RMS Titanic by MisterMeester - Trumpeter - 1/200 - PLASTIC

[MisterMeester]

17 hours ago, Dr PR said:

Mark,

 

It is pretty common for printers to not print at 1:1 scale, even if "Fit tp page" is disabled. Most people assume the printout is the "correct" size until they get burned as you did. If the actual size of a print is necessary you have to determine the actual error and correct for it as you did.

 

However, there is another problem. How do you know the ruler you are using is accurate? I have a collection of rulers from different manufacturers and they do not all agree! Some differ by as much as 0.1 inch in 12 inches (0.83%). The cheaper ones tend to be junk. But metal "shop" rulers may also be inaccurate - there is a lot of junk being marketed by worthless slimeballs who care more about how much money they can stuff in their pockets than the quality of the products they sell.

 

If you have calipers that can measure to 0.001 inch (0.0254 mm) you can check your rulers to determine which are most accurate.  

 

But how accurate are your calipers? There is always some error in measurement devices. It is just a question of how accurate is good enough? For modeling purposes an error of +/- 0.001 inch is good enough.

 

Phil,

 

Very good points. Thanks. Never considered a ruler might be inaccurate. I do not have calipers. The ruler I used is a cheapo bought at a drug store.

Anyway, it all worked out. If I'm ever in need of this kind of accuracy again, which I suppose is likely, I will definitely take your points into consideration. Me thinks a Staedtler ruler would be accurate.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[Winnie]

On 7/6/2024 at 9:39 PM, MisterMeester said:

Sorry I haven't replied sooner. I'm supposed to get an email notification advising me of replies to this log. Not sure how I missed that. 

 

Pictures from that other site? Which pictures? The MiniBrass kit? There's a good video or two on YouTube on that one. 

 

I have an elderly aunt in Winnipeg. Hate to say it, but I might be out that way in a year or two for a funeral. She's 93.

 

Cheers,

Mark

We have an amazing hobbyshop here... Hobbysense, not too much in the sense of aftermarket, but tools, paints and models... wow.

 

The images I'm looking for are these ones:

On 5/5/2024 at 5:34 PM, MisterMeester said:

 

Cheers

I'll send you a message through the messaging system

[MisterMeester]

Working the underhull plating kit from Woody's Modelworks (aka Maritime Models) has begun. The idea here is to build the plating in five sections, setting aside each section as it's completed, and then glue the sections to the hull en masse. The seller states (in an email reply) that the thickness of the styrene is 0.20mm. I don't dispute that as it appears, in a side by side comparison to the .005" (0.13mm) styrene I used for the stern plating, to be slightly thicker. As with the stern plates worked, there is a "lip" on each of these plates that I deem necessary to sand down.

 

 

 

And so it begins. I think this will be fairly easy, just tedious and time consuming. It's going to take awhile.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

 

Edited July 12 by MisterMeester
Improved wording

[MisterMeester]

Sheet 1 done.

 

Starting Sheet #2 soon. 

 

One recently learned disadvantage to being on a blood thinner as a result of an angioplasty is that back issues are not immune to easily being rectified by a chiropractor. As it is, I have suffered a back ailment (not the first time), that, because of my recent stent implants, cannot be rectified in a traditional "back crack" chiropractor way until said implants have "healed" (6-12 months). A disappointing aspect of this (the back ailment) is I can't swing a golf club without resultant pain and can't get "fixed" by my chiropractor without "back cracking" until said stent healing is complete. I've been worse off before, but not in this scenario, and hoping that this setback can be rectified with modified chiro appointments as well as self care (read: annoying exercises) at home.

Point being, I will initially, and maybe beyond, have more time on my hands than expected to continue work on this project this summer. Hoping not, though.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[Robin Kooter]

Dear members, 

For "The Legend of the Titanic" immersive experience in Madrid, am i looking for multiple 1:200 RMS Titanic wooden models that are finished. Please get in contact with me if you would like to sell. 

https://madridartesdigitales.com/agenda/Titanic/?gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAAoaFO6lCzJDBN45yncKUw0vL5Nllq&gclid=Cj0KCQjwgrO4BhC2ARIsAKQ7zUmLKh-rXalQZPxOX5rd4kAQUMbDMVkJ8uoTvDOhGrStxReqDOcT8CgaAi75EALw_wcB

[MisterMeester]

Sheet 2 done, a few months ago.

