Greg Davis Posted December 24, 2023 Author Share #61 Posted December 24, 2023 It looks like this kit is going into a holding pattern for a bit. Much of the remaining work requires the engine to be in place, but the replacement cylinder has not made an appearance yet. While Ricardo, at Model Expo, said I should be getting it soon their website shows the request still processing; i.e., not shipping yet. Old Collingwood, Egilman, James G and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted December 26, 2023 Share #62 Posted December 26, 2023 Just started the Bis 14 and your build diary has helped quite a bit. I kind of solved the rib bending jig problem by putting a 5/16 square piece of wood on top of the jig just aft of the second cross piece to increase the curvature. it works OK and some judicious rebending to conform to the rib shape during the glue up, the results are satisfactory. I found I need two or three more 1 1/2mm bamboo pieces to complete the rib assys. Did you have this problem? I have sone 1/16 " dia. basswood dowels I'll use to for the straight pieces to complete the ribs. Will make the bamboo nodes much in the fashion of your approach. Motor mostly done except it looks like assembling the fuel distributor (G) with the down tubes will be difficult if not impossible. mtaylor, Old Collingwood, Egilman and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted December 27, 2023 Author Share #63 Posted December 27, 2023 George - Great to hear you are making the model as well! Very interesting method for dealing with the ribs. I still am not sure I am satisfied with the ribs between the wing panels on mine. Currently I am thinking of removing them and replacing with ribs made from basswood. I've experimented with a few basswood ribs and they are holding the shape well. Once they have nodes and are painted, I don't think that the replacements will look different from the bamboo ones. I didn't come up short with bamboo dowels - I was supplied with enough to have left over material. Yes the fuel distributer installation looks to be challenging. When I get to that part (after the rest of the engine has been installed) I think that I will place a block under part G when adding the first couple of injection tubes. Hopefully it looks more tricky than it actually is! Greg mtaylor, Egilman, Canute and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted December 29, 2023 Share #64 Posted December 29, 2023 Having a bit of a bother with the ribs fitting into the wing jigs. The ribs (6" long) don't engage both slots in the jigs as they are too short. The distance between the jig vertical sides is also 6" which means I can engage only one slot at a time. Building the jigs is error proof and building the ribs per plan is also not an area of misinterpretation. Am I missing something? On the other front, all ribs are complete, less nodes and color, and one is complete. For the nodes I used brown thread with a half knot and a dab of thin CA and after trimming came out satisfactorily. Applied yellow ochre by hand with latex gloves and I'm pleased with the results. Applying the paint after the nodes helps seal the thread and still has the brown node color showing through the paint king derelict, Old Collingwood, Canute and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted December 29, 2023 Author Share #65 Posted December 29, 2023 George - I didn't have problems with the lower ribs setting nicely in the jig; however, at the top there was a small issue. While I had done my best to have the jigs squared up nicely, there was still a bit of splaying going on at the top so that the top ribs didn't fit secure in the jig. So I used spring clamps to keep the heights of the ribs correct; but maybe most importantly, I used bar clamps to gently pull the top of the jig together. In this picture you can see a bar clamp at the outer end of the wing jig. The only issue using the clamp was that it was a little challenging to get enough clamping pressure for the clamp to stay in place but not too much to distort (or break) a rib. A better solution would be to have a pair of temporary spreaders that could be slipped onto each end of the jig. Something like this: This would be a nice addition to the laser cut parts for the jig! Greg Canute, mtaylor, Old Collingwood and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted December 29, 2023 Author Share #66 Posted December 29, 2023 Cylinder casting update: My Model Expo account says that the replacement part request is still processing - it is now getting close to 2 weeks since I was told I would be receiving the parts soon! king derelict, Canute, Egilman and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted December 31, 2023 Author Share #67 Posted December 31, 2023 End of Year Update The 14 Bis will continue to stall for at least a couple of weeks 🤔. Here's the latest correspondence from Model Expo: Greg, I am here in Brazil and I picked the metal parts from the engine. Will be back Jan 10th and have it shipped. The wood parts are already in the US. You'll have it all shipped as soon as I get back. Best Regards and happy new year! Ryland Craze, Egilman, Canute and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted January 12 Share #68 Posted January 12 Greg, Hope you're getting your carb soon. Have had two