Keith Simmons

Mark, it's my understanding that few western riverboats used variable-angle buckets on the wheel. Conditions were just too rough for them to work properly.
 
Also, did these wheels turn fast enough to really splash water that high? These were geared for power, not rapid rotation, and I wouldn't think they'd spray water except near the surface. By the time the wheel had rotated toward the upper portion of the paddle box, the water was almost certainly mostly drained off the bucket. I could see allowing for extra space at deck level where the wheel first hits and emerges from water, but I'm trying to envision the need tens of feet up at the top of the arc, where this discussion is focused.

Cathead,
 
What you say makes sense...  The paddlewheelers I used to see in St.Louis did turn pretty quick, especially heading upriver but those were all sternwheelers.  
 
 
Videos of the Delta Queen and the old Mississippi Queen show some spray coming off the wheels and seems to be dependant on speed.
 
We need a time machine and a designer from those years.....  

Pete,
 
The core question here started with the rounded arch atop the paddlebox. I fully agree that a wider-than-minimum box makes sense at the level of the main deck, for everything from repair to debris to splash, but none of that explains the very wide arch at the next level up. Likely no one's crawling into that upper arch to do anything, why would they when you can just rotate the wheel 1/4 turn and work on it at the main deck level? But instead they still built the arch at the boiler deck level much larger than the wheel, which took more timber and added more weight, a significant choice given that these boats were very sensitive to both total weight and top-heaviness.
 
Mark, I don't know for sure either. That's what makes it fun and maddening!

Druxey, are you suggesting that air gets trapped in the paddle box?  There is apparently turbulance from the paddles splashing on front and the then tossing some in the air at the rear.  Basically, re-reading what Wiki talked about, there's quite a bit that was reduced by the variable pitch blades entering and exiting the water rather cleanly in addition to being more efficient.   
 
I suspect that Cathead is correct about the variable pitch not being used much on the Western Rivers.  A sandbar or snag would wreck havoc on a paddle.
 
Hmm.. food for thought and more research now that my Curiosity Button has been pushed.

Piet,
 
               Wow !!!    That's all I can say.....
 
   Keep up the good work,  Keith

Beautiful work Mark, 
 
                                  I want to be able to do that when I grow up....
 
            Thumbs up,   Keith

Sal,
 
That's a neat prototype, to be sure. Just to clarify, the placement of the paddle wheels isn't diagnostic of the boat's design or location. Western river boats used both stern and side wheel designs, as each has its benefits and drawbacks.
 
Stern wheels were generally better for shallow or snag-filled water, as the hull protected the wheel, whereas side wheels were quite susceptible to damage being exposed on the sides. In addition, stern wheels could be used to help a boat cross shallow bars or back off muddy shorelines; setting the wheel in reverse forced lots of water under the hull, "floating" it off an obstacle.
 
On the other hand, side wheels were more maneuverable, as they could be independently stopped or run in opposite directions, spinning the boat in place (at least on later designs with separate engines for each wheel). They also distributed the weight of machinery closer to the center of the vessel, reducing the "hogging" so common on stern wheel designs.
 
For rivers like the Hudson, which were deep and tame compared to the western rivers, side wheelers made a lot more sense, so that's what you mostly see. This is also true of the lower Mississippi, below the confluence of the Missouri and Ohio rivers into the main stem. But you saw a lot more stern wheelers as you went upstream to the upper Ohio and Missouri rivers in particular, and their smaller tributaries.
 
This is also the case because the western rivers, especially the Missouri, tended to have a lot of debris in them because their basins' geology wasn't as dominated by bedrock. Banks were always eroding away in huge chunks, dropping wads of trees into the river, and changing the rivers' courses regularly. By contrast, most eastern rivers like the Hudson are bedrock-dominated; they don't change course much at all and they don't erode their banks in the same way, so they tended to be "cleaner" of debris with more stable channels, negating the main benefits of stern wheel designs. So you tended to see side wheelers in the east, and a mix of the two in the West depending on where the boat's main work was intended to be (and various other factors, it's not quite this cut and dry).
 