Golf season over, Scale Modeling season commenced. Sheet 3 completed today.

Two more sheets to go before applying to the hull.

 

Thanks for looking and cheers,

Mark

 

 

 

[MisterMeester]

Minor imperfection on Sheet 4. Port plate #146 not entirely cut through. Not a big deal.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Sheet 4 done. One sheet left.

It takes me about 1 hour and 20 minutes to do one row of eight plates. ~ 16 hours for an entire sheet. Hoping to have Sheet 5 done in a week.

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Started Sheet 5 ......

 

.....as per instructions, noting that some of the forward most plates are not symmetrical to each side....

 

....and it didn't take long to discover that these asymmetrical plates are labelled incorrectly.

Not a big deal, and I suppose it's irrelevant, if one is paying attention and cuts, then applies, each plate as one goes.

 

Further, it appears that this sheet does not have as many plates as the previous four. Should be able to get this sheet done in less than a week. 

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Cheers,

Mark

Edited October 30 by MisterMeester
Typos

[MisterMeester]

Another labelling mistake from the manufacturer. Plates 203 and 204 of Sheet 5 are mislabeled on the styrene sheet. The template sheet is correct.

 

Seems with each aftermarket kit I've bought and either looked at or begun working with, so far there is at least one issue. Again, not a big deal here, but for a detailed person who expects better, it's a tad annoying. Further, as per instructions, the plates are to be laid in the numbered order. Took a minute or two to figure this anomaly out. Buyer beware when it comes to aftermarket kits, in my opinion. I might just send a short email to the supplier of this kit to give them a heads up on this.

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Cheers,

Mark

Edited November 1 by MisterMeester
Added a sentence.

[MisterMeester]

Sheet 5 done.

 

Time to begin attaching the sheets to the hull. Instructions for doing so....

 

The instructions are quite clear and specific regarding the fit of the sheets transversely. However, they are not clear and specific regarding where to start with Sheet 1 longitudinally. “Plate 1 must line up with the kit plates at the rear.” It is unclear what, exactly, that means.

 

Dry Fit #1

This is where I started with Sheet 1, Port Side, taking into account the vertical width of Plate #1. This positioning ended up being wrong.

 

Marking for the 1mm overlap for Sheet 2.

 

Port Sheet 1 dry fit, showing transverse alignment.

 

Port Sheet 2 dry fit, showing transverse alignment.

 

Port Sheet 3 dry fit, showing transverse alignment.

 

Port Sheets 2 and 3 dry fit, showing transverse misalignment inboard. Something isn’t right.

 

I continued the first dry fit with Sheets 4 and 5, but neglected to take pictures of this. The overlap of Sheet 5 onto Sheet 4 was way too much. From memory it appeared to me to be ~10+mm overlap, rather than 1mm.

Something was clearly not right. It was quite obvious that everything needed to be shifted aft. But how far aft? Where is Sheet 1 supposed to start? Off to YouTube to research an answer.

 

Dry Fit #2 – I found little information on YouTube regarding this aftermarket kit, and nothing that specifically addressed my question. However, in one video there where a few seconds that appeared to show the aft edge of Plate #1 of Sheet #1 as far aft as the stern frame. This was my starting point for the second dry fit. Unfortunately, I neglected to take a picture of this as well. However, this starting point is indicated in an upcoming third dry fit photo.

 

The following two pictures show longitudinal misalignment still present. Everything now needs to be shifted forward.

 

The middle of Sheet 4. The step from Plate 170 to Plate 178 is supposed to align with the kit plates. This isn’t mentioned in the instructions, but it’s obvious.

