shipmodel

Hi Mark - 
 
Yes, 100% better, but not quite there yet, to my eye.  Go back to the photos of the model that Druxey sent you and compare the turn of the planks there to yours.  I believe that the curve is less acute.  
 
You can see the sense in having a shallow curve for two reasons.  First, a sharp curve here will create an eddy behind itself which increases drag. Those old shipwrights may not have had the mathematics to describe the exact drag force, but they sure could observe the effect and take it into account. Those old shipyard workers would also have been much happier with less of a struggle to bend 3 or 4 inch thick planks around a tight curve.
 
Don't worry about removing too much wood since you will be planking over your frames.  You can even put in a filler piece if you need to.  Getting the curve right on this model will guide you on the next one where you could leave the frames exposed.
 
But you are clearly headed in the right direction on the learning curve and on the model.  Well done.
 
Dan

Hi Mark - 
 
Yes, 100% better, but not quite there yet, to my eye.  Go back to the photos of the model that Druxey sent you and compare the turn of the planks there to yours.  I believe that the curve is less acute.  
 
You can see the sense in having a shallow curve for two reasons.  First, a sharp curve here will create an eddy behind itself which increases drag. Those old shipwrights may not have had the mathematics to describe the exact drag force, but they sure could observe the effect and take it into account. Those old shipyard workers would also have been much happier with less of a struggle to bend 3 or 4 inch thick planks around a tight curve.
 
Don't worry about removing too much wood since you will be planking over your frames.  You can even put in a filler piece if you need to.  Getting the curve right on this model will guide you on the next one where you could leave the frames exposed.
 
But you are clearly headed in the right direction on the learning curve and on the model.  Well done.
 
Dan

Mark: there is a fairing issue at the stern here (perhaps I'm coming in on this conversation a little late). The curve should be nicely radiused, without any sudden turn. I've attached two examples here: one is a full-bodied ship, the other lean and mean.
 
Hope this is of some help.

I'm hoping for opinions..  and fear not, I can take critique... 
 
I've sanded and shaped quite a bit on the last cant frame and the transoms.   Is this better?  Does it need more work?
I removed 5 planks, the 3 now installed are only tacked into place and will need beveling, etc.   But I wanted to get an opinion.  I'm thinking they look 100% better, but not sure how "accurate" it is.  Do I need more work on this area?
 
I managed to sort out what my references show (unfortunately, no planking expansion but that's to be expected) for plank that's now wrapped around a bit.  Which what the references seem to show.
 
Thanks in advance.  
 

Thanks Dan for the wishes.
 
Status at this point:
While sanding down the tuck and bending wood, I got to thinking... Dangerous, I know.  And what with Druxey getting me thinking outside the box a bit.. a lot actually and re-shape things, I re-looked overall the plans in detail even the obscure things... Hahn's build article and pictures... Druxey's input.. other builds.. and it dawned on me that one thing I missed was Hahn's severe beveling of the last cant frame.  See attached.  Once it soaked in what I needed to do, I realized it's only possible way to get that outside edge and the rest of the tuck to work right. 
 
 While digging around in the hard copy files... I found part of the problem in a post-it note I stuck to the frame drawings .  I hadn't pre-beveled it as radical as needed as the frame was flimsy and taking off halt the material on the trailing edge didn't seem like a good idea at the time.   Well, actually, I did try it during construction and broke both sides twice and told myself "not now". Thus, the post-it note.   I should have hung a big sign on the wall:  "Bevel last aft frame, dummy!!"  I'm beveling even more than what's been suggested and things are coming more into line.  I sometimes really need a slap upside the head.
 
I'm currently cleaning things up such that the fashion piece, existing planking (well.. the bits I haven't ripped off anyway) and framing and transoms. I'm also cleaning up the aft end of the existing wide planking.  As soon as I can get one side put together, I'll post a photo 
 
Giampiero, Dan and Druxey, I owe you your favorite adult beverages for your help in spotting problems and your input.  And I owe everyone for their support.   
 
Frame 53.pdf

Hi Mark -
 
Yes, much much improved.  You can't go far wrong if you follow Druxey's suggestions.  Your progress up the learning curve is well underway and you are going to be very happy that you took the step back before you took the next step forward.
 
And a belated Happy Birthday.
 
Dan

Hi Mark -
 
Yes, much much improved.  You can't go far wrong if you follow Druxey's suggestions.  Your progress up the learning curve is well underway and you are going to be very happy that you took the step back before you took the next step forward.
 
And a belated Happy Birthday.
 
