NMBROOK

I have started to fit the upper hull starting from the stern forwards.By notching back the temporary stringers,I am able to use plain pear strip overwidth,rather than trying to develop individual shapes for each of the frame sections.There is a not very clear photo showing this.Each piece was fitted with an obechi infill individually.By using the digital vernier to check running dimensions as I went along,this avoided any accumulative build up of error.The obechi was thickness sanded(using a sanding block   )to suit each location.There is variation in frame spacing due to working with the constraints of bulkhead positions,but it is so small,it unnoticable to the eye.I have set the obechi 2mm above the base of the upper trim(bottom of the ebony planking).This is to allow fine adjustment of the ends and then capping with 3mm boxwood.Doing it this way means no tool marks will be visible on the frames from shaping the ends of the obechi.This complete section has been trimmed 3mm below the cap rail so I can fit a square pear 'binding' stringer to tie everything together.I got this idea from Dr Mike and makes alot of sense to tie all these laminations together.It also provides a sanding guide for upper frame thickness.This will be pinned later into the top of some of the frames for additional strength.The length of this upper edge is overlong at present and steps down to a lower level,which will be cut back when the next section is complete.My technique just leaves a section to sand back when the temporary stringers are removed.I am considering replacing these afterwards,but bolting to the hull with M2 bolts as this area will be planked over.I am also considering using threaded rods as well to keep the upper hull the right distance apart as work progresses.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Not a very exciting update today,however my experiment has been a success.I have been debating about caulking techniques and despite using a pencil for longer than I care to mention,it never looks as good as the black paper route.However after watching Dr Mike's dvd explaining that black paper prevents proper glue bond strength,himself using cheap white paper and dying it black,I wanted to find an alternative with a bit less faff Having to visit town today for other reasons  I did stumble upon black tissue paper.I thought this would still allow proper penetration of the glue,but would it be easy to work with?I adopted worse case scenario for the test and cut some planks roughly(not even changing to a fine blade )on the table saw.Smearing one edge of these with alaphatic and placing them on the tissue edge on.Having left to dry for a hour(would really leave overnight in practice) and then cutting the tissue with a new scalpel blade close on the underside and a little above the face side,separated the planks.These were then glued to a sheet of ply.Two hours later this was scraped and sanded back.Again I would leave overnight but I was being deliberately rough for the trial.Anyway complete success.No issue with the tissue paper wanting to drag out of the joints as it was fully impregnated with glue and razor sharp black(not greyish you get with the pencil) lines.The only imperfections are from the rough edges of the planks.In reality these would be smooth .I wanted to crack this dilemma as this technique will be used on the whole build which includes the scarph joints in the keel and the hull planking so strength is important.A couple of pics but the difference between this and pencil isn't truly conveyed with my iphone camera.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Work continues moving forward with the framing.When it came to sanding back the inside,unfortunately the 'binding' stringer that will be fitted at the top falls below the level of the temporary stringer on the outside.I measured the overall thickness including the outside temporary stringer on the thinned section on the stern using the verniers and used this dimension as my point of reference to sand down and profile the central section.Work now concentrates on completing the obechi infill.I have already started at the bow,this will need increasing in height at the sides as the hull edge flows down in an arc to meet the stem.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Thanks for the generous words and likes!
 
I will definately consider the idea to make a lightweight cover, thanks for the heads up.
 
Tony, looking forward to see your log. If you need a walkthrough of how to post images let me know.
 
 
/Matti

That looks just great Nigel. Clever work!
 
 
/Matti

I think Matti you may be better of making something temporary like a light softwood frame and even just covering that in clear plastic film stapled on.You will have to lift it on and off many times so something a light as possible but still offers protection from dust is adequate.I know it won't look glamorous   but it will keep the dreaded dust at bay while you are still working on the model.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Work continues moving forward with the framing.When it came to sanding back the inside,unfortunately the 'binding' stringer that will be fitted at the top falls below the level of the temporary stringer on the outside.I measured the overall thickness including the outside temporary stringer on the thinned section on the stern using the verniers and used this dimension as my point of reference to sand down and profile the central section.Work now concentrates on completing the obechi infill.I have already started at the bow,this will need increasing in height at the sides as the hull edge flows down in an arc to meet the stem.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Not a very exciting update today,however my experiment has been a success.I have been debating about caulking techniques and despite using a pencil for longer than I care to mention,it never looks as good as the black paper route.However after watching Dr Mike's dvd explaining that black paper prevents proper glue bond strength,himself using cheap white paper and dying it black,I wanted to find an alternative with a bit less faff Having to visit town today for other reasons  I did stumble upon black tissue paper.I thought this would still allow proper penetration of the glue,but would it be easy to work with?I adopted worse case scenario for the test and cut some planks roughly(not even changing to a fine blade )on the table saw.Smearing one edge of these with alaphatic and placing them on the tissue edge on.Having left to dry for a hour(would really leave overnight in practice) and then cutting the tissue with a new scalpel blade close on the underside and a little above the face side,separated the planks.These were then glued to a sheet of ply.Two hours later this was scraped and sanded back.Again I would leave overnight but I was being deliberately rough for the trial.Anyway complete success.No issue with the tissue paper wanting to drag out of the joints as it was fully impregnated with glue and razor sharp black(not greyish you get with the pencil) lines.The only imperfections are from the rough edges of the planks.In reality these would be smooth .I wanted to crack this dilemma as this technique will be used on the whole build which includes the scarph joints in the keel and the hull planking so strength is important.A couple of pics but the difference between this and pencil isn't truly conveyed with my iphone camera.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Thanks Nigel and Ulises for the comments and Aussie048 for the like.
 
