Lowell Grand Banks Dory by MBerg - Model Shipways - 1:24 - First Build

[MBerg]

On 5/24/2024 at 9:36 PM, JacquesCousteau said:

Very nice job on the lobster trap!

Thanks! And thank you again for the help through messages. I had a browser tab open to where you made yours. Very helpful, and your idea of using bottle caps to curve the wood worked perfectly! 

Edited May 26 by MBerg

[aaronc]

2 hours ago, MBerg said:

Warning: This is a bit of a long post that has little to do with the build as it should be. Skip to the last paragraph or two if you just want a update on the build.

 

Okee. Back in business. Sorta. I gotta say, this is not leaving a great first impression of Model-Expo/Model Shipways (same company/related?).

 

The replacement parts arrived today; after a month. I was pretty excited to get back at it just in time for the weekend... An incredibly thin sheet of basswood shipped across the continent in a yellow padded envelope, folded in half. After seeing that, I can't say I was surprised that the sheet was also snapped in half when I opened it. Still hopeful that the parts made it unscathed; it looks like a couple of them broke out of the sheet, but the parts themselves were in tact - good news! Then; hang on... these have the exact same problem in the exact same spots as the sheet they were replacing.

 

Not only was the replacement as bad as the original, it was worse. There were more laser burns and the cuts were bigger and clumsier, and even wavy on multiple lines. What in the world are they doing over there? Maybe they should focus less on selling everything at 50% off and more on running a smooth operation.

 

Did the laser cutter have too much to drink the night before? Why is every other line so shaky?

 

A comparison of the original sheet on the left (nice, smooth, thin, cuts) and the replacement on the right (thick, darker, burned, wobbly)

 

 

Now I'm in manufacturing; we laser cut 90% of everything we make. The only difference is steel instead of wood. First off, someone is clearly not paying attention with this machine. It badly needs a head adjustment, head replacement; some sort of maintenance. This should be detected during routine maintenance before manufacturing product for a customer, not after. Secondly, manufacturing is not an easy business, mistakes happen, I get it. It's how you handle the mistake that really matters and makes you excel or not. The fact that a defective part was produced, and there was likely zero effort to ensure the same issue wasn't replicated on the replacement is a terrible sign.

 

I'm now thinking they have a corrupted laser file that needs fixing. Either way, I don't work there, it's not my issue to solve. There are rare cases where even when taking precautions, the same thing can happen twice. These guys seem to be quite highly regarded, so maybe that's what happened here. I can still give the benefit of the doubt, but this does not put them in a great spot in my books as is.

 

In any case, there's only one thing to do, and that is move forward. I feel I can overlap some of the error -it's not that big. Scaling up to full size it would probably mean about 1/2" - 1" offset in the planks. Not unnoticeable, but not impossible to work with. Part of the concern is it is the same problem across all three planks. The bevels may be a little tricky to account for properly and lining up the correct starboard side with the incorrect port side may pose some problems. Maybe I will learn something I otherwise wouldn't. I wrote in another post that I ordered the next two boats in the series as a kit (which also came with another dory) as a significant discount so I will have a second shot at this build should I feel the need - hopefully the sheet is correct in that one!

 

I may not post much as I work on the planks, but I will take pictures and expect to keep the build log up to date. I've been working on a lobster trap which I'll likely post more about later. I'll drop a pic of it below so I at least have some positive content in this post
 

I need to sort out what I'm going to do for paint/wash, and netting before I continue to finish this up:

 

Wish me luck!

 

Not sure what that is...lobster trap? Or something else..but it looks great. I've noticed several making their own "extras" to accompany their Dory builds.

[SiriusVoyager]

The oars for my Dory looked like the machine was shaking as well. It was pretty bad.  I felt like the quality control was lacking, but like you, so many praised these kits so I thought maybe I just got an off one. Sounds like it may be a common problem, at least with this particular series of models. 

[MBerg]

On 5/24/2024 at 11:26 PM, aaronc said:

lobster trap?

Correct. Or, well, will be a lobster trap. Need to pick up a couple supplies to finish it. Back to the dory for now. 

