.

 

Here are the parts that Dirk pointed out:

 

 

Lees p130:

 

Rudder pendants

 

Chains were shackled to eyes in the rudder, coming up each side of the rudder to under the transom.

- chains

 

To the end of the chains large rings were fitted and into these rings were hooked the rudder pendants.

- chains

 

These pendants had a thimble in each end with the hooks set round the thimbles.

- change to pendant

 

The hooks were moused.

- pendant

 

The pendants were seized to eyes or hooks set under the transom — one by the side of the rudder post, one half way along, and one under the quarter gallery.

- pendant

 

The end of the pendants were seized to the after end of the mizen channels.

 

- pendant

 

When required, a long tackle was hooked in the ends.

 

- pendant

 

The fall hooked to an eyebolt in the mizen chains and led in through a port

 

 

 

 

 

 

Steel wrote (CS.234) 

 

“RUDDER-PENDENTS hook to the ring, in the end of the rudder-chains; the hook is moused; then stopped to hooks driven in the counter, over the rudder, at the quarters, and one between. A long tackle is hooked to a thimble, spliced in the ends of the pendents, and to an eye-bolt in the mizen-chains, and the fall leads in, through a port, upon the quarter-deck.”

 

Steel, p. 77

 

Rudder Tackles hook to the rudder chains or pendants, to steer the ship in case of accident to the tiller or rudder head.

 

Steel, p. 172

 

PENDENTS. Large, but short, ropes which go over the mast-heads, and to which are hooked the main and fore tackles. There are, besides, many other pendents, with a block or tackle attached to one end, all of which serve to transmit the effort of their tackles to some other object: such are the BILL-PENDENT, BRACE-PENDENTS, PREVENTER-BRACE-PENDENTS, BURTON-PENDENTS, FISH-PENDENTS, GUY-PENDENTS, MAIN-STAY-TACKLE-PENDENT, PENDENTS OF TACKLES, QUARTER-TACKLE-PENDENTS, REEF-TACKLE-PENDENTS, RUDDER-PENDENTS, STAY-TACKLE-PENDENTS, TOP-ROPE-PENDENTS, TRUSS-PENDENTS, VANG-PENDENTS, WINDING-TACKLE-PENDENTS, and YARD-TACKLE-PENDENTS.

 

Steel, p 178

 

RUDDER TACKLES are composed of long tackle blocks, and single blocks, strapped, with hooks and thimbles: they are used to save, or direct the rudder, when any accident happens to the tiller.

 

Steel, p192

 

RUDDER-PENDENTS are doubled and cut in the bight; they have a hook and thimble spliced in one end, and are served with spunyarn over the splice.

 

 

Luce Text-Book of Seamanship, 1891, Luce, S.477

 

RUDDER GONE.

 

If the rudder head only has been carried away, the rudder remaining shipped, it can be used for steering by means of the rudder chains. In view of this possibility, the rudder chains should be stopped up so that their ends are accessible in case of need.

 

The possibility of having to use rudder chains for steering purposes has sometimes been overlooked; the chains themselves are difficult to get at, the fastenings on the rudder have not been sufficiently far down, and only common bolts have been inserted instead of a stout metal strap, which should clasp the after part of the rudder.

 

The rudder chains should have pendants spliced into them, leading up over the taffrail where they can be got at.

 

In using them to steer the ship, the rudder head being wrenched off, lower the cross-jack yard on the rail, lash it there, and lead pendants from the rudder chains through blocks at the yard-arms, hooking tackles into the pendants.

 

 

 

And now the question to our nativ english speakers: Are we misunderstanding or misinterpreting the lines? 

That is followed by the question how the delta to the contemporary models can be explained? Was the length of the chains not standardised?

 

Cheers and thanks to Dirk, Daniel

To victory and beyond! http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/76-hms-victory-by-dafi-to-victory-and-beyond/

See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: http://www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com/

Finest etch parts for HMS Victory 1:100 (Heller Kit), USS Constitution 1:96 (Revell) and other useful bits.

http://dafinismus.de/index_en.html

Posted (edited)

Daniel/Dirk...

 

I've also read the Steel description as well as some others and I think you've correctly assessed the description... I interpret this as saying that there are RUDDER CHAINS and there are RUDDER PENDANTS that attach to the rudder chains.  The rudder chains serve the central purpose of securing the rudder and aiding in preventing the rudder from turning too far - which creates drag and can damage the rudder and/or stall the steering.  A longer length of chain is commonly used (but not always) and attached to eye bolts under the counter to distribute the stresses should the chain get yanked with force if the rudder is wrenched loose in a storm or grounding.  Additionally, it made sense to attach a rope (pendant) to the rudder chain so that the chains could also be used for emergency steering in the rare case where the rudder head is damaged, but the remainder of the rudder is still intact enough to function.

 

Many contemporary models show rudder chains fitted, but not rudder pendants. I would think a prudent commander would rig the pendants prior to a battle for emergency use - a stern rake is precisely the situation where the rudder head might be too damaged to support an auxiliary tiller.

 

In the case of emergency steering, RUDDER TACKLES are the series of blocks and rope that give mechanical advantage and link directly to the tiller head, pendants, or chains (depending on damage and contingency) to allow control in steering the ship with the damaged rudder.

 

Clear as mud???!!!