I knew it was a good idea not to post any close-ups
 
Seriously it's nice to get feedback. Thanks Nigel for the heads up on garboard plank. I have found that turning the ship the right way up to check planking does help. What looks straight upside down isn't necessarily!!
 
Nick

Haven't you guys got your scale conversation in the wrong topic?

Fun discussion Nigel - but maybe I'm off here in understanding conversions - 1/32 is 1.5 times larger than @1/48 and 1/24 is 2 times larger than @ 1/48.  1/36 is 1.33 which just seems odd....

I've seen this gorgeous model Nigel - thanks for sharing !  As you've mentioned - its up to the builder to determine his/her own style.  On my Confederacy build I completely borrowed/stole Frolich's approach.  When I get to my next build - Im hoping to create my own style.  I do know this - I'm going to scale up - either 1/36 or 1/32 (which again seriously wondering why I haven't seen a ship depicted in 1/32 scale)

You are correct Chris,I agree perfect model.He obtained plank definition by blunting the corners of the planking,at 1/36 this is more easily done than at smaller scales.Interestingly someone asks the question in the text.I am not arguing the point,each to their own,my favorite model also doesn't show caulking,interestingly by the builder who was discussing the issues with using paper:
 
http://www.shipmodels.com.ua/eng/models/elite/le_ambiteux/index.htm
 
There are many other details that could or could not be depicted on a model,again all down to the builder's discretion.

I'll keep my eyes peeled for the P word !! Rollicking's on Stand By ..
 
E

Thank you very much Eamonn Yes markers do work well as long as there isn't any bleeding issues.I was wanting something I knew would take any finish I wanted later down the line.On this build I will use tung oil on the carvings and tung oil or shellac on the rest of the build.I won't be using poly as there will be no and I do mean no paint on this build You read it here so rollickings welcome if you hear the 'P' word  
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Nice work Nigel, sorry for not getting back to you after your PM (house full of people AGAIN !!  ) that paper looks the Cats Pyjamas, I use a permanent marker that has a very fine almost paintbrush like 'nib' which sands back to a crisp line but you have to be careful.. your tissue paper solution has me intrigued !
 
All The Best Mate
 
Eamonn

Thank you very much indeed Richard:   I agree bonded to a subdeck,the strength issue is off limited importance.I think the bond has alot to do with paper density,the shop I got the tissue from shows black paper of 84g/sqm on their website, which is the lowest I found on the net.My local branch doesn't carry it which was when I found the tissue.I found a mere smear of alaphatic and whipping it off so only leaving a trace was ideal,too much and it soaks right through.The trial planks were glued to the tissue on a glass sheet just in case.I wouldn't like to try and split a bundle of planks,I think you may get a little tearout on the paper.I think it is preferable to leave a little stuck up and clean it off when scraping the deck.I scraped and sanded with P60! on this trial piece just to be sure it was well and truly secure.Even the deck planking will be spilled on this model as curved deck planks are correct for the period,so tissue will have to be applied to each plank separately .
The Falmouth is a very nice vessel,it was only for my love of late 17th century vessels and my fondness of the works of Van de Velde that I chose Mordaunt.I think the beauty with all the Euromodel kits is that the only limitation as to how far you go with them,is your imagination.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Not a very exciting update today,however my experiment has been a success.I have been debating about caulking techniques and despite using a pencil for longer than I care to mention,it never looks as good as the black paper route.However after watching Dr Mike's dvd explaining that black paper prevents proper glue bond strength,himself using cheap white paper and dying it black,I wanted to find an alternative with a bit less faff Having to visit town today for other reasons  I did stumble upon black tissue paper.I thought this would still allow proper penetration of the glue,but would it be easy to work with?I adopted worse case scenario for the test and cut some planks roughly(not even changing to a fine blade )on the table saw.Smearing one edge of these with alaphatic and placing them on the tissue edge on.Having left to dry for a hour(would really leave overnight in practice) and then cutting the tissue with a new scalpel blade close on the underside and a little above the face side,separated the planks.These were then glued to a sheet of ply.Two hours later this was scraped and sanded back.Again I would leave overnight but I was being deliberately rough for the trial.Anyway complete success.No issue with the tissue paper wanting to drag out of the joints as it was fully impregnated with glue and razor sharp black(not greyish you get with the pencil) lines.The only imperfections are from the rough edges of the planks.In reality these would be smooth .I wanted to crack this dilemma as this technique will be used on the whole build which includes the scarph joints in the keel and the hull planking so strength is important.A couple of pics but the difference between this and pencil isn't truly conveyed with my iphone camera.
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