 

23 hours ago, SiriusVoyager said:

Sounds like it may be a common problem

I think correct. I rewatched (probably for the 10th time) a build video on YouTube posted about a year ago. I only just noticed today that the bottom board sheet had serious wobble on his parts. That would tell me it's more of a laser problem, then a specific product line - especially since we all had it on different sheets. They've been around a long time, maybe their recent quality control has dropped off. Just yesterday I came across a couple year old thread on this forum regarding them and deals with some shady Chinese company so maybe they're going that route. I'll be being a little more cautious when dealing with them. 

Edited May 26 by MBerg
Typo

[MBerg]

Log #8

 

I've made some pretty good progress over the last few days. Planking is complete, although not perfect, it's pretty decent and was a great learning experience. The boat is off the build board; but that was right before bed so I haven't even cut the frames back yet.

 

Some 'questionable' clamping techniques and some not too bad ones:

 

 

 

 

 

Starting to come together - looking pretty even:

 

 

 

Wet bending the final planks:

 

 

So far everything has fit very nicely. Multiple dryfit checks confirmed the strakes should go on pretty good as well. As I finished gluing the final planks, there was a small issue which I believe was partially caused by the defective laser cut offset in every plank on the port side. Not a massive issue, but I noticed in order to line everything up and match them correctly, the stern end needed a bit of a 'lift' which caused the plank to bend at a weird angle and bow out between a couple frames.

 

Patience, a long period of holding by hand while curing and some diluted glue to get between the planks helped immensely and I was happy with the result.

 

Once confident the glue was cured enough for me to let go, I started inspecting it and noticed the starboard strake was higher than when I initially lined it up. It must've slipped slightly while I was holding it because I made damn sure it looked good when I put it on. In any case, it wasn't terrible, but then it made the uneven rope holes (don't know the nautical name) glaringly obvious. I took about 30 second before I decided this needed to be fixed. I started running alcohol over the seam, praying that it wouldn't release the other board as well since they were both recently glued.

 

 

I won't get into the details, but I wasn't perfectly happy with how this went. A big lesson learned in terms of giving myself enough time - I put myself into a rushed situation and butchered the inside of the plank a bit. In the end, I was able to pull it back to the first frame and refit it. Much better; however, still not lined up perfectly. I realized I placed the port plank a bit further forward than the starboard plank. I immediately wished those holes were left un drilled so I could line them up manually. After the hack job I did trying to debond part of the starboard side, I decided to wait until further inspection before doing any further damage removing an entire plank.

 

After some thought I realized the unevenness will be less noticeable once the rope is in, and also isn't noticeable unless looking from 'underneath' the boat. On top of that, the breast hook is going to cover it up from the inside. Then I realized the breast hook is also going to hide the damage I caused on the inside of the starboard plank. I will still do the best I can to add some filler and sand it down, but this made me feel better about it

 

I then trimmed the planks, sanded it all down (working on some of the excess glue as well) and was quite happy with the result. I was about to call it quits, but decided to take a crack at removing the building board. It came off about 100x easier than I expected. Really just slid right out as I pressed each frame up 1 at a time from underneath.

 

In hindsight, I should've glued the defective side first and then the 'good side'. Since the entire sheet of port planks had defects, some of my flexibility was lost so I feel it would've been easier to use the good planks to conform to the needs of the bad ones. Finally, I spent so much time and attention making sure the planks were vertically aligned, I failed to make sure they were at the same distance from the front. Honestly, I didn't think this would be an issue since its all trimmed and sanded down, as well as a false stem being added later. Those sneaky holes changed that theory.

 

I'll go ahead and post this, then leave a second post with just pictures of where I ended.

 

Thanks for looking,

Matt

Edited May 30 by MBerg
Clarity and readability

[MBerg]

Some of these aren't after fully sanding, but it doesn't look much different.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for looking,

Matt

[druxey]

Every model is a learning process and it looks as if you are doing well. 

[JacquesCousteau]

That looks great!

