kirill4

5 hours ago, Ferrus Manus said:

I am about to start on the bonaventure lateen sail. I have about four opportunities there to use CA to make 

Michael, what option is supposed to be used in the equipment of the mizzen rigging?

 Can You sketch a small drawing by hand what should be the result?

Good day,

Dear Michael,

Michael(72Nova ) did very impressive works in rigging,good afternoon, Mikhail 72Nova demonstrates outstanding results in rigging work especially considering the microscopic scale in which he works... he shows in detail all the techniques that he uses in his work... it would be nice to learn them before starting your own work on rigging mizzen masts.  ..for my part, I would advise using additional temporary weights to weight the cables to simulate gravity in the rigging wiring ...

it is better to use unpainted threads for this purpose ... after the final formation of the required shape, all sags, etc.  they can be painted in the desired color ... I think it makes sense to carefully study the techniques of colleagues, those works that you like and use them in your practice .., in particular, Michael 72Nova describes in great detail all his techniques used when working on a model ... this  concerns not only the Vasa, but also his previous works ... look at his french galley by the way ...

sometimes it seems to me that you show some haste in an effort to finish the model faster and the quality of the work done sometimes suffers from this ... it is obvious that the skills and potential  allow you to achieve more impressive results, but this does not always happen for some reason ... we do not run a marathon, and each model can be considered as a testing ground for practicing certain skills and abilities ...

if something is not done now on this model, then  anyway, you will have to start again on the next one from the same points ... and time turned out to be lost ...

in particular, as I already mentioned, on this model, the non-scale dimensions and shape of most blocks, and the thickness and excessive hairiness of the threads used in rigging are striking ...  these issues were discussed in great detail earlier in parallel construction projects of colleagues ... it sometimes looks like attempts to step on a rake or try to invent a bicycle, when one could just take a few minutes to read the topics of colleagues in which they share their experiences ... and time  save money and the result of my own work will be more interesting...

at least I always try to understand and adopt the experience of my colleagues...

I ask you to consider all of the above as an exclusively personal point of view, and not some kind of attempt to put pressure or somehow speak negatively... at this  At the moment, the work on the model has been done very much, but nevertheless there is still room for creativity ... :)))

All and the Best!!!

 Kirill 

Again..very sorry for my english, but 72Nova could tell You exactly what to do!

But if real life" rigging  line "should be straight, in model , it have to be be straight..as well :))). 

I would like to  advise to" imitate " on real phisical process with CA clues and semi weights... :)))

Started #51

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
https://modelshipworld.com/topic/6262-spanish-galleon-1607-by-kirill4-lee-plastic-1100/?do=findComment&comment=409019

Sorry... need to find pictures... in short, I punced each legs with needl trough stay, and " weight" it bu some weight ..and to use liquud CA, to fix crowsfeet legs in straight

Crows feets under gravity, will come/ became each lines straight...each legs of craw feets became strait... we, modelmakers,  easily could imitate it , this gravity forces in our models, but You, Sir... didn't bother do it , but posted wrong vew of " nothing" these gravity forces... and now question...

why? Ah?

Why didn't spent 10 minutes to read our experienvies how to do it? , if don't want to read... than need to switch of your own inagination ,that under phisical process and " weight" of spars weihhts, correspondingn lines under weight should be straight... ... all these "phisical "prosess easy to imitate ... ? Pleased to hear and very apiliges my english8

:))) вот это зашибись конечно !!!...

такая работа требует уйму времени, но есть одно " но"... здесь бы надо показать имитацию "gravity" .... а пока, мне как кадется,  этого не удалось сделать...

Но продолжаю наблюдать за работой с большим интересом.,,

как я это делал, я подробно показал в соответстсвующих" топиках"  в мрей стройке... "приём"...

and BRGDS!

Kirill

Good day Michael,

What I  want to say - You did good job and really great progress in your rigging !!!

Probably there was sence to use different sizes of the blocks and different sizes of the rigging lines... there are a few good exel tables with automatic calculation of all rigging sizes in  free access in internet...and even here, in this forum I think...

Wish You all the Best!

Kirill

Good day Michael,

Thank You for the Batavia picture and SA link!:) found some new photo which I didn't have before...

As I know, Batavia didn't have too much sailing practice... couple or even one short sailing voyage if Im not mistaken, to be solid/active rigging refrence... but KN replica has a lot... and,  as we could see, all Van de Velde drawings shown them always outside shrouds...

Do You have photo of Batavia under sails...? It would be interesting to see them...long time ago  I saw only one photo of Batavia replica under sail...

On that picture, difficult to say how they are passing... clear seen leading block for spritsail pendant attached to the fore shrouds, but fore chanels obstructs vewing of details...do You have another photo? But I would say they passes outside ,same as on the Velde drawings...