 

Longitudinal misalignment of Sheet 5 indicated here. Again, proper longitudinal alignment isn’t mentioned in the instructions regarding this sheet either, but it’s obvious. By measurement, everything needs to be shifted 2.5mm forward.

 

Dry Fit #3

Sheet 1 moved 2.5mm forward. Red arrow indicates the pencil mark showing the starting point of the second dry fitting.

 

Sheet 4 aligned longitudinally.

 

Sheet 5 aligned longitudinally.

As well, the inboard misalignment mentioned earlier, of Sheet 2 with Sheet 3, is no longer there.

 

Okay. Appears I got it. Time to glue.

 

I chose to go with the E6000+ option.

In another YouTube video, the modeler used a Q-Tip to spread the glue on the underside of the sheets. I did the same, but I would not recommend that method as the cotton spreads out from the tip and, at one point, a chunk of cotton came off. For the subsequent sheets, I plan on using a cheap bristle brush.

I managed to spread the glue thin enough to avoid the potential issue of glue coming up through gaps at the plate seams.

 

Dealing with large gaps along the Turn of the Bilge……

At first I attempted using Tamiya Extra Thin Cement to deal with the large gaps, as per instructions, however, as one has to hold pressure on the styrene during the curing, it became quickly apparent that doing all gaps by this method was going to take way too long as the curing time is relatively slow.

Therefore, I switched to CA glue and applied it with a Glue Looper.

 

Another aspect I learned from one of the YouTube videos is that the protrusion of Plate #1 is actually to be folded over and glued down to the keel. This is not indicated in the instructions.

I'm still undecided on the position of the aft edge of Plate #1. I may choose to trim that when I tackle the plating work around the Stern Frame.

 

Port Sheet 1 completed.

 

I figure it would be best to do Starboard side Sheet 1 next, as opposed to the rest of the Port side. In my mind that approach would ensure uniform alignment of both sides on the longitudinal axis.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[yvesvidal]

I remember gluing 2400 copper tiles on my HMS Bellona. I wonder if using thin aluminum sticking tape would not have been easier than styrene plates....

 

I admire your work. Your Titanic will be one of a kind.

 

Yves

[Force9]

Ahoy Mark...

 

It is great to see all of the details associated with this plating kit from Maritime Models.  It looks to be a terrific solution and your insights will surely help those who follow behind you... Should save lots of confusion and wasted effort for future modelers. 

 

My understanding is that some folks have come along behind and sanded down some of the prominent edges where the plates overlap to better blend everything to match the kit.

 

I'm sure you'll be pleased with the result.

 

Cheers,

Evan

[MisterMeester]

Yves and Evan,

I still consider myself a rookie model builder, so thank you for the words of encouragement. It's means a lot.

 

Yves,

Interesting suggestion re: aluminum tape. It would be more malleable.

 

Evan,

When I did a Google search to find an answer to my above question(s) this very build log came up as one of the search results. Needless to say, I was quite pleased with that. So, yes....absolutely I hope that my documentation here will be of benefit to others who choose this aftermarket kit.

 

Regarding sanding of the prominent plate overlaps, thank you for that suggestion. I will consider it, however, I'm not sure my skill level won't botch it. Some sanding I am very much considering is the plate edges in the after part of Sheets 1 (both sides) as there are quite obvious protrusions below the keel.

 

Cheers,

Mark   

[MisterMeester]

Did a complete dry fit of the Starboard side and pencil marked the hull for fit, accordingly.

 

Sheet 1 for the Starboard side applied last night. Ended up with a slight misalignment with Plate #1 (indicated within the red circle). Not sure why that is as the rest of the sheet is aligned properly. I haven't completely researched the Stern Frame plating yet, but I'm hoping I'll be able to "fix" this when I get to that.

The blue circle indicates plate edges protruding below the keel that I intend to sand down.

I found this sheet a bit more of a challenge than the first Port sheet, in regard to getting the fit right as well as applying CA glue to the large gaps. Seems odd as I had 2 -4 glasses of wine in me for the first sheet. Perhaps different ergonomics that come with working on the opposite side is the explanation. 

