flying_dutchman2 Posted December 9, 2013 Share #1 Posted December 9, 2013 Hello, I am finishing up the Royal yacht Mary by Mamoli, and working on the masts and spars. They are from basswood, all warped and break easily when you sand them thin. I did some research in the books I have and a website from Gene Larson, on what type of wood to use for mast and spars. They suggest the following: Sitka spruce, beech, lemon wood, lance wood, maple, cherry and red cedar. No basswood, the research says it is soft and warps. I need the following dowel diameters and I have put them both in mm and inches. 8mm or 5/16"7mm or 17/64"6mm or 15/64"5mm or 3/16"4mm or 5/32"3mm or 1/8"2mm or 5/64" In my area I checked these stores for ready made dowels:Home Depot, Lowes, Michael's, hobby lobby and AC Moore and my local hobby stores - they all have basswood and do not have the odd sizes. I checked on line and these don't have the odd sizes too.http://www.nationalbalsa.com/http://dlumberyard.com/index.htmlhttp://www.hobbymillusa.com/http://www.modelexpo-online.com/default.asp (they used to have so much more)http://www.woodcraft.com/ www.historicships.comDoes have the odd sizes but all of the wood is pricey. Conclusion: I can go to 3 stores on-line and buy here and there and pay a lot for shipping OR have one (1) store that provides Everything. Any suggestion of other places I missed that are reliable in the USA. The NET has lots of places that sell dowels and Amazon is connected to many sites I have never heard off. I need dowels that are not basswood. Any suggestions is much appreciated.Marc Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted December 9, 2013 Share #2 Posted December 9, 2013 You will not find the dowels in the more interesting species. Usually you get birch or basswood in ready made dowels. For the any other species, you will need to get square stock and make your own dowels from that. Russ flying_dutchman2 1 Quote T'aint a hobby if you hurry Completed projects Cross section model by Russ 1/48 scale Biloxi schooner model restoration 1/24 scale Biloxi oyster skiff 1/24 scale Biloxi schooner 1/48 scale POB Current project Biloxi lugger Captain Roy 1/48 scale POB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marktiedens Posted December 9, 2013 Share #3 Posted December 9, 2013 There is a store in my area called The Woodsmith Store.they have a fair selection of birch & walnut dowels although I could not find them on their website.They also have a good selection of exotic woods. Mark flying_dutchman2 1 Quote current build - HMS Vanguard - Model Shipways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_dutchman2 Posted December 9, 2013 Author Share #4 Posted December 9, 2013 You will not find the dowels in the more interesting species. Usually you get birch or basswood in ready made dowels. For the any other species, you will need to get square stock and make your own dowels from that. Russ Russ, It is what I thought I had to do. I can use a 5mm dia. dowel and turn it into a 4mm spar and the same goes for an 8mm dowel into a 7mm mast. I have an article on how to make a round dowel from a square dowel. Will have to study this and use my files, chisels, sand paper to get the masts and spars. Thanks for the suggestion. Marc Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_dutchman2 Posted December 9, 2013 Author Share #5 Posted December 9, 2013 Marc, I'm afraid the sizes and wood species would be difficult to find. The only alternative is buy wood stock and create your own dowels. If you scroll around on MSW, you will find a video showing you how to make your own dowels from wood stock. Montani semper liberi. Happy modeling Crackers :mellow: Do you happen to know what the link is to that video? Marc Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_dutchman2 Posted December 10, 2013 Author Share #6 Posted December 10, 2013 avsjerome2003: thanks for the videos and the one that would work for me is the one with the vice and the saw blade and that would be for large diameter dowels. All the other vid's are people who have elaborate work shops which I don't have and don't really want to have. russ: I am doing the suggestion you made in a somewhat different way. I did go to woodcraft.com to buy dowels from beech and maple and some of different imported hardwoods. If I need a 7mm mast I purchase the 8mm and just sand it down. That also goes from the 5mm to the 4mm. I have some square dowels and I will practice what I have in several of my books. From square to octagon to round. Thanks for the suggestions. Marc avsjerome2003 1 Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted December 10, 2013 Share #7 Posted December 10, 2013 One thing to keep in mind is that when dealing with store bought dowels of any wood species, it is very difficult to know if the grain is running the length of the piece or not. In many cases, they grain is running across the piece in some way and that is one reason why dowels like that are prone to warping etc. By beginning with a piece of straight hardwood stock, it is easier to get the grain running all in one direction to ensure that the piece will not tend to warp. Of course having good stock to begin with helps. Russ WackoWolf and flying_dutchman2 2 Quote T'aint a hobby if you hurry Completed projects Cross section model by Russ 1/48 scale Biloxi schooner model restoration 1/24 scale Biloxi oyster skiff 1/24 scale Biloxi schooner 1/48 scale POB Current project Biloxi