[MBerg]

I appreciate the comments! and yes, I think learning something new is a big motivator as well.

 

I didn't get much time last night, but managed to get the false stem glued on. I noticed other builds used the left over from the cleats, which I could not find for the life of me. I assume I placed it somewhere in the void during the month hiatus and reorganizing the space. Luckily, I have a batch of 1/32 x 1/8 that I got for the lobster trap so I used that. Seems a bit thicker than the cleat strips, but that just means more sanding. No concerns there.

 

I'm starting to think ahead to the side cleats, seat risers, and painting which is posing a couple questions.

 

1. My painting plan was to just mix some up from the bottle, stick it on a plastic sheet and lay it down thin and in multiple coats - my question is this: Should I be planning something different? I've seeing a lot of build logs with modelers not so happy with painting results, and help topics on painting. I thought it was fairly straight forward, but now I'm thinking that's just my ignorance showing through.

 

2. It seems some very light sanding may be necessary after the first coat. My thoughts don't follow the instructions, but is there any reason why I shouldn't paint and sand the inner planks between the frames before placing the seat risers? Surely that would make things easier.... or is my ignorance now starting to create a pile over here? I find when new to something, there can be a fine line between 'critical thinking' and "Oh! so that's why they do it like that!"

 

Any advice is appreciated!

Edited May 30 by MBerg

[robert952]

As to the painting, I think we all come up with a system that works for us individually.  I do look where I will paint and determine when to paint what.  If an area I plan to paint is going to be difficult to get to (example under a seat seat riser or in a tight corner), I'll paint during assembling, before the area gets covered up. My concern is always that I may do something to mess up the paint job as I continue assembly.  (Particular a problem I have with plastic models and the seemingly inevitable errant drop of adhesive.) 

 

I use a small tray. From what you imply, if I poured paint on a plastic sheet, it would start drying too soon for me.  Even with the metal tray, I make sure the paint doesn't dry out too quickly.  I usually have a solvent (water or thinner depending on the paint I am using) in one of the cups to help out with that.  Also I can clean the brush to make sure the paint doesn't start drying out while paining. 

 

 

You can find similar at local  hobby/craft/art supply shops or online.  I think I've had this one 'forever.'  As I peruse the net, they seem to be less than a couple bucks each (especially in bulk - 16 plastic for under $10 on Amazon).  At a hobby shop probably 2-3 bucks for one. 

 

For me the advantage is that I can have multiple colors ready to go and even put some water or thinner in one of the cups which I use to clean the brush as needed.  I don't do a lot of mixing of colors, but I try to pour out a consistent amount of paint and using an eyedropper measure any 'solvent' (water, thinner) as I thin the paint.  Not an exact science, just a rough count of drops or '1/2 of an eye dropper full' (though I do have graduate droppers that I may start using more).  

 

Ask a dozen people, you'll get a dozen pieces of advice and experiences. Most modelers would likely agree with thinning paint before application.  How thin is always tough to determine: ratio of paint to thinner.  The factors depend on type of paint used, artist brush vs air brush, drying time between coats and the list goes on. (I won't touch the 'sealant/primer' discussion, but that can effect the finish, too.)

The bottom line is to find what works for you.  I think that's what we all do. And we learn that 'if I am working with this paint, this process works best.' 

 

I'd suggest practicing on scrap material using different techniques until you find the finish you like. 

 

As to some previous comments (sorry for delay as I am catching up on reading some logs in detail), you are going through the same processes we all go through. As you have found on this model, there can be quality issues.  However, you also found that these issues might get hidden during the assembly process.  As a lot of people say, do your best and do what it takes to 'look good' to you. If  it's not as good as you like, improve the next time.

 

It's a process, not a procedure. You are doing fine and the model is coming together nicely. 

 

Side bar:  I watched "The Blue Angels" documentary on the Navy's air demo team. Through out that film (available on Prime) they all say the same thing:  strive for perfection even know though you know you will never reach it. Each pilot is their own most severe critic. They tell each other to do the best you can, learn for your experiences, and move on. Seems very appropriate for many endeavors, including model building.