But I digress.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[king derelict]

Possibly switch to a single malt 😃

alan

[king derelict]

Seriously I think the work you are doing with the plates is amazing. A huge effort but it’s going to result in a fantastic model. 
alan

[MisterMeester]

20 hours ago, king derelict said:

Seriously I think the work you are doing with the plates is amazing. A huge effort but it’s going to result in a fantastic model. 
alan

Thanks King D.

 

Cheers.

[MisterMeester]

Progress report.

 

Trial and error learning curve while continuing the under hull plating application.

 

I was finding applying CA glue to the edge gaps tedious and time consuming. So, in order to assist the E6000+ glue with doing its job, in particular....the outer edges along the Turn of the Bilge, I changed my taping strategy.

 

However, I found taping the outer edge of Port Sheet 2, as shown, didn’t work so well. It was not enough tape, and lifted. CA glue was still required.

 

So, for Starboard Sheet 2, I beefed up the taping on the outer edge, transversely.

However, the edge here lifted somewhat as well. Not only that, but applying the transverse tape strips actually pulled the whole sheet outward and away from the keel. Unfortunately, I thought it was fine and walked away from it.  

 

The inboard edge, here, should be up to that pencil line.

 

Misalignment shown here as well.

 

For Port Sheet 3, I was still optimistic that I could tape the outer edge down, and save a lot of CA gluing time. So, I beefed up the transverse taping on this sheet even more (no pic). However, doing that pulled this sheet outward by a lot. Fortunately, I noticed it this time (hard not to) and the curing time of the E6000+ allowed me to remove all the tape, and lift and reposition the sheet.

 

I re-taped the sheet without taping down the outer edge. Just left it as is, as shown, and then just walked away, letting the E600+ glue do its thing.

  

Starboard Sheet 3 taped as shown. Outer edge left unsecured. Letting the E6000+ cure.

 

Next day (allowing at least 12 hours to cure)….taping the outer edge in preparation for CA gluing. CA gluing is inevitable. In my experience, there are no shortcuts with this. It is what it is.

 

Applying CA glue, pushing the plate down to the hull and allowing capillary action to do its thing.

 

Next step, remove the transverse tape strips and CA glue there, where the plate overlaps are.

 

In my experience, there are more edge gaps than just the outer edges that require CA glue. For these six larger sheets, it’s taking me about 3 hours each sheet to apply CA glue and get the edges and gaps secured.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Progress Report.

 

Sheet 5, Port side. I found it necessary to robustly tape this sheet down. No shifting occurred.

 

There was significant overlap here, of the aftermarket kit overlapping the kit’s plate line.

 

I sanded down the overlap and this is the result. Hard to tell in this picture but it is much better.

 

Again, hard to tell in the picture, but there is unexplained misalignment here. I’ve marked with a pencil what needs to be trimmed.

 

And this is the result. I know, hard to see in the pic and it is not "historically accurate", but it is definitely cleaner and better. 

 

Some further trimming was required here, so I used masking tape for a straight edge. Trimmed using a 17a chisel.

 

And on to the final sheet. #5 Starboard side.

 

I must say that Sheet 5 on the Port side has been the most difficult and time consuming, so far. I'm expecting the same with the Starboard side, as there looks to be some unexplained misalignments with this sheet as well. 

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

[madtatt]

Wow, it's amazing how meticulously you correct the hull and bring it to historical accuracy.
This is plastic model making on a higher level. Respect.
Please be allowed to come on board the Titanic. 🫡

[MisterMeester]

On 11/16/2024 at 11:09 PM, madtatt said:

Wow, it's amazing how meticulously you correct the hull and bring it to historical accuracy.
This is plastic model making on a higher level. Respect.
Please be allowed to come on board the Titanic. 🫡

Thank you. I am only one year in as a scale modeler, so to receive such a compliment means a lot.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Getting back at it after basically one week away from the model bench due to a lot going on.