 

Evan

Edited by Force9
Posted (edited)

Hallo Dirk

 

This topic has been very interesting to me because it reminded me of a conversation I had many years ago (1997?) with a docent on board the USS Constitution.  A small group of us were discussing the rudder and I mentioned something about the emergency steering chains.  The docent corrected me and insisted that the rudder chains had nothing to do with steering.  He pointed out that they were attached to the counter with eyebolts and couldn't possibly be used to control the rudder.  He said they were used to preserve the rudder and extended under the entire counter and attached at several points so that the stress could be distributed if they suffered a hard pull and increased the chance that the chains held fast if the rudder was jarred loose.  This made sense to me and seems to be reflected in the majority of contemporary (Napoleonic period) ship models.  That was the source of my comments - I admit it may not be authoritative.

 

MAAC1032.JPG

 

I know you have Harland as a reference.  He states: "[Rudder chains] were shackled to a stout metal strap bolted to the rudder-horn, the upper after corner of the afterpiece of the rudder, just above the waterline.  The chain was becketted loosely around the counter, to allow the rudder sufficient play, and to the forward ends were spliced rudder-pendants, which were made fast to the mizzen channels. The main purpose of the rudder chains was to secure the rudder, should it be jarred loose from going aground.  In addition, by rigging tackles on the pendants, they could, at a pinch, be used to steer."  

 

"Becketted loosely" would seem to correspond with Daniel's representation and the restored Victory in Portsmouth.

 

To add to the confusion... I've been using my own pictures of the Hull model as references for my Constitution build.  As you may already know, this model was built by the crew and presented as a gift to Captain Isaac Hull.  The model shows a slightly different arrangement:

L1080821.JPG

It is likely that the crew didn't have access to any scale chain and had to use rope instead, but I wonder if the heavy served rope under the counter is accurate and the thinner rope leading up from the rudder should be chain.  The heavier line is terminated abruptly under the quarter gallery and is not led up to the mizzen channel:

L1080820.JPG

I'm not sure we can settle anything either way, but it seems that modeler's will need to determine which source matches best to their own perspective and go forward with that... 

Evan

Edited by Force9
Posted

Dirk -

 

I don't think the docent was wrong -  his view was accurately based on how the Constitution's stern has represented the rudder chains for more than a hundred years.  Clearly this set up would not allow for emergency steering and would be best suited for withstanding strain and keeping the rudder attached to the chains after an accident. You and I, however, are more concerned with how the rudder chains would've been configured in 1812 or thereabouts - and the "modern" version is likely incorrect for that period.

 

Your pictures of Boudroit and the La Flore model are extremely interesting. There are two different pendants in use. The "upper" pendant is attached to the rudder chain and secured under the counter.  This would seem to suggest a setup for preserving the rudder in case it was wrenched loose.  The "lower" pendant secures directly to a bolt on the rudder and appears to be led around the quarter and eventually up to the mizzen channel.  This would likely align with an emergency steering purpose.  I don't think this is what is described by Steel... This would appear to be more of a "continental" approach.  I think Steel describes something more appropriate to the Royal Navy practices?

 

I will try to replicate something close to the Hull model (and similar to your approach) for my build - with chain substituted for the thin rope led to the rudder.  The ends appear to be served, but I'm not certain if the pendant should be "tarred" black as suggested by the model?

 

Thanks for showing patience with my thoughts!

 

Evan

Posted

The last illustration of Dafi's post # 25, is an exceptional rig. Chains, Pendents and Block and Tackle could be rigged in a straight forward manner up to the point the tackle block was secured to the spar on each side, now what? Directing two crews on opposite side to work the rudder in a coordinated manner would make a landing officer who controls landings on a carrier scream. Rigging those falls to the wheel would work just fine, if the wheel was gone, using the capstan with the dogs tied up would also allow for a lot of movement in the tackles  needed to work the the falls. Didn't pick that up, until tonight, while studying those sketches closer.

jud

Posted (edited)

If you look closely at the Flore you can see the lower rope just being one sided. This was an oledr Version on securing the rudder: The rope went through the hole in the rudder and was simply stopped by a knot. Plenty of old drawings show this.

 

But as all the things I learned in the years of research - there was always more than one version to be correct, depemnding upon the nationality, the year, dockyard and the captain ...

 

Still looking for some other hints on fully rigged contemporary models and drawings. I believe some more precise hints are still awaing us out there :-)

 

XXXDAn

Edited by dafi

To victory and beyond! http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/76-hms-victory-by-dafi-to-victory-and-beyond/

See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: http://www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com/

Finest etch parts for HMS Victory 1:100 (Heller Kit), USS Constitution 1:96 (Revell) and other useful bits.

http://dafinismus.de/index_en.html

  • 3 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

And another version found in DSC01116 Mark´s great pictures of the HMS Endymion 44 guns of 1779

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/gallery/image/9076-dsc01116/

 

The chain goes up beside the rudder

 

med_gallery_10197_918_93842.jpg

 

med_gallery_10197_918_38167.jpg

Edited by dafi

To victory and beyond! http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/76-hms-victory-by-dafi-to-victory-and-beyond/

See also our german forum for Sailing Ship Modeling and History: http://www.segelschiffsmodellbau.com/

Finest etch parts for HMS Victory 1:100 (Heller Kit), USS Constitution 1:96 (Revell) and other useful bits.

http://dafinismus.de/index_en.html

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