themadchemist

Got the two top planks on today. In order to bend the planks, I tried two methods. One was soaking and using a large hose clamp and the second was to use a hair straightener. Got the straightener at a dollar store for about $15. This was by far the best way. Had to wait overnight for the clamp piece to dry, the straightener dried it as it went, and was pretty easy and quick.

Oops, hit post instead of more options.
 
Heres the clamp method. The bend was great, just takes too long.
 

 

 
Heres the straightener
 

 

 
Just turn it on, set to medium, press together and pull toward the bend and done.
 
Top plank glued on. Spiled the planks at the bow.  Used ca to attach to frame, pva for the fillers.
 

 
Ran the line down about 3mm below top of frames.  Just got back from checking on it, and found the larboard plank at the bow was too high, so just fixed that. Now both side are even.  Will tackle the garboard tomorrow.
This may turn out to be more fun than I thought.

...so I took both a shop vac and an air compressor to it, and I think it's fine. Next quandary: since my stern and stern-post pieces are too thin compared to the planked-out hull, I'm in the process of fabbing a new, monolithic piece out of African walnut that I picked up at an AZ wood store. An antique treadle lathe (and more importantly, scroll saw attachment) came with our house, so I used that to cut out the rough shape of the piece, using the kit pieces as a template (kind of cool, I thought). I'm now using a grizzly oscillating sander (great tool) to shape the bow curve of the keel to fit the bow shape of the hull. My conundrum, then, is how to blend the 'point' of the planked out bow hull, to the 'flat' of the inner curve of the blow keel. The mismatch should be evident in a picture I'll attach below. Do I try to notch the bow portion of the keel so that it 'fits' over the peaked bow planks? Do I flatten the bow portion of the hull, where currently the planks from each of the two halves (port and starboard) come together at an acute angle? Also, I'm wondering whether I'm going to run into other issues by using a wider-than-provided keel piece...but I guess I'll find out.

Heres a picture of the main deck stained. There must be quite a difference in the density of the wood, as the stain really soaked into some areas more than others. But that will give it some character.
 

 
The planks for the hull were too long for anything I had in the garage to soak in, so made a soaker out of PVC plastic pipe. Then made a cap for the end to push the plank all the way into the water. When the cap is taken off the end of the plank floats out of the pipe.
 

 

 
Have spent the last couple of days fairing the frames. Also had to shim frame 7 on both sides then sand to size. Also, had to shim the top of frame 4 to even out the main deck. Which meant, using alcohol to loosen the deck then sliding in the shim and re glueing.
 

What I like most about this site is the encouragement you get from fellow modellers.  It really carries one though the day when you have been crawling on the floor for 5 hours to find that part that dropped or you have to remake a part for the umpteenth time because you measured it wrong - AGAIN.
 
Vivian, you have probably seen Caroline's (Vulcanbomber) SF build log.  I think her cannons are true to the period.  They are beautiful indeed. 
 
Augie, thanks for all the nice comments and encouragement. Much appreciated. 
 
Keith, there is no need to scrape the masking tape off since you don't glue the masking tape to your wood.  You stick the masking tape on the wood and glue the masked sides together with PVA.  Just make sure you wipe off any excess glue so that you don't accidentally glue your pieces of wood together  (...yep, I've done that before...)
 
Below are photos of the steps of my boarding ladders.  I wanted to round the edges and to get carbon copies of one another, I lined the side of each step with masking tape, glued all 12 steps together, shaped the sides, separated the steps with a blade and simply pulled the tape right off.  (and then probably spent 5 hours looking for one piece on the floor...  )
 
Taped steps

Steps all glued together and shaped

 
Randy, good to hear from you again.  Thanks for taking the time to show us your completed SF.  It is a magnificent build - something you can be truly proud of.
 
Thanks Lawrence.  It's true what you say.  It's hard enough finding the time to do some actually building, let alone reading all the wonderful build logs on this site and keeping your own one semi up to date.  I cheat by following your logs on my phone whenever I have a spare moment, but it limits the commenting that I can do and that irks me.
 