 

All sheets are now affixed to the hull.

 

Began prepping for laying the Keel Bar by giving the Keel Line a sanding.

 

Before continuing with the Keel Bar itself, I decided to clean up the entire job.

 

The texture of the E6000+ glue is similar to silicone, when dried. I found an eraser stick very useful for cleaning up excess E6000+.

 

For excess CA glue, I used a 17a chisel blade, very delicately.

 

After completing the clean up, I decided I was not happy with some plate misalignments along the Keel Line.

Therefore, I used masking tape to provide a straight edge, and chiseled them clean.

 

In the meantime, I was pondering how to deal with some misalignments of both sides of Sheet 5 at the bow.

 

Port side.

 

Starboard side.

 

Option 1: Leave it as is.

Option 2: Sand down the kit lines. (This just seems wrong.)

Option 3: Remove and replace.

 

I’ve chosen option 3. I’ll be removing the existing plates, as numbered in the pictures, and using new plates cut from the leftover scrap styrene sheets.

 

Footnote: I can’t explain all these misalignments. I thought I was quite precise with building the plate sheets on the templates. Can’t figure if it’s me, or the manufactured product? Or perhaps a combination of a bit of both? Anyhoo….

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Foremost plates of Sheet 5, both sides, redone.

 

Port side.

 

Starboard side.

 

More misalignments…..

 

Plate #1, Starboard…..

 

….and redone.

 

I must say the following two “misalignments” (for lack of a better word in this case), in the vicinity of Frame 90F, are not the modeler, but rather, the aftermarket kit. The pictures clearly show Plate #202, on each side, are not wide enough. They come pre-cut. They should be wide enough.

 

Port Side.

 

Starboard side.

 

Next up, I’ll be installing the Keel Bar. I will not be using the supplied aftermarket keel strips for two reasons.

1.   Four of the seven strips provided are distorted.

2.   They are not to scale. (Perhaps a moot point, but given reason #1, might as well model the Keel Bar to scale).

 

Titanic had a Keel Bar (flat bar strip for protecting the keel) that measured 19½” wide x 3” thick. At 1/200 scale this is 2.48mm wide x 0.38mm thick. The kit provided strips are 2.0mm wide (1.5mm at some points due to the distortion) x 0.20mm thick. I’ll be using 2.5mm x 0.38mm styrene strips for the Keel Bar.

 

Just a few things left to do after that.

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[Force9]

Ahoy Mark -

 

Looks like some terrific adjustments to bring everything into alignment.  A tricky business with the overlaps needed for each plate.

 

Great to see the progress.

 

Cheers

Evan

[king derelict]

Great work Mark. I don’t think I would have the mental fortitude to do what you are doing. I hope there will be a bottle of choice alcohol under the tree.

alan

[MisterMeester]

5 hours ago, Force9 said:

Ahoy Mark -

 

Looks like some terrific adjustments to bring everything into alignment.  A tricky business with the overlaps needed for each plate.

 

Great to see the progress.

 

Cheers

Evan

Evan,

 

Yes, very difficult to get it bang on.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

[MisterMeester]

2 hours ago, king derelict said:

Great work Mark. I don’t think I would have the mental fortitude to do what you are doing. I hope there will be a bottle of choice alcohol under the tree.

alan

Thanks, Alan.

It has taken me quite a bit longer than I originally envisioned. Looking forward to completing this aspect of the build and moving on to the next.

Oh, and Santa usually comes through with a bottle or two. I have no concerns with that.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

Change of mind. Decided to do the few other things first and the Keel Bar last.

 

So, during the dry fits it appeared to me that the “steel” casting leading up from the Keel to the Stem was in the way of Sheet 5. So, I knee jerk reacted and chiseled a portion of it off. This was weeks ago.

 

Since doing that, I was concerned that perhaps I was wrong and shouldn’t have. However, upon applying Sheet 5 it was confirmed that it was in fact in the way.