 

(BTW, I thoroughly enjoyed the movie and recommend it for air enthusiasts.  Great camera work. They fly 18 inches apart. The 'in cockpit' video sure looks a lot closer than 18".  😲 )

 

Edited May 30 by robert952
clarification - I need to prof red bitter.

[JacquesCousteau]

My own painting skills are pretty minimal, but I've also found it very helpful to use a tray like the one Robert suggests. Unless it's for detail work, I usually thin the paint a good bit and use multiple coats. I also use a sealer/varnish first and sand it smooth, as I've found that the basswood absorbs a lot of the watered down paint and can even warp a bit if I'm painting a lot. My main advice is to just make sure your paint is thin enough (it will probably take more coats than you might think) and try to keep it from pooling in corners.

 

As for painting this specific hull: I waited to paint the interior until I had the risers glued in, and I found it a challenge to paint the interior. It probably wouldn't hurt to paint under them first, as long as you leave the surfaces that will be glued unpainted.

[MBerg]

Thank you - great info. So I do need to dilute it, good to know. I'll look around for some of those trays, I was thinking plastic, but i like the idea of the metal one. I have a Michael's not terribly far away that may have it.

1 hour ago, robert952 said:

My concern is always that I may do something to mess up the paint job as I continue assembly.

Very good point. See, that didn't even cross my mind.

 

I hope to get the side cleats on, trim and sand the false stem and likely test some painting this evening. Free time is running thin these days as summer draws nearer, but whatever I can get done... "No one should be discouraged, who can make constant progress, even though it be slow." - Probably Plato

 

1 hour ago, robert952 said:

"The Blue Angels" documentary

Will definitely need to check that out. I've always been an enthusiast and finally flew a Cessna 172 for the first time a couple months ago.

[MBerg]

5 hours ago, JacquesCousteau said:

use a sealer/varnish first and sand it smooth

Interesting. Are there particular sealers for that sort of thing or just any old varnish? 

 

(I must've been typing my reply when you posted) 

 

5 hours ago, JacquesCousteau said:

It probably wouldn't hurt to paint under them first 

Thanks, I'm trying this. I feel like I remember reading someone mentioning they wish they had - maybe that was you. 

 

No chance to get a log in tonight, but the false stem is finished, cleats are in - though need to be trimmed. I played around with a bit of paint, ended up dumping a little bit more out than I meant to so after painting on some scrap, I may have gotten a little excited and started a thin coat on the inner planks before I put the riser on. 

 

Can expect a log sometime early tomorrow. 

 

[JacquesCousteau]

If you search on the site, you'll find a ton of ideas on sealers, varnishes, and primers. Everyone seems to have their own preferences, but in general some kind of primer seems necessary.

 

I'm afraid I can't offer much more detailed advice. I mainly use a bottle of very cheap Politec Sellador Barniz (translation: "Sealer Varnish") that I bought a while ago while I was in Mexico. I have no idea what it actually is made of, but I haven't had any problems with it so far.

[MBerg]

Log #9

 

I tend to get a little obsessive at times, and I felt this with the false stem. I spent far more time on it than I expected; however, in the end I feel it paid off. I did not trim it before fixing it, which offered a lot of flexibility while shaping it. The downside was more shaping, and sanding through the extra glue from the larger piece. I'm happy with the result here:

 

 

In the picture above, I had already glued on the side cleats. These went on easily - I was in the scratch build mindset and had a bit of a brain lapse trying to figure out which piece of strip wood I needed to use for these, then (after a couple minutes and even checking some other build logs to no avail) realized there's still plenty of parts on the laser cut sheets and there they were. 🤦‍♂️

 

Pics are a little out of order as the next ones are right after I cut the frames back (before the false stem). Then we have a couple pics of where it sits as of now. Side cleats needing trimmed, false stem finished, and painted under the seat riser location.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I hope to get the seat risers on (or at least bent) tonight, as well as trimming and working on the gunwales.

