fairing technique

[michael101]

hello

i just start to work on the royal louis of mamoli 

and there is a lotttttt of problems with the frames...

so i glue them on 90 deg but they Still uneven 

 

 

so far i got the deck leveled

and 90 Degrees on the frame Against the kill  

now i got left(to make level )the Bottom and the sides of the frames (they dident cut the frames properly in the factory !!!!!!!!! )

 

for that i have to learn how to do the firing properly because i dont want to lose the forma of the ship i know that i will have to fill some frames also

 

(because some of them they are out of the line and some of them not geting the line... )

 

i dont know where to start and where to finish ... 

 

so if you can Explain here in the forum or if you can give me a link for a tutorial i will be more than happy 

 

thank you,

Micharl.

 
 

[AntonyUK]

Hi Micharl.

Sounds like your keel is twisted from your first statement. .?

Sort this out first.. Or you will have a ship that will not go together too well.

I had this issue with one of my first kits.. Keel and frames were twisted. My solution was to cut 4 softwood spacers the same width as the gap at the keel on every bulkheade/frame gap. A ship that had 48mm of twist then had less than 1mm.. Worked for me. This also stiffened the hull and made it easer to work with.

 

As far as Faring the frames..

I use a length's of strip wood and pin it to the Bow. Then pin it at the stern. You can then see what angle each bulkhead/frame needs to be.

Then I take my Dremmel with a sanding drum on and follow the contours. Checking with a strip of wood that you are still getting the correct angle.

There are lots of build logs that show this process.

 

All the best.

Antony.

[michael101]

Hi Antony thank you
I have no problem with the keel
Like i sade they dident cut properly the frames at the factory

 

about your way to firing its nice i did the same with my first kit but now im working on a very large ship

may be i need to Divide the ship to 3 sections and to work part part....

but im sure that there is a way to do it .. 

thank you 

Michael.

Edited September 7, 2015 by michael101

[CaptainSteve]

Just adding to what Antony has said above, I would recommend checking all of the bulkheads to ensure that the distance from the center-line to the port and starboard edges is the same for each bulkhead. I use a set of calipers to compare the two halves of each.

 

If some are too big on one edge, you may need to sand some excess wood away. If some are too small, you may need to glue a shim (extra piece of wood) to the edge to fatten them up a little.

[michael101]

Hi thank you for the answer
But I'm not worry about the center the different May be 1-2 mm for frame(and the frame have 20cm wide )
My problem is only to level the frame with the other frames 

i know how to do the basic fairing but im Afraid to make an error 

if someone have pictures of the steps its will be grate

thank you

Michael.

Edited September 8, 2015 by michael101

[AntonyUK]

Hi Michael.

Have a look at this build .. They have had the same issues that you are having.

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6360-royal-louis-1780-by-ulises-victoria-mamoli-scale-190-french-vessel-120-cannons-started-in-april-10-2014/?hl=%2Broyal+%2Blouis+%2Bmamoli

 

Please LOOK at post 133 as this is super Important to you at this stage.

Regards Antony.

Edited September 8, 2015 by AntonyUK

[NMBROOK]

Hi Michael

I have Mamoli's drawings and these have been enlarged to produce a model of 1/60.I can confirm that even the drawings are not symmetrical for the bulkhead profiles.Many of the slots for the false keel do not run vertically true.Even when this is corrected there are still inconsistencies at various positions around the profiles.If you have assembled the bulkheads to the keel,all I can suggest is to make templates for half of each bulkhead either side of the false keel and check these against the plan,yes there will still be discrepancies,but the idea being is that you ensure some symmetry to each side.

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel

[michael101]

thank you Antony and Nigel

 

Nigel its not going to help me .... like you Sade even the plans are not symmetrical  

for example frame 9 has 20 cm wide frame 10 has 19.8 wide and frame 11 has 20 cm wide so the solution is or to fill up frame 10 with 2 mm or to sand frames 9 and 11

 

and to be honest if one side will be a bit fat from the other side even with 3-4 mm of different no buddy can see that in our case that the frames has 20 cm wide 

 

my problem is only to make the frames level with the other frames at the same side then i will do the other side  

thank you

Michael.

[michael101]

here is example: (i tried to do like Antony advice but i don't know where to start...)

side:

 

 

down the frames:

 

Edited September 11, 2015 by michael101

[amateur]

It seems that they are off both in breadth as well as in height. That's tough....

Question: are the frames properly centered (left/right the same distance from the keel, or were the pre-cut slots off-center?

 

Does the kit have a drawing on which the frames are depicted? If so, can you not check against those drawings which frames are more or less) correct, and which ones are off?

 

Jan

[NMBROOK]

Hi Michael

Looking at the photos I would add lime strip bent around the edges of the low bulkheads to bring them to roughly the same level as the others before you do any fairing.When fairing and checking the run of the edges,I would use a strip thicker than the planking material.This bends in more of an arc and will not follow the irregularities.It will be much easier to get a fair run building up these low bulkheads as otherwise you will end up removing far too much material and risk loosing the hull shape.

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel

[michael101]

hello Jan

the frames are very bad cut

even the drawing are not Symmetric

 

Nigel but how can i know if the first and the last one are ok maybe they are  too high and the rest are ok?

i don't know where to start , i was thinking to start from the middle I mean to work on 4-5 frames from the middle to Fill the frames with lime strip and than to go forward and backward is it sounds ok?

 

thank you 

Michael.

[NMBROOK]

Michael,I would start above the waterline,with a thicker strip you should be able to assess the shape over  the full length bar the first four bulkheads.Using an elastic band or tape,you should be able to hold the strip i position to judge how much packing and where.I would also temporarily fix a piece of card across the sides of the rearmost bulkhead with some graph paper glued to it.Lining the squares up with the true vertical of the false keel will allow you to check the symmetry at this position.Like you say a lack of symmetry amidships isn't overly noticeable,however the stern needs to be correct or you will have issues when building the stern galleries.

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel