EdT

Hello Alan,

Thanks for responding to my post. Please do not feel that you need to respond to these comments. I made my peace with all these issues long ago and only offer comments that I think may be helpful.  I am glad to do that - for what they are worth.

I suggest you give some thought to the frame bevelling before lofting patterns. I believe many modelers leave the bevels to the sandpaper, but keep in mind that the frames need to be bevelled inside and out. Patterns need to account for this. Patterns from reliable draftsman do that in a way to enable the bevels to be sanded inside and out with enough wood left to meet the molded thickness requirements of the frame when your finished sanding. Also, keep in mind that at the forward and aft ends, bevels become quite extreme and require installation of very thick frames if unbevelled.  Cant frame bevels are a story in themselves.
 
Some modelers partially pre-bevel - if the patterns show the bevels. I did this for Naiad where all four profiles for every frame were lofted. On Young America patterns also included all four profiles and with the assembly process used - enabled by the CAD lofting method  - left patterns on both fore and aft faces of every frame pair after assembly. This enabled the frames to be completely bevelled before erection - as was done in he shipyard. I am not sure if anyone is doing this besides me but I would not go back.
 
Why do this pre-bevelling? Sanding/paring inside the hull is a pain. Erection of bevelled frames is much easier. It is also more accurate.  You can check the hull fairness as the frames are erected. There are many ways to skin this cat.  I only offer this as food for thought.  I'm not in the persuasion business.
 
Have fun - and good luch with the project.
 
Ed

Alan,
 
I think you will find the Vade Mecum very helpful.  It may take some time to digest, but it will be well spent.  It took me some weeks and some things did not sink in for months.  I would draw your attention to some specifics:
 
p 144 begins the section on making drafts.  p 162 begins the specifics of drawing the sheer plan - which should be done first - in 2D at least - I can't comment on 3D - as with the original guys, I don't use it.  P 195 explains the diagonals.  You have not mentioned these.  They are quite important - for setting frame joints, fairing lines and drawing the body lines. p.255 begins the section on tables for forming the bodies and describes important lines that are used to make the draft.  Scantlings begin on p 266.  The glossary is also very useful and sometimes very import points are mentioned only there.
 
I caught up with your log late, but just a few observations:
 
I note that you are taking dimensions from the bottom of the keel.  It was/is normal practice to use the top of the keel as the primary dimensional reference line.  Some dimensions in tables will be on that basis, but it is otherwise just a matter of convention.
 
You have not mentioned "room and space".  This is the distance between frame lines.  2X room and space is the distance beweeen "stations" - main frame lines on the draft.  Room and space allows room for two frames plus air space between the floors.  There are then 4 frames for every station.  Room and space also sets the gunport width since the ports are framed main timbers. 
 
If you are planning to loft individual frames you should consider how these will be defined.  You may find, as I did, that at least the intermediate frame profiles are needed and perhaps some in between to accurately define frame bevels - the ones Allan mentioned. 
 
You mentioned dimensional error between views on the drafts but did not say how much.  I checked the original Naiad drafts - before using them - for accuracy using the scale at the bottom and some other points on the drawing and found them to be 99.8 to 99.9% accurate.  These were paper copies.  From my experience scanning often induces distortion and I would not be surpised to find digitized versions to be less accurate.  However, what is important is to decide what tolerances you will set for your drawings and then decide whether dimensional variation on the drafts is material or not based on that.  For example if the moulded half-breadth of your ship is 20', how much deviation would you accept on the model - 1/32"?  1/64"?  at 1:48 these equate to .63% and .31% respectively - for dimensions like that.  For timber thickness, if you work to say .005"  on a 12" timber (at 1:48) that equates to a tolerance of about 2% on dimensions of that type.  From this you can determine acceptable drawing error.  I think 1 to 2% is generally quite reasonable for model work.
 
Waterlines on these ships are not often keel-parallel and  - as druxey says - you must build on a surface parallel to the keel to be able to set frames vertically.  Actually, except for fairing, waterlines on these ships were not very useful.  Diagonals were much more useful even for fairing - and certainly more accurate for plotting hull profiles.  I found it convenient to define separate keel-parallel waterlines and draw those from the body plan on the half-breadth.  I then used those for whatever purpose needed - for example templates to check the hull - those are best set up parallel to the board surface.
 
There are a lot of lines on the original drafts and some may be mysterious.  All are important.  I would make sure to understand what each one is.  The Vade Mecum will help with that.
 
I hope these few points will be helpful.
 
You are just beginning a major and very complex effort.  All the best with it.
 
Ed

Hello Richard,
I do believe that volume 2 is out of print, but cannot advise you how to get a copy.  You might try writing to the published, Mike Ellison, (Mike@seawatchbooks.com) but I doubt there is any inventory.  You might also try Amazon.  I have seen a copy or two of my books show up there used.  You might also, post requests on MSW.  Perhaps someone may be able to sell you one.
 
Sorry, I could not be more helpful.
 
Ed

Hello Richard,
I do believe that volume 2 is out of print, but cannot advise you how to get a copy.  You might try writing to the published, Mike Ellison, (Mike@seawatchbooks.com) but I doubt there is any inventory.  You might also try Amazon.  I have seen a copy or two of my books show up there used.  You might also, post requests on MSW.  Perhaps someone may be able to sell you one.
 
Sorry, I could not be more helpful.
 
Ed

Hello Richard,
I do believe that volume 2 is out of print, but cannot advise you how to get a copy.  You might try writing to the published, Mike Ellison, (Mike@seawatchbooks.com) but I doubt there is any inventory.  You might also try Amazon.  I have seen a copy or two of my books show up there used.  You might also, post requests on MSW.  Perhaps someone may be able to sell you one.
 