 

Thanks for looking

Matt

Edited May 31 by MBerg
Words are hard

[MBerg]

I cleaned up the cleats and tops of the frames. Something I've noticed is the inconsistency of the wood. Some sheets being far more transparent, softer (sanding parts takes seconds where other parts take minutes), flimsier, lighter color, etc. I found this difference between the starboard and port side plank sheets. I first tried to chisel out the side cleats and I needed so much pressure I was scared to go right though everything so I carefully carved it out. By the time I went to chisel the top of the frame, the chisel blade unexpectedly cut through it like butter. Luckily I wasn't too low and it only took off a tiny bit of the char at the very top of the sheer. Lesson learned, test the wood strength before assuming it was the same as the other. Just setting the blade on the frames and giving it a few light taps was all that was needed.

 

I managed to get the seat risers on before dinner. When I mentioned gunwales earlier, I meant the bands. This evening I started working on them, and after being a little clumsier than normal, almost breaking one when sanding, getting close to going through the sheer with the chisel blade (mentioned above) and then going through the instructions trying to determine how far forward the bands should sit and the correct orientation, I realized I may have had one more glass of wine than acceptable for model making so I decided to keep it safe and walk away. 🍻

 

It seems @JacquesCousteau positioned the bands just shy of the false stem (thank you for pointing that out in your log), and some reference photos show either that or partway up the false stem so I'll do similar.

 

Here's where we leave it tonight.

[MBerg]

Log #10

 

Bands and gunwales.

 

Progress is definitely going slower than I'd like, with more rain recorded this spring than in 50 years the outdoors is growing like a jungle, septic issues, work meetings, family duties, etc. I was hoping to have more in each log, but I think I can finish up where I am now and move along to painting pretty soon.

 

Note: As I progress, I'm using the kit supplied yellow glue and am learning something. When you have to sand 'through' a dried glue joint, it's a lot harder to sand through yellow glue than it is white glue (I suspect). Although the hold seems far stronger, cure time when using finger clamps is far shorter, and I have zero concern over anything coming apart. Any sort of sanding, cleaning up or debonding required, is more difficult. That said, I feel the best would be to swap back and forth between yellow and white depending on the future work required for that piece.

 

The bands went on fairly simply. I took extra time, whether necessary or not, to soak the bands for a minute, clipped them in place and had them dry before gluing. I set them a little higher than I feel I should have which required more sanding. The end result worked out.

 

This 50 or 100 pack of mini cloths pins of Amazon have been incredibly helpful.

 

 

 

 

Bands glued.

 

As for the gunwales. The instructions said to bend them before gluing. Since earlier instructions purposely taught the skill of wet bending and drying in place, that's the route I went after first testing the flexibility of the 1/16" x 1/16" piece.

 

I cut/sanded to fit the stem and left the aft end extra long. This meant that the bend wouldn't be perfect, but they would be 80% there when dry.

 

 

 

 

Initially I thought I cut a couple frames too low. Boy, was I wrong, the gunwales were sitting way higher than I expected. This is good, far easier to remove than add. I worked my way down the frames, repeated test fittings to ensure I didn't take too much off. When test fitting, I used a straight edge to check the level between the gunwale and strike/band. Once I determined the rough height, I used a 1/8" strip to help gauge in between test fittings. My goal was to leave the gunwale a bit high so it can be sanded level as per instructions.

 

 

 

 

That's about where I am now, the starboard side is ready for gluing. The port side will go a bit quicker since I've gotten the process down and know the general height that frames should be cut. Once the gunwales on are, I believe it's just the breast hook before painting both the hull and cap rails.

 

Looking ahead. Since the rails are laser cut, I do intent to dry fit, and potentially wet bend them before everything is painted to make sure they go on nicely when ready. ( I don't think this would work well after painting)

 

The closer I get to painting, the more I'm thinking about all the dust that has accumulated. I've tried blowing it, I've tried wiping it with a micro fiber cloth. I'm not sure what you people typically do to clean before and in between paint coats, but I pulled my tack cloth out of my old bow making kit (again, that's 'bow and arrow' bow, not 'bow' bow). This seemed to work well enough for getting the majority of dust off. (tack cloth not to scale).