Dan

Hi Mark -
 
Yes, much much improved.  You can't go far wrong if you follow Druxey's suggestions.  Your progress up the learning curve is well underway and you are going to be very happy that you took the step back before you took the next step forward.
 
And a belated Happy Birthday.
 
Dan

Hi Mark -
 
Yes, much much improved.  You can't go far wrong if you follow Druxey's suggestions.  Your progress up the learning curve is well underway and you are going to be very happy that you took the step back before you took the next step forward.
 
And a belated Happy Birthday.
 
Dan

It's all doable and it's all good...     And to be very blunt, if it weren't for MSW, I would never, ever tried scratchbuilding.  The help and encouragement is priceless. So a big thank you to everyone.

So hi all, just a quick update. This is my interpretation of Hopeful's jig to sand the stern.  Basically a few pieces of junk wood glued and nailed together and some wood putty added to shape the curve correctly.  While it looks slightly lumpy it will eventually be covered with sandpaper so doesn't have to look perfect.  More pics to come!

Finally, a long overdue update! I started out well with photos of each step and then as life got busy the photos fell by the way. The last few pictures are of each completed piece without process pictures. 
 
I experimented with a few different materials for the stern lanterns, but finally settled on card. The lanterns could not be solid because of the fiber-optics that I had to feed up through the tiny brass tubing and into the lanterns. This was a very tricky process due to the tight fit and bends. I'll try to add some pictures in the next day or so with the lanterns "lit".
 

 

 

 

 
Some more items completed.
 

 

 

 
And placed on deck. I also completed the first of three sets of spiral staircases.
 

 
I also managed to make and place some of the decorative pieces and dolphins.
 

 
Last, but not least, a shot of the stern so far and profile. 
 

Carl, George - 
 
You are both right.  Spiling/planking is a complicated process.  Even after doing it for 30 years I still have to take my time and agonize over the process. Sometimes planks that I thought were correct have to be stripped out and replaced.
 
The problem is the shape of the hull with its compound curves, some of which change from convex to concave on the same rib and along the same planking strake.  Yes, you can start with planks that are slightly wider than your measured marks, which works on the convex curves, but is wrong for the concave curves.  
 
My only point here is that you can't rely on measurements, no matter how precise.  To get a smooth, straight, fair run for each strake the measurements are just the starting point.  Each plank has to be shaped by eye and the battens used as adjustable guides, not inflexible borders. 
 
Fortunately, I had some good teachers, and now there is this entire wonderful community of modelers in the NRG and on MSW who are so generous with their time and knowledge.
 
Be well
 
Dan

Some proof of life and work in progress....
 
I think I'm getting the hang of this.... I've planked both sides with required wide wale planks.  The port side has been sanded but not finish sanded.. pretty rough sanded if you ask me, but it's ready for the narrow hull planks to be laid down.  I need to sand the starboard side which should commence this afternoon... I hope.
 
The stern/transom area I think I have sorted out.  There's a covering piece needed and the fashion piece along the counter to the transom as well as the covering board where the transom meets the counter.  These will be finished once the planking is complete but before final sanding....
 
The planks look a bit damp as I've wiped them down with some water to clear off most of the sanding dust and also to help raise the grain a tad.  I've got a couple of pesky dings that need to be addressed and this is the logical (to my mind) starting point for that process. 
 



 
As always, clicking on the photos will enlarge them and comments and advice are welcome.
 
On a side-note, I'm also developing drawings for the laser cutter to produce all the carving blanks, windows, gun carriages, carved railings, and assorted fiddly bits like the ship's boats.   Some of this stuff is just too darn tiny to cut on a scroll saw.. or I need new eyes. 

The process wasn't nearly as hard as it sounds but this is the finished result.  The top of the hull all nice and even so now I can flip her over and nail her to the board. Note the deck templates laid out, the middle one seems a bit small but that's because the sides of the quarter and forecastle deck's will be planked 1/8" by 1/16" inch planks.

Using a ruler and one of those thingies which name currently eludes me, I kept sanding away the edges with my sanding sticks until the angle was just right, redrawing the lines each time to use as a guide.  See how much nicer the camber is now.

Hi Mark - 
 
Welcome to the wacky and wonderful world of spiling.  Although you can get lots of help from various books, and Jim Roberts' is one of the best, it is mostly a question of experience and eyeballing.  
 
One thing that Jim suggested when I was his pupil was to take strips of frosted tape and lay them flat on the hull till the area I was working on was completely covered.  Like the planks, the tape will sweep up toward the wale with the curve of the hull and cover previous tape runs.  This is a good thing.  It shows how much the planks want to bend so I could start to judge how many stealers/drop planks I might need.  Also, with the area completely taped I could line out the plank runs in pencil, making as many mistakes as I wanted without consequence.  After a while I developed a good sense of how the hull wanted to be planked, and could then much more accurately position my battens to guide the actual wood planks.
 