This is a broad overview, there are many per-river details that I could write a small book on. But hopefully that clarifies part of the question. Personally I don't have any resources to suggest about walking-beam engines, but hopefully someone else does. I've seen examples on craft from various parts of the world, so hope that someone else here can help you out. I hope you can find resources specific to eastern boats, as the designs and construction will be pretty different from the western boats, due to differences in materials, industrial capacity, design philosophy, and river conditions between the two regions. But the placement of the wheels, on its own, isn't a factor.

Hi Glenn,
 
              She is beautiful !!!!    You should be proud, I noticed you also have a couple of Moi overseeing her construction....
 
               If I can construct mine with half the precision you are showing, I will feel I'm doing something.
 
Keep up the wonderful work,  Keith

Hi Glenn,
 
              She is beautiful !!!!    You should be proud, I noticed you also have a couple of Moi overseeing her construction....
 
               If I can construct mine with half the precision you are showing, I will feel I'm doing something.
 
Keep up the wonderful work,  Keith

Hi Cathead,
 
                   Absolutely grand build. I find it quite inspirational.....
 
 
 All the best,    Keith

Hi Cathead,
 
                   Absolutely grand build. I find it quite inspirational.....
 
 
 All the best,    Keith

Piet,
 
               Wow !!!    That's all I can say.....
 
   Keep up the good work,  Keith

Machining the engine parts so far

 
 
 
Engine valves and flywheel flanges

 
 
 
Paddlewheel flanges

 
 
 
Valve cams, Sole plates for engine, buttress plates for sole plates and bearings and crossheads and packing glands for the piston

 
 
Engine cylinders and feedwater pumps (minus the flanges)

 
 

Great to see my old mate Mr. Piet dropping in for a visit.  Wish you could join me on this one Pete....should be a real blast.

Took a few update shots this morning, with only four days to have her "more finished" for the road trip....

All channels have now been rigged with dead eyes and chains.... 56 of them.

 
All dead eyes have now been rigged with shrouds....
Note that the main mast top has been added.

 
Currently working on completing the three remaining tops.  Note - there are over 80 custom cut and shaped parts to these little tops.

Hi Glenn,
 
              She is beautiful !!!!    You should be proud, I noticed you also have a couple of Moi overseeing her construction....
 
               If I can construct mine with half the precision you are showing, I will feel I'm doing something.
 
Keep up the wonderful work,  Keith

Hi Glenn,
 
              She is beautiful !!!!    You should be proud, I noticed you also have a couple of Moi overseeing her construction....
 
               If I can construct mine with half the precision you are showing, I will feel I'm doing something.
 
Keep up the wonderful work,  Keith

Hi Cathead,
 
                   Absolutely grand build. I find it quite inspirational.....
 
 
 All the best,    Keith

Hi Cathead,
 
                   Absolutely grand build. I find it quite inspirational.....
 
 
 All the best,    Keith

Hi Cathead,
 
                   Absolutely grand build. I find it quite inspirational.....
 
 
 All the best,    Keith

And now the special photos. I initially got started in this whole wooden model adventure because I am also a model railroader. My layout is centered on a Missouri River port town during the Civil War, roughly based on St. Joseph, MO, where the first railroad across Missouri connected the Mississippi and Missouri Rivers in 1859. Abraham Lincoln rode this railroad, the Hannibal & St. Joseph RR, while considering different options for the route of the first American transcontinental route. In any case, I knew I wanted a steamboat at the levee in my railroad town, to capture the feel of many fascinating images of railroads and steamboats interacting during this era.
 
So my first-ever wooden ship/boat model was a primitive scratchbuild of the famous sternwheeler Far West, which among other things carried Custer's troops to and from the Battle of Little Big Horn. To get ready for that project, several years ago, I built a cardboard mockup of Far West to have something three-dimensional to refer to as I built the real model. I enjoyed the project so much, I built two more Missouri River craft from scratch (see my signature) and was so addicted I ordered a kit, and so on. That's about when I found MSW and the infection spread. 
 