 

Edited June 5 by MBerg
Must proof read BEFORE sumbitting

[robert952]

14 minutes ago, MBerg said:

(tack cloth not to scale).

😃 Don't you hate when that happens.

 

The model is really shaping up and looking good. 

 

[druxey]

A damp brush gets nicely into corners to remove dust.

[MBerg]

Log #11

 

The frames needed a bit more trimming before getting the gunwales on. After gluing them, I still felt they could've gone lower in some spots. It was very surprising how high the one corner sits since they sit at an angle. In any case, on they went, and were sanded flush.

 

I then started working on the breast hook realizing how small it really was.

 

 

I had a similar scenario as other build logs where the tip of the breast hook almost needed to be completely sanded off to fit. Instead of doing this, I decided to make a little notch in the gunwales. They're slightly offset to begin with so this gave it a more symmetrical, finished look.

 

 

 

Multiple test fits and shaping required before a good fit. In the end, it fit so well I almost felt like there was no need for glue!

 

 

 

The frame irons went on next. This part I found frustrating since I first followed the instructions and tediously made multiple at the suggested size. Other build logs and my experience showed that suggestion is far too large. I ended up making a second batch, which was again, too large. In the end, I tried my best to slice off little strips from the existing oversized ones. This was difficult to get perfect and some ended up being slightly different size, but we're talking 32nds or 64ths so it's not the end of the world. I doubt they had perfect manufacturing processes in 1800 😉

 

 

 

Next, the transom required some smoothing and shaping. I tried with a chisel blade first, but quickly realized how terrible this was going to turn out so I ended up sanding it down. A small piece of painters tape on the transom protected it while shaping the cleat. As for the semi circle on the top (I forget the name of) - I started with a file, but it was a little too large so I rolled a piece of sand paper around a small sculpting tool which worked well.

 

 

 

Again, as others pointed out, the thwart on frame #1 needed significant shaping. I alternated between a small rectangular file in the slot and course sandpaper on the ends, eventually working it down to size. I found that when test fitting, if it rocked back and forth, it was the slot that needed more sanding or beveling(it was resting on the frame); however, when it wouldn't rock much, the ends needed to be taken in (it was resting on the hull).

 

The #5 thwart needed some reducing as well, but not much. The rest were basically just beveled and ended up sitting very nicely on the risers.

 

 

 

Finally, I was ready for the first coat of paint. This was my first real attempt at painting a model, or wood, or anything really, and I feel it went fairly well. I thinned it probably around 20%; or 1:5, whatever metric is used for paint thinning. This was very much eyeballed so 20% is a best guess. I'll likely grab a dropper for more control, but I basically just scooped up a bit of water in a bottle cap and poured a small amount on.

 

 

 

 

 

The next log will likely finish out this build. I just applied the first coat on the cap rails, and the second coat of the interior hull. The second coat was a little tedious and I used a large flat brush to get most of it, then a far smaller round brush to get under the gunwales, sides of frames, especially around the risers, as well as little nooks and crannies.

 

It took far longer than I expected and I kept seeing more tiny little spots that needed touching up, but overall I enjoyed the level of attention to detail and care that it took.

 

Believe it or not, this little dory isn't my lifetime dream build; however, it's grown on me and I'm very happy to be spending time on it. Being that the thwarts and oars are already complete, I gave myself a view of what the finished build may look like.

 

 

Edited June 9 by MBerg
Ghost pics showing up in random spots

[MBerg]

She's just about finished. I won't post a proper log, but I'm experimenting a bit and don't want to make a terrible mess. After fitting the gunwales, they suggest using filler to close the gap. I've done my best to make some form of filler from sawdust, white glue and water which seems to be a popular option.

 

I have a question though. What's the best way to paint this? Should I be 'sealing' it with something or just let it dry, lightly sand and paint it? I also wonder if I should sand the painted wood beside it to help it blend better? Though not sanding that wood may be extremely tricky unless taped off well. Here's a pic of what I've got going on right now.