I wanted to avoid painting my Britannia metal fittings.  Black paint on the guns just didn't look realistic.  If I used Blacken-It, a dark crust would form, which rubbed off with a paper towel, leaving a barely darkened piece of metal.  What to do?
 
I started by soaking the parts in a 50:50 solution of muriatic acid and water for 10 minutes.  This cleaned and I think etched the surface a bit.  Then into Blacken-it, full strength,  for 10 minutes after rinsing.  I polished the pieces with paper towel and Q tips, and while darker, they weren't where I wanted them.  The last step was to soak the parts for 10 minutes in "Brass Black" Metal Finish by Birchwood Casey.  After cleanup with paper towels and Q tips, almost no finish came off and the parts were a dark gunmetal color.  Perfect!  In certain lighting they almost have a faint bronze cast to them  Here is a photo
 
Dave

I think your point is a very valid one Chris,I think much is down to the modelers personal preference.I did consider no caulking on Mordaunt,the main reason I went ahead was my choice of timber.Boxwood is very monotone and if I applied no caulking the result would almost look like a solid block of wood.Regarding the museum models,the many photos I have relevant to English vessels of my prefered period,the correct hull planking is not even adhered to.Strakes of pear are used several planks wide and the treenailing is a true mechanical fixing that holds these strakes on.On some models the hull plank lines have been drawn on with pencil!
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Thank you very much indeed Nils for your very kind words  ,I am pushing myself and pulling out all the stops on this one in the hope to create something a little bit special
 
Kind Regards
 
Nigel

Ulises,
  The prefab decking that I referred to is a process, I believe first incorporated as a manufacturing process, by a company called Teak Deckers, out of Sarasota, Fl. They go to a boat and make doorskin (1/8th luan ply wood) templates of the decks and ways and bring them back to the factory to make deck "panels". They leave the outside planks uncaulked, and the king and scallop planks out. When they bring the completed panels to the boat, they finish fit them, fit the king plank, and caulk the few panel seams and edges remaining. Two people can do in a day, what would normally take a week or more. The advantage, besides time, is less work or opertunities to damage something on the boat (the two are synonymous on boats), and an easy clean up without much dust. You can also make very fine listellos, and inlays in a more controled, ergonomic enviornment.
 I've done them this way and the conventional way. The conventional way is fun, but prefab is cleaner, allows more artistic flexibility and, of course, is much easier on the back and knees. You also need less tools and room.
 As far as what I did, Nigel seems to have put more thought into it, than I, to a fine result.
 Below, is just a quick set up for some hatch planks, with perhaps too much glue in my hatse to answer your question, just to show you my crude method.
Once dry, I trim the paper up and draw a thin, sharp blade down through the laminated width edge and back along the plank to the end. It's really very little trouble and I'm surprisd that this is actually news to anyone.
 The paper will take a dark color with most finish or stain that you put on it, in the end.
 
Regards,
Steve

How about no caulking ?  Most classic museum models do not depict it - this is more or less a recent addition in ship modeling.
Chris

Nigel,
I appreciate your detailing the caulking. I used the same process but with a thin paper. (I have been experimenting with different papers to see how they looked.) Since I am gluing the planks and their paper caulking to a base, a piece of 1/64 birch ply, I figured that would be enough to overcome any bonding issues between the planks.
 
Originally I thought tissue paper would be too thin but after seeing your photos I will have to try it.
 
Also, I read the suggestion to clamp the planks together, then glue to the caulking paper. I was not sure how difficult it would then be to slit the paper without damaging the planks. I will have to try that also but with the tissue paper.
 
Nice work, I will be following since one of my kits on the shelf is the Falmouth, also by EuroModel.
 
Richard
 
Richard

Looks great Nigel,
 
thae way you do the hull, the inovative caulking method and the whole build to date.... just amazing and a delight to follow. It is a real Special in scale 1/60, I trust this will at the end be a master Piece of model shipbuilding
 
Nils