Masking Problem

[mikiek]

It was time to paint the bulwarks on Niagara. I had painted the port side once before and had a nightmare of a time with paint seeping under my masking tape (Tamiya).  Given that the paint I had saved had dried up and matching colors would be tough, I decided to repaint the port side with newly mixed acrylic paint so it would match up with the starboard.

 

I also learned here about painting over the tape edges with the color you are trying to protect and I did that this time. Then on with the airbrush painting. The masking did a pretty good job this time, although it created a new problem. With 3 coats of primer and 2 coats of color the tape left a raised edge when I pulled it off.

 

 

 

So 2 questions.

 

1. Is this preventable?

 

2. How to deal with the problem. I'm trying to hand paint those spots, building up more paint inside the edges - this doesn't seem to be helping. Next, do I consider sanding the edge?

[Ray1981]

I dont know exactly what you did before but I think it makes sense this unfortunate result because the apply another layer of paint over an existing layer. I think you painted everything sand brouwn after that the red gunports and than sand brown again. So the gunports have less paint layers as the rest of the area. 

I would try to mask the gunports and paint the rest in sand brown give it a good time to dry and then mask the sand brown and paint the gunports red. I think that would give a better result.

 

But I'm a novice there are maybe easier ways to try to avoid your problem. Anyhow I hope I could help you a tiny bit

 

Grtz Ray

[allanyed]

I have sprayed or brushed a clear coat over the tape edge allowing it to seep under the tap and then let it dry, before painting.  The clear coat seals the edge of the tape so paint will not seep in.   Of course the tape should be tight to the wood to start, but the clear finishes the sealing.     Just be sure it is the same clear you will be using on the finishing of the unpainted wood, be it flat, semi gloss or gloss.Multiple layers of paint are thus not needed and no lifted edge problem.

 

Allan

Edited March 26, 2016 by allanyed

[mikiek]

Allen - I am not following you. I painted all the ports red first. Then laid the tape down over those. I painted the tape edges red. After that dried I sprayed on the primer and then the buff. The primer was necessary to cover up the overage from the red - buff by itself will not cover red without a lot of coats.

 

Whether I use red or clear, I think the idea is the same, fill up any areas of tape that might wick up additional paint layers.

 

Ray may be on to something. Not sure if there is a rule of thumb about this, but perhaps I should have started painting the bulwark areas that have the lightest color (buff in my case) first. Then mask the lite color and move to an area that needs a darker color. It might not take so many layers of the dark color over the lighter color.

 

In dealing with this as it is, I tried a 1500 sand sponge on a few of the edges. While it smoothed out the edge a little, it also took off some paint, which will require more hand painting to touch up. I'm slowly losing the nice airbrush finish.

[kurtvd19]

Mike:

You are on the right track - always cover the lighter color with the darker color.  When you have a ridge between colors try dragging the smooth top side of your fingernail over the ridge along the length of the ridge as soon as the tape is removed - always try to remove the tape as soon as possible.  The paint must be dry to the touch but do it ASAP.  I use acrylics and can unmask the edge within 5 minutes and then use the fingernail trick.  Don't keep doing it as you might rub some paint off - once is enough - don't be afraid of using a bit of pressure.   The nature of acrylics is to "lay down tighter" as they dry so the fingernail is just helping the process along.  Acrylics can look a bit thick when first applied but they lay down soon.

Hope this helps,

Kurt

[mikiek]

That makes sense Kurt.  I can see now how even a paint job requires some strategy. It required a lot of extra coats of primer and paint to get the buff over the red, whereas red over buff probably could have been 1 coat with little or no edge from the tape.

 

Before this is over I still may have to go back and do just that.  Is there such a thing as too much paint on a surface?

[Ray1981]

Before this is over I still may have to go back and do just that. Is there such a thing as too much paint on a surface?

Well my experience with plastic kits is that when you use too much paint the wood grain dissappears. I dont know if you get this issue when you make a wooden kit like you are doing, but i think yes. Im interested what the specialists say on this question.