On the Licorne I have a feeling, and I could be wrong, that your first batten is too high (towards the keel) at the bow.  Judging by eye, the remaining area from the batten to the keel is not wide enough and your lower planks could be crowded and narrow,  The only way to be sure of this is to put in all of the battens that you want and then carefully examine them from dead ahead to see if they give you equal spacing.  A similar thing goes on at the stern.
 
Here is a drawing of what I mean.  It is from Jim's book, although I have removed his text for clarity.
 

 
Remember also that the garboard and first broad strake (the one next to the garboard) are wider than the rest of the planks, and your spiling/batten plan has to take this into account.
 
This was probably a longer response than you wanted, but I hope that it helps.
 
Dan
 
 
 
 

Mark: sorry that I'm late in on this conversation. Read the three tutorials on lining out and spiling on this site before you go too far. Under 'Building, framing, planking and plating...."

Mark    I know first hand how much you can agonize when doing the spiling.  It's important to do it right if the run of the planking is to have that proper look.  Believe me when I say I feel your pain.  As I read the posts on your build log I'm struck with how sage like Dan (shipmodel) is when he says that the measurement between strakes and battens, while important, are just a starting point.  Battens are continually adjustable guides and not rigid inflexable borders.  Furthermore he said trust your eyes in conjunction with the battens.  He gives GOOD advise.  Doing this work, to some extent, is feel.  I always found I had to play around with the tape a good deal to get through this process and have it look right.  Stay with it friend, you'll find the answer.
 
Tom

Carl, George - 
 
You are both right.  Spiling/planking is a complicated process.  Even after doing it for 30 years I still have to take my time and agonize over the process. Sometimes planks that I thought were correct have to be stripped out and replaced.
 
The problem is the shape of the hull with its compound curves, some of which change from convex to concave on the same rib and along the same planking strake.  Yes, you can start with planks that are slightly wider than your measured marks, which works on the convex curves, but is wrong for the concave curves.  
 
My only point here is that you can't rely on measurements, no matter how precise.  To get a smooth, straight, fair run for each strake the measurements are just the starting point.  Each plank has to be shaped by eye and the battens used as adjustable guides, not inflexible borders. 
 
Fortunately, I had some good teachers, and now there is this entire wonderful community of modelers in the NRG and on MSW who are so generous with their time and knowledge.
 
Be well
 
Dan

Congratulations on completion, Doris.  I have followed your build with great interest and admiration.  The finished model is a miniature gem, and the interior spaces are spectacular.
 
Best wishes for your new job and your next project.
 
Be well
 
Dan

Royal Caroline is finished. Here you can see many pics of the model:
 

And almost last steps at my work on Royal Caroline...
 
A sailor (woman) with binoculars

 
Anchor buoys

 
Rudder´s chain

Hello, dear friends!
Thank you very much for your support and kind words. I appreciate them a lot.
I was not here for a long time and I have to apologize. In January I started new career, the work was not difficult, but I had no free time and also the new job did not bring me any pleasure nor satisfaction.

So I decided to finish there and few days ago I have found a new occupation as a branch Manager at Don Bosco society and believe this will be much better for me.


The Royal Caroline is already finished a  have to say, that she is my best ship model I have ever created.

 
I would like to bring some pics from the progress for you and hope, you will enjoy them.
Have a great time and take care
Doris

It seems to have been a long time since my last post, so just to show proof of life here is a quick update.
 
Upper Deck Framing
 
These last few weeks have been a very busy time since returning to work, and so visits to the shipyard have been few and far between.  As the opportunity has arisen, I have kept plugging away at making the various knees, Carlings and Ledges.  Preparation of the Carlings was very similar to that for the Deck Beams, with notches cut on the mill and finished by hand with a chisel. Knees and Beam Arms were all cut on the scroll saw and finished on the Spindle and Disc Sanders.
 
Unfortunately, despite the care that I took in aligning the Deck Beams, Beam No.2 is slightly out, meaning that the Carlings between Beams 1 and 2, and between Beams 2 and 3, are also slightly out of alignment.
 
Here is an overall shot to show progress to date – of course the angle was carefully selected to hide as many imperfections as possible!  This shot was taken immediately after sanding, so some clean-up is still required. The side that will not be planked will also receive a coat or two of Wipe-on Poly in due course.