 

In hindsight, if I did make a mistake with this, it would be that I chiseled off too much. OR,….perhaps I should have left well enough alone and modified the plates of Sheet 5 instead.

Regardless, it is what it is and it needed fixing.

 

I used .75mm x 1.0mm (.030” x .040”) styrene rod to replace what I removed.

.75mm is the transverse measurement, 1.0mm is the vertical.

 

 

There were some gaps between the plates and this new casting that needed filling. I used Vallejo Plastic Putty 70.401 for that.

 

I also used Vallejo Plastic Putty 70.401 to clean up the mess where the two #1 plates meet at the Stern.

 

 

The Keel Bar in place. As mentioned earlier, I used 0.38mm x 2.5mm (.015” x .100”) styrene strips for that.

 

And finally, will the hull still fit in the kit provided stand with this aftermarket kit applied? Yes. It will.

 

And that’s that. As long as it took, I’m really happy with how this aftermarket kit turned out and I’m really looking forward to seeing what it will look like with paint on it. (Much better, I expect.)

 

Having said that, I can’t give it 5 stars out of 5. I think the instructions could have been a little more comprehensive.

-      In particular, regarding EXACTLY where should the #1 plates on Sheet 1 start on the longitudinal axis, when applying those sheets to the hull. Kind of important. Thankfully, I made it work with three dry fits.

-      A bit of a heads up on what to expect with the application of Sheet 5 would have gone a long way too.

-      And finally, both #202 plates were clearly not cut wide enough.

 

Up next, I’m going to look at doing some scratch plating above the Stern Frame.  

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[MisterMeester]

My initial intent with work around the Stern Frame was addressing the kit's lack of the curved lines the plating has in this area, as indicated in this photograph (image obtained from the Library of Congress).

But upon beginning this and looking into this further, a few other things came up.

 

First of was the zinc anode sheathing on the Rudder Post. I figured dealing with this was within my skill level.

 

I simply used masking tape and pencil shading to get a measure of the distance around , and also measured the height required (26mm) before removing the tape.

  

And then transferred that to .005” styrene sheeting.

 

Part of the process of cementing this “zinc” anode in place. It took a few clamping/cementing sessions.

 

Then on to my original intent….

First off, I scanned a certain diagram (of the Stern Frame) from a certain publication and then printed it more than once, reducing it each time and matching it to the kit until I got what I thought was the right scale. The original scan reduced to 65% seemed right to me.

With some more pencil shading, I got this….

I’m not showing the printed side so as to avoid any copyright infringement.

 

Transferred to .005” styrene sheeting.

 

 

I applied these pieces primarily with E6000+ glue. After 24 hours I used a rubber band to pull in the edges that didn’t lay flat and finished the job with CA glue.

 

 

Port Side:

 

Starboard side:

 

1). “Zinc” anode strip also added here, as per research.

2). Note modifications to Plate #1 of the aftermarket under hull plating kit. Trimmed

     longitudinally to bring it in line with the kits plate line immediately above, and

     curvature added as per research.

3). The stern tube for the center prop is just wrong. Still mulling over what to do with this, if

      anything. Might just leave it as is. It appears to me, upon comparing the mold

      to historical photographs, that it’s not just the lack of the tapered sheath

      plating here that is an issue, but I think the diameter of the stern tube itself is

      too narrow. Next step with this will be deciding which propellor I want to go

      with and see if the propellor boss diameter matches the stern tube. If the boss is by

      chance larger, then I’ll look at ways to build up the diameter of the stern

      tube and continue the modification forward, for the raised plating. Not holding my breath on this one. 

4). I have an aftermarket kit that has PE for these locations.

 

And back to the under hull plating one more time…..I came across a build log in a different Forum that made mention of Plates 200 and 202, of the same aftermarket kit that I used, with regard to how these plates just abruptly end and look unfinished. I agree. Therefore, I added .010” x .020” styrene strips to the forward edge of these plates.

 

Port:

 

Starboard:

 

Thanks for looking. Suggestions are welcome.

 

Cheers,

Mark