In any case, I put together a lineup of these three models, to show the evolution of my still-quite-amateur skills. I think it's neat to see them side-by-side; I named the cardboard mockup after my wife, though there really was a steamboat called Arkansas Belle:
 

 
Today, for the first time, I placed Bertrand on my layout. It's larger than Far West, for which the river portion was designed, so it hangs out over the edge. But it's also period-accurate; Bertrand was built in 1864 and certainly stopped in St. Joseph on its final trip upriver in 1865. Most of the buildings on the layout are scratchbuilt, including several based on real period buildings which remain today. When Bertrand left St. Joseph, her crew and passengers had no way of knowing she'd soon be a wreck, buried beneath the ever-shifting river sediment for over 100 years, until being rediscovered and excavated as a rare time capsule into this pivotal period of American history. At least this model will help preserve her memory in some small way.
 
So here are three photos of Bertrand in her natural habitat, at a Missouri River port town where all period modes of transportation came together. The western-most railhead in the country was here for a short time, wagon trains left from here for the West (including many Mormons), and steamboats lined the levee on their way too and from Montana. Here's one vision of how that scene might have looked:
 



 
My deepest thanks again to all of you. It's been a pleasure.

Below are final photos of the completed Bertrand. In this post are basic shots from different angles, then another post follows with a few special photos. 
 
I am incredibly grateful for the interest and support shown by all of you for this rather obscure project. I don't think I could or would have undertaken this without the motivation and community of a build log to keep me focused. So thank you.
 







 
 
 
 
 
 

Great idea Cathead, I know I'll find it very useful!

Index of this build
This is an idea I had partway through this build. The idea is to provide an outline of the build so future readers can find information more easily without wading through the entire comment thread or trying to find the right search terms. It's now linked in the opening post of this log.
 
Edit: I wrote up a whole post about this, intending to post it as a new idea, only to find that it had already been proposed last year. But I added my original idea writeup anyway, in case it's of interest to anyone. 
 
Laying out hull frames, first attempt
 
Reconsidering hull framing with new information
 
Laying out hull frames, second attempt
 
Hull framing continued, starting on bow & stern
 
Correcting stern framing, continuing stern & bow framing
 
Completing hull framing
 
Adding guard framing
 
Questioning bow planking
 
Adding deck beams
 
Planking the bow (following some excellent suggestions/discussion)
 
Planking, sanding, and painting hull; starting deck planking
 
Building the rudders; continuing deck planking
 
Building the paddle wheel
 
Images & information from re-visiting the Bertrand museum at DeSoto National Wildlife Refuge, Iowa
 
Discussion of steamboat wrecks on the Missouri
 
Engines & drivers
 
Main deck structures, framing in the boiler deck, hog chain braces
 
Boilers, main deck staircase, beginning boiler deck planking
 
Boiler deck completed, building main cabin structure with stateroom interiors
 
Framing & planking the hurricane deck, building the outhouses
 
Discussion of paddlewheel color
 
Pilot house, chimneys, railings, and the nearly completed model
 
Grasshopper spars
 
Final details
 
Final photos, part I
 
Final photos, part II

Hi Glenn,
 
              She is beautiful !!!!    You should be proud, I noticed you also have a couple of Moi overseeing her construction....
 
               If I can construct mine with half the precision you are showing, I will feel I'm doing something.
 
Keep up the wonderful work,  Keith

Mike,
 
Looks great so far. I'm a bit late to the deck-painting discussion, but here's one other method I've used before. Use a cotton swab (Qtip) with diluted paint. Get the swab wet, press out the excess paint liquid against the side of a container, then use the swab to rub the color onto the wood. If you get it right, this allows a transfer of diluted color that's less sloppy than a brush, as you're essentially using the swab as a sponge, so it retains more moisture than a brush does. Certainly experiment on scrap first to get the hang of it, but I like it.
 
I love the idea of replanking the deck, but it's not my model!