Sorry, I could not be more helpful.
 
Ed

Rich...I concur with Ed.  Research...research.  flying Fish was constructed in 1851...and by then large *sticks* were not as available on the East coast.  Glory of the Seas was built with, *built* lower masts....on all three masts in 1869.  However, by the mid 1880's she had several masts refit with large single *sticks*, while she was on the West Coast...where such large trees where abundant.   Research the time frame of the said paintings....you may discover that if Flying fish was painted with bands on her mizzen...that was probably how she was rigged...during her construction...since most times good quality paintings were commissioned shortly after the ship was launched.....or after a new captain had made significant alterations.
 
Ed's YA was built with a banded mizzen
Rob

Very nice coppering job, Jerry.  The eraser is a good way to clean up the work and I used it some years ago on Victory's 3700 plates - doesn't leave anything behind like steel wool threads or skin.
 
I assume the copper is self-adhesive.  Do you know the thickness?  Can you recommend a source?
 
Thanks,
 
Ed 

I acually use a paper cutter depending on the thickness.  Also, make sure to get uncoated material.  Some craft sources sell coated material that does not tarnish, but also does not react to darkening.
 
Ed

I acually use a paper cutter depending on the thickness.  Also, make sure to get uncoated material.  Some craft sources sell coated material that does not tarnish, but also does not react to darkening.
 
Ed

McMaster Carr for lots of stuff from high quality drill bits to copper and brass sheets and rods.  https://www.mcmaster.com/
Allan

For brass strips I use a guillotine (like the one used for photography). I cut them from a larger brass sheet, I obtained earlier for photoetching, and have some left over.

When in doubt, Amazon.  There's always Micromark.  I got brass and copper wire, strips, plate, sheets etc from a variety of places - not one or even a few.  A lot of hardware stores - like Ace - have K&S displays.  The search for stuff is part of the fun.
 
Ed

When in doubt, Amazon.  There's always Micromark.  I got brass and copper wire, strips, plate, sheets etc from a variety of places - not one or even a few.  A lot of hardware stores - like Ace - have K&S displays.  The search for stuff is part of the fun.
 
Ed

Randy, this is a lovely build and deserving of a log. You don't have to post any more than you want. It really is easy and when you have milling questions we'll be able to better help later in your own log.

Hi Randy,
 
On the scuppers, I probably just followed Crothers.  Any pictures posted here would be much appreciated.  I do not know if my model is on dislay at Mystic, but if you find out, let me know.
 
Ed

Hi Randy,
 
On the scuppers, I probably just followed Crothers.  Any pictures posted here would be much appreciated.  I do not know if my model is on dislay at Mystic, but if you find out, let me know.
 
Ed

Young America - extreme clipper 1853
Part 197 – Topmast Shroud Deadeyes
 
The last post showed the forward futtock shrouds installed, but was mainly concerned changes to rigging sizes, so I skipped over the work on the shrouds.  This work started with making straps for the deadeyes from copper wire.
 
The first picture shows wire wrapped around a dowel to make consistent-sized rings that will be formed into straps.
 

 
After some testing of ring size, a ¼" dowel was determined to be the right size for this – conveniently.  I was hoping to avoid turning a special size.  After wrapping tightly, the rings were parted as shown below.
 

 
The razor blade shown above makes a clean cut in the 22 gauge wire used for these – but only one or two at a time.  The next picture shows some rings before soldering as well as the test assembly fitted into the top.
 

 
The next picture shows the top with its six deadeyes fitted through slots in the iron reinforcing strip and the wood rim below.
 

 
A variety of futtock shroud materials and methods of fastening were used during the period.  Iron bars were coming into use.  Where rope was used, connections might be shackles, hooks or lashings.  Mast connections varied.  I decided on rope with hooks at the top and lashings at the mast eyes, typical of the early clipper years.  The next step was to make the hooked-thimbles.  Some are shown in the next picture.
 

 
These thimbles were cut from 1.5mm brass tube then flared by tapping with a shaped punch.  The thimbles shown happened to be blackened first – not necessary.  The eyes in the hooks must be large enough to pass the served shroud.  To ensure this, the brass rod shown was used as a gauge when forming the hooks.  In the last picture the hooked thimbles have been blackened and are shown suspended from the straps, awaiting connection of the shrouds,
 

 
Making the shrouds will be described in the next part.
 
Ed

Lovely clean framing, Montanes.
 
Ed

That is what I call beautiful rope, Amalio.
 
Ed

I believe that nitrocelluose is laquer resin.  It makes a good sanding sealer because it is hard.  Will check and advise if incorrect.
 
Ed

Magnificent, Amalio.
 
Ed

Bravo, Amalio!
 
Ed

Amalio,
 
I am just discovering your postings and am fascinated by the method.  I am not sure I understand, but do you intend to remove the inner model supports and replace them with atcual framing while the outer molds hold the planking in place?  Fascinating.  Beautiful craftsmanship.
 
Ed
 
Translation from Google:
Estoy descubriendo sus publicaciones y estoy fascinado por el método. No estoy seguro de entender, pero ¿tiene la intención de quitar los soportes del modelo interior y reemplazarlos con el marco atcual, mientras que los moldes externos mantener el tablaje en su lugar? Fascinante. Hermosa artesanía.

Remarkable, beautiful work.  
 
Ed

Absolutely beautiful work, Alexandru.
 
Ed