 
 
 

Thanks for the masking tape idea. When making gratings by hand I glued the stock together and found soaking the pieces wasn't quite effort to get the pieces separated without break nearly half of them. Of course there is the issue with removing the glued tape, but it would make separation easier and I image the tape scrapes off easily.
 
Nice work on the bits and pieces, its all those little things that eat up the time, at least for me. They add so much to the finished detail though, plus its just plain fun.

YIKES, When it rains it pours.
Looks like someone didn't have insurance and ran, the world these days, sheesh.
Best wishes to your daughter and a speedy recovery and may the demons of lyme leave you be for a spell.

Been very sick & haven't gotten much done in the shipyard lately. One of my Lyme friends on FB sent me a gift to cheer me up. Knowing my love of stamp collecting & of old ships & nautical history she sent me these first day covers of Capt. James Cook & a block of 4 of the Hatteras National Seashore.
 
I have made jigs for the deadeyes in preparation of starting the shrouds.
 
 

Hey Dr Per,
Thanks, although metallurgy is the weakest part of my chemistry. Metal analysis is a different story as that was what I did mostly in TA'ing quantitative analysis as a grad student, which is all old school wet chem. Lots of titrations and Oxidation/Reduction reactions.
Of course modern technology such a AAS and ICP/MS make old school methods obsolete. (BTW - AAS is atomic absorption spectroscopy and ICP is inductively coupled plasm mass spec)
 
My first gut instinct would be to say the pintles and gudgeons were of differing metal as yes brass is a mix of many possible metals, with each giving some wanted attribute. IIRC lead is used sometimes for softening brass (malleability and ductility), tin is also common (IIRC copper and tin make bronze). In my quant class I had about 100 differing steel sample and the students had to determine the % of Mn and Cr in their given sample.
Sam stated though that the metal was all K&S stock so that gut instinct probably isn't correct.
 
When I see uneven reaction such as this I usually think contamination. Its so easy to contaminate something, but the oil seemed to play a part also in the post blackening stage, which is strange (maybe coincidence).
Brass etching is a good example of oxidation/reduction (redox reactions) being used to remove metal rather then form a protective coating. Redox reactions using metals typically remove metal as it's an electronegativity cannibalisation so to speak.
 
for example the Ferric Chloride (FeCl3) used in etching is a Fe+3 cation salt, which gains the copper metal electrons and the copper metal atom forms a copper ion which in turn then forms some salt with whatever anion (chloride Cl- , perhaps), so
          Cu + Fe+3 --> Cu+2 + Fe
Basically the cationic metal of the salt becomes metal and metal become a cationic ion - i.e. copper + iron chloride --> copper chloride + iron (although iron may not completely reduce to Fe but rather Fe+2 , this can occur in multi-valence metals)
 
The Redox reactions that occur with anionic components typically form salt coatings rather then metal replacement. For example stainless steel is created when the Cr percent in the steel reaches a certain pecent. This allows a high enough Cr content in the surface of the steel to allow a fast forming Cr2O3 which prevent the iron from forming rust or iron oxide. Copper Oxide is the first stage of oxidation of copper with air (think brown penny) then a later slower reaction happens when copper carbonate forms (think statue of Liberty) from the CO2 in the air. The carbonate is actually protective and stops further oxidation, just as in stainless steel.
 
Sams Sweat indicates a reaction is still going on, I just don't have a clue why. One crazy idea, was the piece rinsed in tap water after the acid bath? Was the Tap water well water or city water? I know Fe in water can play tricks in reactions, This is why Bourbon is made using iron free water, typically that has ran through limestone (think Jack Daniels ) That probably got the attention from those dozing off.
Seriosly though, Ive seen Tap water ruin many experiment and in my research I used distilled water that was then quadruple filtered with 4 different reverse osmosis stages. Distilling can leave behind organics. But water doesn't answer why one piece and not the other? but Sam stated that the blackening was removed from both (if I'm reading correctly) which could be a friction of wiping rather then the oil. Salt on the surface under the blackening could have also reacted with the oil (salt and oil don't mix typically). Just so much doesn't make sense.
 