And yes, more SA detailed photo? Never seen such close look of this beautiful model!

Thank You, thank You Ferrus Manus, all OK ... your galleon looks very good !

As seems to me, spritsail sheet pendants should pass outside foremast shrouds not inside...when spritsail in working position and we left them pass inside fore shrouds, than there will be more risk to tearing them off ? But here I m not 100 % sure... Duyfken replica shown then passes inside after first a few shrouds where it passes outside... old dutch pictures always shown them passes outside... I think it mostly depends on of practical implementation... most probably with such long hull as Vasa , they will pass outside of shrouds...?

Kalmar Nykel replica has them all passes outside...same as on the old dutch pictures... noted that on this picture , KN has cat block dismantled... only ring stopper rope?...

Good day Michael,

Looks nice!

Are You planning to show fish davit from sbs prepaired for anchor fishing? I saw that You shown anchor from this side is in ready position for fishing but fish davit still secured on deck/ not rolled out ?

It could be interesting... I think author of S. A. model shown ps anchor catting process in progress and not yet completed... which is always interesting to see such details on the model..it initiates mind thinking process ...whats going on here ?!:)))

SOTS 1637 https://cloud.mail.ru/public/za1C/j55UJkF7K

Good day Michael,

*Coming back to anchors securing methods, I saw / found that variant which You demonstrated on your model in one of the last version.

I think it could be realized as well, why not?... as You shown, catblock is not removed but just moved aside and fastened to the railings ...

for me personal, when I was busy with my model anchors gear, I prefer to follow strictly John Harlands book,regarding using ring stopper rope in its " spanish "as he said, variant of second catting stage, I shown this arrangements of anhcor stowing on one side( cat block removed) and anchor's heaving up action on another side where fish davit could be seen  angaged as well.

I don't believe that option ( Vasa 1:10) to bring it ( anchor)inboard of the beakhead is good idea... a few times moving anchor in and out of beakhead we finaly just destroy it heavily... I think that why on old pictures this way of anchor stowing was never shown.

*pozition of leading block of spritsail pendant...I noted that on the 1:10 model shown variant when this bulleye fastened not to the one of fore shroud as used to be, but straight  to the fore channels, pendant passes trough ring bolt on the channel... this arrangements I never saw on the old dutch drawings , but I saw it in the Mondfeld book about Vasa.- he shown two possible positions of blind sheet pendant lead block.. I would prefer to use traditional way and to secure this spritsail lead pendant block on the  fore shrouds above upper deadeye...

Good day Michael,

As I understood from John Harlands book, and what exactly we could see on the contemporary dutch pictures - in stowed position, cat- block in this case - removed, and ring stopper rope used instead of it. During stowing process , cat- block hooked to the strope on the shank, and used for heaving up anchor more up than it could be done in regular way, when catblock hooked to the anchor ring...

but this process described in details in that highlighted section...as soon as anchor is in desired position, than ring-stopper rope used ... that what we clearly could see on the Velde's drawings posted above...

" spanish" method , as I could understood from the book - it is one more option to secure anchor in stowed position, there is again cat block removed, ring stopper rope used again passes trought sheaves in cathead but anchor ring used as set of lower sheaves... this method didn't show on the Velde's drawings... 

Spritsail sheet bulleye looks like need to be in position above upper deadeye of the first fore shroud, not lower as You shown presently - means sprit sail pendant need to be positioned clear of anchor gear...outside and above of anchor and its gear...that what we could see on the Velde's drawings and other artists of this time  as well ....

There is a third variant, I saw it on Sophia Amalia model... I don't know is it correct or not , but it looks quite logical...there is cat block is not dismantled but just disangaged from the anchor ring, and ring stopper rope used in the same time...

Looking at the pictures we could noted ,when anchor secured in stowed position, than anckor tackle  should be disangaged and single thick rope arranged instead of.

Some thoughts ... as I understoo with this hanging bulleye (fixed above fm upper deadeye) spritsail pendant passes clear/and above of anchor gear, but not below as You arranged presently... ?

Good day,

All looks good, however have question ,how did You rig spripsail sheet ...it is not clear from the pictures... as I understood...at least looking at old dutch pictures...there should be long pendant which passes throug hanging bulleye attached to the first shroud area, than this pendant ended with single sheeve block, and than there should be simple whip tackle with this block started and ended somewhere in the waist...?

Good day Michael,

Anchor assembly looks very good!

All the best!

Good day Bruma,  Your job just brilliant! I follow your building reports with great pleasure!

Wish You all the best!

17 hours ago, Hubac's Historian said:

As you should be, Michael.  Just outstanding!

Fully Agree!

Great!!!

Great results!!!

All the Best!!!