 

Grtz

 

Ray

Edited March 26, 2016 by Ray1981

[mikiek]

It's funny Ray - I see some builds here where it looks like they wanted to cover the grain. Filler over the entire hull, then sanded smooth. The result is almost glass-like.

 

For the period builds we do, I prefer grain - the rougher the better. Sadly, after airbrushing a couple coats of primer and then a couple coats of color, most of the grain on my build is gone.

[kurtvd19]

Mike:

One of the reasons I like acrylics is the covering ability while being a very thin paint thickness.  It is important to use model type paints due to the finely ground pigment vs the stuff from the hardware store (1 micron vs 37 microns).  Several very thin coats is what I do starting with the first coat thin enough that it is barely recognized as paint with subsequent coats - still very thin - adding up to good coverage while maintaining the wood grain' visibility.  When I say thin coats I don't meant to thin the paint out - just apply a thin coat. 

Kurt

[Ray1981]

It's funny Ray - I see some builds here where it looks like they wanted to cover the grain. Filler over the entire hull, then sanded smooth. The result is almost glass-like.

 

For the period builds we do, I prefer grain - the rougher the better. Sadly, after airbrushing a couple coats of primer and then a couple coats of color, most of the grain on my build is gone.

Who would want to cover a wood grain. I there is something i like to see is a beautifull wood grain. I use one thin layer of primer (but this is not always needed) that I think the paint and do 1 or 2 layers. This without loosing the wood grain.

[mikiek]

Kurt - that gives me the basic idea. I knew lite coverage is what is desired, but I didn't imagine that lite. I think I need to adjust the airbrush, it may be spraying too much paint. I usually end up with a lite, but solid first layer.

 

If I could expand on that a little, how about primer? Do you always use it? Do you want to end up with a solid coat (built up from several applications)?

[Harvey]

Hi

What masking tape are you using have you tried an anti bleed masking tape.

just a quick thought

[mikiek]

Harvey - I am using Tamiya tape in various widths.  Never heard of anti-bleeding tape.

[Harvey]

Hi

have a look at this

3M 471 Blue Fine Line Vinyl Masking Tape

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Fine-Vinyl-Masking-Painting-Residue/dp/B00CUPL8BI

[kurtvd19]

The Tamiya tape is also very good.  I use both the 3M Fine Line and the Tamiya.  Both are very excellent and resist any seepage under their edges when burnished down onto the surface.

 

Here is something I did earlier today.  Fine line tape masked off the waterline (bare eggshell) and then some frisket was placed on the fine line tape to mask off the rest of the egg.  Painted the red first, removed the frisket and put it back onto the fine line tape to cover over the red - not having moved the fine line tape, sprayed the blue and then removed the frisket and then the fine line tape.  Total time from first starting to mask until done was less than 20 minutes till I took the photo.  Acrylics dry quickly.

 

I keeping with the nautical theme here, the red is Badger Modelflex Anti-Fouling Red Oxide (16-401) and the blue is their Tug Medium Blue (16-434).  The white waterline is the Chicken's natural Eggshell White.

 

Kurt

[leclaire]

Kurt,

 

So what you are saying is either of the two tapes you mentioned work well as long as you press with enough pressure along the edge to get a decent seal. That along with painting the darker color over the lighter one will get a good result.

 

Bob

[mikiek]

Kurt - thanks man, you're bringing up a lot of good tips. I'm learning.

 

Do you ever you frisket on wood?  I had a post about that and did some experimenting. I had a tough time getting the frisket off the wood. The stuff I have took almost a day to dry. My impatience doesn't like to have to wait that long.

[kurtvd19]

Mike:

I don't use liquid frisket.  The frisket I use is a film with a tacky stickum on the one side.  It canbe used for painting flames, etc on cars, helmets, etc.  Also useful for models.

 

The 3M and Tamiya tapes need to go ver smooth surfaces.  Wood must be sanded smooth before being painted.  If it's smooth enough for the paint then the tape will stick and seal.  Maybe the better way to think about it would be that if the tape sticks and seals the wood is smooth enough to paint.  Choice of woods is critical.  Too open a grain and you can never seal it well enough with the tape.

 

Kurt