I'd be interested in knowing what type of oil was used (although it shouldn't matter). Mainly was it natural vs synthetic (think tung oil vs Wipe on poly), Also how long was the cure time between blackening and oil and also how long after the oil application before the blackening came off and the sweat appeared? was the blackening stable with no rubbing off or flaking before oiling?
 
I just love troublesooting

Hey Sam
Boy oh boy, I always get the fun questions.
In a nut shell, I haven't got a clue, so I'll give the standard chemistry teacher answer, "Looks like metal contamination to me"
 
Seriously though, as an analytical chemist based in organic (pharma) seperations, my metallurgical skills aren't so great. Its something not covered to much in class and what little I know of metal chemistry is self taught and from my stint in quantitative analysis class.
 
So, what is it.
First I assume all metal is sourced from the same piece so we can assume the metal ratios are the same (Brass being a mix of copper and zinc basically, but depending on the brass other metal can be added for differing properties).
My first gut instint is to say it was a processing problem, but I don't understand how it effected one piece and not the other (this indicates contamination is most likely the problem, not the metal). Did the same reaction happen on the other side of the ship the same?
The strange reaction started when the oil was added and you state it caused the blackening to come off. In the picture it appears that neither the pintle or gudgeon are blackened anymore. Is this correct? How long was the blackened surface allowed to cure before oiling, although this shouldn't matter.
 
Blackening is a reaction that occurs with -2 anions typically (O2- and S-2, are most common). Natural aging occurs when the metal is exposed to the oxygen in the air naturally but most blackening reactions are a Sulfide reaction using what old school chem called Liver of sulphur. From my study of Liver of sulphur it isn't an exact science and can contain many differing salts to achieve the oxidation reaction. I call it oxidation because the process of oxidation to a chemist means it loses an electron (any anionic ion can oxidize, stuff on the right of the periodic table). Oxygen typically does this and is the most common oxidizer, but if you look at Sulfur (S) its right under O on the periodic table and so will have similar properties (as does Selenium...). So the blacken stuff is an oxidation of the copper in the brass and is supposed to be a stable coating, although this isn't the case here.
 
The sweat appears to be a reactant so it is still reacting with something. Does the sweat have a bluish or greenish colour (oxides and sulfides are typically black, where sulfates and chlorides typically have blue/green colourations)? What type of oil did you use BTW?
 
My gut instint still says contamination but it doesn't quite look right. It looks to me as though the black was removed from the pintle but remained on the gudgeon, then later peeled, which is giving it the mottled look with the sweat only appearing on the more brass looking spots.
 
Most brass is coated to prevent oxidation but annealing would burn off such a coating. Thats where many problems like this occur, where a coating is breached and then the oxidation occurs under the edge of a coating (think paint blisters on a car that rusts after a scratch in the paint). But this shouldn't have been an issue. Common sense is telling me the metal was contaminated between the cleaning and blackening process which caused the oxidation to not adhere. Were they ever touched between these steps and with what?
Although the oil seemed to be the catalysing agent.
 
The real problem here is the inconsistent reaction between the pintle and gudgeon. I hate to say this but "Not knowing I couldn't say with any degree of accuracy" which is chemical speak for "I don't have a clue". There are just so many variables. How long was there between blackening and oil?
 
Sorry I seem to have asked more questions then answered. My gut says contamination though. Most likely under the blackening, which the oil caused to become more reactive or become a faster reaction. I see nothing wrong with your procedure, is there any place in the steps where contamination could have happened, especailly between cleaning and blackening?

I never said "go for it"... I said push the envelope....watch it bend....
 
I've found when the admiral becomes that envelope, it bends much less easily....
and sometimes if you push that envelope to hard, you may be the one to bend... Oh, the things we do for Love

My problem in post #41, was how am I going to get the planks to land all straight, neat and tidy on the keel as shown on the drawing (the purple section.)  

