securing ropes at the belay pin at the base of the mast.

[DaveBaxt]

I am currently fitting the yards to the mast and fitting the tyes/jeers for raising the lower yards. From the 3 hole blocks on the caps,the rope goes down to the fife rail at the foot of the mast. However before it is secured to the pin rail it is  reaved through a pully underneath and then comes up to the belaying pin from underneath. Is the rope then wrapped around the pin in the usual figure eight or does the rope come up through the hole rather than down through the hole when coming form an above direction? The other question is, are people securing the ropes with the figure eight over the belaying pins or is it better to just take it through the hole and then push the pin in and then make a seperate rope loop and then fit this directly over the pin or do we have to do the figure eight first. Hope this makes sense Dave 

      

Edited May 9, 2021 by DaveBaxt

[popeye2sea]

If the rope passes through a sheave beneath the pin the rope will go around the pin in the usual figure of eight except the first half turn will be around the top first.  The rope never goes through the pin hole. If the jeer rope is actually going through a sheave at the base of the timber head I would belay it with a clove hitch at the top of the timber head.

 

Regards,

[Bob Cleek]

The sheave on deck permits a gang of seamen to haul on the line as it extends across the deck. Obviously, only one or two men at a time can pull a line down without a sheave because there isn't room for more to get a hold on the line. 

 

When the line is hauled through a deck sheave or turning block, the line is brought up to the front of pin rail and a half-twist is made in the line and cast over the pin and pulled tight. The remaining bitter end is coiled with the coil held in the left hand. When coiled, the right hand reaches through the middle of the coil and grasps the bitter end of the line where it comes off the pin and a a suitable length of line being made between the coil and the right hand, that length is pulled through the center of the coil and a half-twist made in it, which is thrown over the pin so that the coil is hung neatly from the pin. 

 

When line is let go, it is a simple matter to lift the hitch off the top of the pin and lay the coil on deck, then cast off the first half hitch on the pin, and the line will pay out neatly from the without kinking or fouling.

 

Many books and manuals will depict a method of taking multiple turns around a belaying pin before hitching the line to the pin. While there is a method of taking an initial turn before hitching in cases where it is feared the weight of the load may make it difficult to cast off a single hitch on the pin, in practice, it's not a problem that's often encountered, as a horizontal pull of the fall, (called "sweating the line") will make losening the single hitch easy enough if the size of the line and the size of the pin are properly matched. Unnecessary turns around pins, cleat, cavels, and posts are the hallmarks of sloppy seamanship. All belaying should be done in a uniform fashion, as well, since one crewmember may tie off and another let go. In a blow and a heavy sea in the middle of the night is no place to be trying to untie "black" knots tied by some lubber!

[DaveBaxt]

4 hours ago, popeye2sea said:

If the rope passes through a sheave beneath the pin the rope will go around the pin in the usual figure of eight except the first half turn will be around the top first.  The rope never goes through the pin hole. If the jeer rope is actually going through a sheave at the base of the timber head I would belay it with a clove hitch at the top of the timber head.

 

Regards,

Thank you popeye for your reply which I think I follow ok but not sure about the clove hitch around the top of the timber head . There are two sheaves at the bottom so does that mean that both ropes have a half hitch at the timber head ,one on top of the other . I am assuming that the timberhead is the bit that is carved at the top of the post. I am not sure why they would do this and would be gratefull if you could explain this to me. Thank you and Best regards Dave

[DaveBaxt]

2 hours ago, Bob Cleek said:

The sheave on deck permits a gang of seamen to haul on the line as it extends across the deck. Obviously, only one or two men at a time can pull a line down without a sheave because there isn't room for more to get a hold on the line. 

 

When the line is hauled through a deck sheave or turning block, the line is brought up to the front of pin rail and a half-twist is made in the line and cast over the pin and pulled tight. The remaining bitter end is coiled with the coil held in the left hand. When coiled, the right hand reaches through the middle of the coil and grasps the bitter end of the line where it comes off the pin and a a suitable length of line being made between the coil and the right hand, that length is pulled through the center of the coil and a half-twist made in it, which is thrown over the pin so that the coil is hung neatly from the pin. 

 

When line is let go, it is a simple matter to lift the hitch off the top of the pin and lay the coil on deck, then cast off the first half hitch on the pin, and the line will pay out neatly from the without kinking or fouling.

 

Many books and manuals will depict a method of taking multiple turns around a belaying pin before hitching the line to the pin. While there is a method of taking an initial turn before hitching in cases where it is feared the weight of the load may make it difficult to cast off a single hitch on the pin, in practice, it's not a problem that's often encountered, as a horizontal pull of the fall, (called "sweating the line") will make losening the single hitch easy enough if the size of the line and the size of the pin are properly matched. Unnecessary turns around pins, cleat, cavels, and posts are the hallmarks of sloppy seamanship. All belaying should be done in a uniform fashion, as well, since one crewmember may tie off and another let go. In a blow and a heavy sea in the middle of the night is no place to be trying to untie "black" knots tied by some lubber!

I am more than grateful for your reply but unfortunatley some of it I do not understand what you are trying to tell me. Please forgive me for my ignorance and I am happy to do do some research and see if I can sort this out. There is clearly more to this than meets the eye and there seems to be a lot of bad practices out there. Once again I thank you for giving me the help with my model and hopefully one day will appreciate the finer and accurate methods of building a model ship. Best regards Dave

[popeye2sea]

20 hours ago, DaveBaxt said:

Thank you popeye for your reply which I think I follow ok but not sure about the clove hitch around the top of the timber head . There are two sheaves at the bottom so does that mean that both ropes have a half hitch at the timber head ,one on top of the other . I am assuming that the timberhead is the bit that is carved at the top of the post. I am not sure why they would do this and would be gratefull if you could explain this to me. Thank you and Best regards Dave

That is correct. The timber head is the carved indentation at the top. The purpose of the indentation is to stop the hitched rope from sliding up or down the timber head, thereby preventing inadvertent slacking or unhitching. 

On some timber heads the multiple sheaves at the base are actually what would be the lower block of a multi-part tackle.  If there are two separate lines belaying to the the timberhead, more than likely they are lines that would be worked at the same time and cast off together anyway.

 

BTW, the reason I differentiated between a sheave located directly below the belaying pin versus at the base of the timber head is because you would prefer to have your rope pass vertically, or nearly so, to the pin and not cross and therefore chafe against the shell of a fixed block or sheave in the rail.

 

Regards,

[DaveBaxt]

11 hours ago, popeye2sea said:

That is correct. The timber head is the carved indentation at the top. The purpose of the indentation is to stop the hitched rope from sliding up or down the timber head, thereby preventing inadvertent slacking or unhitching. 

On some timber heads the multiple sheaves at the base are actually what would be the lower block of a multi-part tackle.  If there are two separate lines belaying to the the timberhead, more than likely they are lines that would be worked at the same time and cast off together anyway.

 

BTW, the reason I differentiated between a sheave located directly below the belaying pin versus at the base of the timber head is because you would prefer to have your rope pass vertically, or nearly so, to the pin and not cross and therefore chafe against the shell of a fixed block or sheave in the rail.

 

Regards,

I can now see what you mean and it makes sense when you think about it. Thanks again for clearing that up for me. Best regards Dave