Ratlines and clove hitches.

[DaveBaxt]

I am just wondering is this is really the way ratlines and how they are attached. I came across a modeller who sugests using a needle. So my question is this. Is using a clove hitch on the ratline done for convenience due to being an awful lot of them ? Thank you Best regards Dave

[Dragdonius]

The clove hitch is what is used to tie ratlines to the shrouds on the real ships. Using it on the model is replicating the original as close as possible. Using a needle is kind of cheating :). saying that, sometimes the knot looks too large or too close to each other so the overall effect is not eye-pleasing. Depending on the scale. And the end it is up to the modeler how far one wants to go in replicating the original. 

[allanyed]

2 hours ago, Dragdonius said:

the knot looks too large

Dave,

If the ratline and shroud circumferences are to-scale, they will probably look fine.  There is a tendency to use oversize material for the ratlines which will then yield fat knots. From Lees' Masting and Rigging page 186,  ratlines were a specific circumference 1 1/2" .  This is just under 1/2 inch diameter and is regardless of the ship and era.,  If your scale is 1:60 the ratlines should be 0.008" (0.2mm) in diameter.  It is easy enough to wrap your ratline material around a rod to see how many wraps there are in a cm or inch.  If it is to 1:60 scale there should be about 125 wraps in an inch or about 50 wraps in a centimeter.   Fewer than that, the line is too fat and the knots will look oversized.  

 

The shroud sizes varied with the size of mast so smaller shrouds and the one and only size ratlines will have a different look than larger shrouds with the same specified size ratlines.   In the case of your current build, what is the diameter of your main mast shrouds?  Using Lees' formulas for that size ship and era and a scale of 1:60 I came up with about 0.94mm diameter for the main mast shrouds.  (Don't trust my math without double checking on your own 😀)

Allan

 

[DaveBaxt]

2 hours ago, allanyed said:

Dave,

If the ratline and shroud circumferences are to-scale, they will probably look fine.  There is a tendency to use oversize material for the ratlines which will then yield fat knots. From Lees' Masting and Rigging page 186,  ratlines were a specific circumference 1 1/2" .  This is just under 1/2 inch diameter and is regardless of the ship and era.,  If your scale is 1:60 the ratlines should be 0.008" (0.2mm) in diameter.  It is easy enough to wrap your ratline material around a rod to see how many wraps there are in a cm or inch.  If it is to 1:60 scale there should be about 125 wraps in an inch or about 50 wraps in a centimeter.   Fewer than that, the line is too fat and the knots will look oversized.  

 

The shroud sizes varied with the size of mast so smaller shrouds and the one and only size ratlines will have a different look than larger shrouds with the same specified size ratlines.   In the case of your current build, what is the diameter of your main mast shrouds?  Using Lees' formulas for that size ship and era and a scale of 1:60 I came up with about 0.94mm diameter for the main mast shrouds.  (Don't trust my math without double checking on your own 😀)

Allan

 

Cheers Allan I have based my sizes of shrouds on the main mast to be 1mm and on the others I have 0.75 mm. This is the closest I have to what I worked out from Lees book. I was working on the same for the rat lines 0.1 mm . It is either that or 0.25mm which I think the knots will too big. Perhaps on my next model, I will go down the  route of making my own rope to get nearer to scale. I have bought some rope in for the Stays .Perhaps I should have bought some for the shrouds too. However buying it although a very good rope  it is quite expensive as I am quite wastful. Haha. I would like to thank everyone for partaking in this thread. Best regards Dave

[allanyed]

37 minutes ago, DaveBaxt said:

I was working on the same for the rat lines 0.1 mm . It is either that or 0.25mm which I think the knots will too big.

Your shroud sizes are spot on.  Regarding the ratlines the 0.25mm is closer to scale but as you say, the clove hitches may look too big.  Try a couple and see which looks best to your eye.  When it comes to rigging, the consensus seems to be that too small is better than too large, but half the size may be pushing it.  I look forward to seeing the results.

 

Allan

[DaveBaxt]

3 hours ago, allanyed said:

Your shroud sizes are spot on.  Regarding the ratlines the 0.25mm is closer to scale but as you say, the clove hitches may look too big.  Try a couple and see which looks best to your eye.  When it comes to rigging, the consensus seems to be that too small is better than too large, but half the size may be pushing it.  I look forward to seeing the results.

 

Allan

Cheers for that Allan. Good point regards the size of knots might look too big but will see what it looks like on the model. Thank you again for your help.best regards Dave