 
This is how the stern looked after I finished planking last week. Not very promising. 

 
So, I took a deep breath and cut off a section of the planked keel and added a walnut stern stem. 

 
 
And the planks line up straight, neat and tidy!!

 
 
The transom was planked before adding the stern stem

 
Working on the framing around the fish wells, have a few more parts to figure out, but it's looking good. 
 
Thanks for stopping by!
 
Dee Dee

 

 

Thanks to everyone who dropped in since my last post and the encouragement through your 'likes'!
 
 
I am jumping around a bit while I try to build most of my deck fittings and I am almost working on all the fittings at once.  It will probably go faster if I focus on one thing at a time.
 
 
I finished the pumps.  There are one or two things I will do differently in the future, but I feel the end result is still better than the kit's metal pumps.

 
 

 
The tiller included in the kit is also made of metal.  I finished my scratch built version from some Chen Chen Rose wood.  It turns really nicely.

 


 
I am working on the top rail for the stern gallery.  The kit's version is plywood that you have to cover with veneer.  It actually worked pretty well, but I messed it up by staining it too dark.  So I decided to make a new rail.  It is always tricky to make more than one piece of something where all the pieces must be exact copies of one another.  I usually do it by sticking masking tape on the one side of the wood from which the item must be cut.  I then glue the taped sides together and let it dry completely.  I then cut and shape the piece and when I am done I simply separate the individual pieces by cutting through the masking tape.  That way you end up with pieces that are all perfectly similar.

 
 


 
Top rail in progress:

 
 

 
I have spent hours on the gun carriages.  I threw away more prototypes than I can remember.  I ended up using Chuck's plans that are available on this website.  I know it's not representative of carriages in the 16th century, but neither are a lot of things in the SF kit.  At least they look good!
 
Making the sides - I attach the rings first while it is still easy to hold and work with the side piece:

 

 
I created a jig to glue the carriage sides to the axles - to ensure that all the carriages will ultimately be symmetrical:

 
Adding the transom to the front axle

 
Next, the wheels and the wire on which the carriage bed will rest

 
Finally I added the carriage bed and the cannon.  One down, 9 to go!
 



 

Thanks again for all the words of encouragement and support, and for all of the "likes".
 
A brief update today.
 
25' Cutters Ver 2.5 continued
 
This weekend I completed fitting all of the previously bent frames.  This was a relatively straight forward job, although more time consuming than I had anticipated.  I was pleased with the way the frames fitted into the hull shells, with only a modicum of persuasion required. The frames are all 1/32" sq Pear stock, with the exception of the last three frames in each boat. These are made of a double laminate of 1/32" x 1/64" Holly stock.
 
I decided to fit a couple of extra hogging pieces so that these now run the complete length of the keel from apron to stern deadwood.  This should make fitting the keelson/footwaling a little easier later on.  I also trimmed the stems to shape and sanded back the transoms.  In hindsight, I should have left the transoms a little higher and trimmed after fitting the cap rail. Oh well..........
 
A couple of pics of progress.  You will notice some discoloured powdery substance in some of the shots.  This is where I applied a small amount of filler where some of the glue joints were a bit bare.  Once this is cleaned up, the hulls will be painted, so it won't be visible.
 

 

 

 
I also fitted the gunwales:
 

 
I will fit the risers for the thwarts next, and then paint the hulls before continuing with fitting out.

I made the layout of the deck and put the butt joints in. Still uncertain as to what I'll do. I like the different shades of basswood on the deck. Am leaning towards, just leaving it as is. Will wait until tomorrow and decide for sure, after these thunderstorms get out of here.
 

 

I never said "go for it"... I said push the envelope....watch it bend....
 
I've found when the admiral becomes that envelope, it bends much less easily....
and sometimes if you push that envelope to hard, you may be the one to bend... Oh, the things we do for Love

Thanks guys.
 