lugger Captain Roy 1/48 scale POB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_dutchman2 Posted December 10, 2013 Author Share #8 Posted December 10, 2013 One thing to keep in mind is that when dealing with store bought dowels of any wood species, it is very difficult to know if the grain is running the length of the piece or not. In many cases, they grain is running across the piece in some way and that is one reason why dowels like that are prone to warping etc. By beginning with a piece of straight hardwood stock, it is easier to get the grain running all in one direction to ensure that the piece will not tend to warp. Of course having good stock to begin with helps. Russ It would be wonderful if I had stock of different wood, but, I don't have the means to cut it in length. You see, I have the bare minimum on electrical tools. Dremel, drill, scroll saw and a basic planner and router. No table saw. I may be able to ask on of the members in my club to cut me some square stock as some of them have very elaborate shops with every electrical tool imaginable. I have always made my models with hand tools. Takes longer but I have total control. After the Royal Mary, the plan is to built the Statenjacht Utrecht from scratch. So may have to invest in a miniature table saw. MARC Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riverboat Posted December 10, 2013 Share #9 Posted December 10, 2013 Cornwall Model Boats have the sizes you'er looking for http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/birch-dowel.html Frank flying_dutchman2 1 Quote completed build: Delta River Co. Riverboat HMAT SUPPLY USRC "ALERT" in progress: Red Dragon (Chinese junk) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBlack Posted December 11, 2013 Share #10 Posted December 11, 2013 Flying Dutchman, I was just in a Rockler store this afternoon and saw that they have 1/8" dowels (and larger) in various hardwoods. Furniture makers use them in their joinery work. You've mentioned Woodcraft, now Rockler, there must be others that cater to home woodworkers. Tom flying_dutchman2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_dutchman2 Posted December 12, 2013 Author Share #11 Posted December 12, 2013 Thank you all for the suggestions, "riverboat" - wow I like the site and will use it for my next order. That they ship worldwide at a reasonable price is even better. Thank you. "TBlack" - I checked Rockler after I ordered from Woodcraft, thank you. "garym" - I went to that site and the dowels were more money than the others, but I do like what they have. Thank you all for the info which I will use after I run out these dowels. Marc WackoWolf 1 Quote Current Built: Zeehaen 1639, Dutch Fluit from Dutch explorer Abel J. Tasman Unofficial motto of the VOC: "God is good, but trade is better" Many people believe that Captain J. Cook discovered Australia in 1770. They tend to forget that Dutch mariner Willem Janszoon landed on Australia’s northern coast in 1606. Cook never even sighted the coast of Western Australia). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costas Posted December 13, 2013 Share #12 Posted December 13, 2013 hi Marc although you already made your order, another site to have in mind (it's in France) which is very well stocke in all sorts of woods such as samba, red cedar, oregon pine, mahogany etc (including dowels) in various shapes and diameters is www.multimatieres.fr Constantinos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chazz Posted December 14, 2013 Share #13 Posted December 14, 2013 I'm surprised that no one has mentioned a draw plate. Micromark sells one for $27.95. I got another version for less, but it was really a lot cheaper, not only less expensive. I have found that the draw plate is the easiest way to make very small round dowels, but don't just take their instructions for use at face value. I don't have any experience with larger sizes, but I made a whole lot of 1/32" or so for the railings on a model of a Chinese Pirate junk, perhaps 75 or 100 useable ones. The way I worked was first to take a 1/16" walnut, or sometimes basswood, strip and round off the edges, either by running it through a larger hole to cut off just the square corners or by sanding off the corners. Then with repeated passes using sandpaper and the draw plate worked the material down to the size I wanted. It did take a lot of passes, but the result was good. Things to watch out for are cross grain and splinters that will break the workpiece. The best thing about this method it that it produces very round dowels of regular size from end to end, though you might want to taper the yards later. Instructions in some old books suggest using pine...after all a lot the masts and yards in the old days probably were pine... and splitting off your work pieces to get straight grain. Chazz Don't expect just to use the catalog procedure of running the work through smaller and smaller holes. This might work on 1'8" or larger dowels (I haven't worked with this size), but sanding the work some between passes does a good job, and is buch easier with less breakage. Chazz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbot Posted December 14, 2013 Share #14 Posted December 14, 2013 The drawplate micromart sells is for wire. Jim Byrnes makes a drawplate that is designed for shaving down wood dowels. David B Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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