I planked the main deck last night and have been having a brain freeze ever since.  I ran the planks the full length, and liked the way it looks.
Then I started to over think it. In the early 1800's they would have had to nail the planks, so thought maybe I should go ahead and put in butt joints. I've looked at several build logs and the way they were done. One had ( I think way to many joints) another none. So, haven't decided what to do yet. If they nailed the planks they sure didn't have a false deck so would have had to nail them where the bulkheads were under the planks. If i used just the bulkheads that run across under the deck, there would only be three butt joints running all the way across. The picture on the box shows the planks running full length with no joints, but figure that was just to show a finished model.
 
If I stained it with the stain I used on the lower decks it wouldn't make any difference as dark as it is.
 
I'm going to go out in the garage and make a template of the deck using the cut out and see what I can come up with. Will post some pictures later.

Keith, you’re not helping.  You say, “Go for it.” The admiral says, “Finish it.”  Sorry but you know who wins that one.  But there will be other boats and I keep learning.
 
Bob

You would have to go and mention another book I'll need.  
 
and to your question of "do I really need to do that on this boat?"  I would ask this, do you "need" to even build this boat at all?
which the answer, if your like me, is definitely YES...... oh those decisions... they are what keeps holding me back.
I say, push the envelope - watch it bend
 
now I must resist the urge to purchase another literary resource   
 
...which is leading to a shelving shortage problem   
 
...oh the trials We endure

You would have to go and mention another book I'll need.  
 
and to your question of "do I really need to do that on this boat?"  I would ask this, do you "need" to even build this boat at all?
which the answer, if your like me, is definitely YES...... oh those decisions... they are what keeps holding me back.
I say, push the envelope - watch it bend
 
now I must resist the urge to purchase another literary resource   
 
...which is leading to a shelving shortage problem   
 
...oh the trials We endure

Michael, Pete, Lawrence and Likes,
 
Sorry I haven’t been posting but I now think the research is far enough along that I can start rigging.  I threw together a rope walk and a serving machine.  Their noit pretty but they will do the job.  I was also given a new book, ”A Scratchbuilder’s  Evolutionary Development”.  Wow, what a book.  He goes into how to do things that he has learned, and I say to myself, ‘Do I really need to do that on this boat?”  Decisions, decisions, decisions.  Ah well hope to have pictures soon.
 
Bob

Got the deck glued yesterday.
 

 
Thought I was going to have to shim some of the starboard bulkheads , as the deck overlapped the frames by about 1/16 of an inch. So I ran a center line and lines across the frames and started measuring with my calipers. come to find out the deck was wider on that side. I'm sure the center line was correct, so just sanded the edges down to the frames.
 

 

Keith I want to thank you and Russ for your replies.
 
Usually when I start a project, I don't want to stop until its finished, but have found that this hobby has brought out the patience I wasn't sure I had. I enjoy not having to rush, or to glue something and have to wait until the next day. The more I do, the more I am enjoying it. Other than diving, this is probably the most calming thing I've ever done.
 
I'm sure I'll be needing some advice in the near future on the planking. Maybe I'll get lucky.

John:
I echo what Keith said regarding planking. I have my own system I used on my current project and it came out quite well, just like the original was probably planked. It takes some time and few failures, but once you have done it correctly, you will never want to do it any other way.
 
Russ

Build log part 54
 
 
Still doing the masting........
 
The Moderators must have changed the pic loadoing System, I ca`nt get my comments to the pics, will have to inform myself how to do... accordingly soon.
 
The lower fore- and mainmast are made frome spruce, the topmasts from  beech
The lower mizzen is beechwood und the upper mizzen is from bamboo.That was necessary to get the required strength into the fragile beams. The upmost mizzen-pole is spruce and can be slipped in and out of the socket of the underneath mast Portion.
 
The upper cheek areas under the top platforms  shall be blackend as well, including the upmost woolding. The platforms have gotten safety netting.
 
The shroud resting batten-Cages are Special and complete soft soldered from the recently made squarebands and 8 pieces of 0,8 mm brass wire. I think those shall be left in brass and not blackend
 
 
Build log part 55 to follow...
 
 
Nils