attempts at attaching the fuel distributor and down tubes but after attaching the two beginning tubes to the carbs, I can't seem to get the parts to satisfactorily line up with the carbs. I will try with using different tubes than the instructions to start. I'll try using two "H" tubes that go to the fwd right and aft left. On another note; are the wing jigs marked improperly? Is the left really the right and vice versa? On the right jig, the leading edge of the rib is higher on the left side of the jig. Since the closest rib is a full assembly, this should be the outboardmost rib of the wing half. So you are looking at the left wing with the eventual fuselage going to the left. The left side view on the large plan, verifies that the wing rib profile has the rib end higher at the leading edge than the trailing edge. Am I missing something or has my dementia set in? George Old Collingwood, Canute, Egilman and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted January 13 Author Share #69 Posted January 13 20 hours ago, George Ramey said: Greg, Hope you're getting your carb soon. Have had two attempts at attaching the fuel distributor and down tubes but after attaching the two beginning tubes to the carbs, I can't seem to get the parts to satisfactorily line up with the carbs. I will try with using different tubes than the instructions to start. I'll try using two "H" tubes that go to the fwd right and aft left. On another note; are the wing jigs marked improperly? Is the left really the right and vice versa? On the right jig, the leading edge of the rib is higher on the left side of the jig. Since the closest rib is a full assembly, this should be the outboardmost rib of the wing half. So you are looking at the left wing with the eventual fuselage going to the left. The left side view on the large plan, verifies that the wing rib profile has the rib end higher at the leading edge than the trailing edge. Am I missing something or has my dementia set in? George George I agree with you on the wing jig labeling - it appears that left and right has been given from the perspective of looking at the plane from the front and not as if you were in the pilot basket. Still waiting on the cylinder - hopefully by the end of the month! Its giving me time to finish another model that needs to be wrapped up. I haven't made any attempt to work on the fuel supply system yet. I have looked at the instructions a number of times and I was thinking that the main diagram labels are not correct. I think that along the longest diagonals you need to have HGI and IGH as opposed to HGH and IGI to keep the diagonals the same length. Greg mtaylor, Egilman, Jack12477 and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted January 31 Author Share #70 Posted January 31 End of January update: Same as end of December update, still waiting on Model Expo for replacement parts. Canute, mtaylor, Old Collingwood and 1 other 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 1 Share #71 Posted February 1 My wings are basically complete and the basic fuselage is done with the basket installed. Had to remove two of the bottom crosspieces supporting the basket because the basket would wedge itself in but not quite (by about .02") get inserted. Found out why I ran short of the 1.5mm bamboo rods; I made 6 each left and right ribs, not three. I interpreted "build 6 identical wing panels" to mean 6 each side since the plans showed a showed a left and right wing template. Substituting the Midwest products 1/16 dowels for the shortages. Built the cockpit rear, but like you, I am short the fl01 sheet for the cockpit front. After a week and a half and a gentle reminder, I received confirmation that my request is "processing". I will work on the canard while waiting for the missing part. Good luck with the carb. If my parts request drags on, I'll build my own like you. George mtaylor, Jack12477, Egilman and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 1 Author Share #72 Posted February 1 3 hours ago, George Ramey said: My wings are basically complete and the basic fuselage is done with the basket installed. Had to remove two of the bottom crosspieces supporting the basket because the basket would wedge itself in but not quite (by about .02") get inserted. Found out why I ran short of the 1.5mm bamboo rods; I made 6 each left and right ribs, not three. I interpreted "build 6 identical wing panels" to mean 6 each side since the plans showed a showed a left and right wing template. Substituting the Midwest products 1/16 dowels for the shortages. Built the cockpit rear, but like you, I am short the fl01 sheet for the cockpit front. After a week and a half and a gentle reminder, I received confirmation that my request is "processing". I will work on the canard while waiting for the missing part. Good luck with the carb. If my parts request drags on, I'll build my own like you. George George - Sounds like you are making great progress - post a pic or two! I had the same issue with the basket; it was a really tight fit, so I put the crosspieces in after the basket was inside the fuselage. The instructions are challenging / ambiguous at times. I'm pretty sure that I will be replacing many of the ribs that are between the wing panels because I don't like how the bamboo didn't keep the airfoil shape. I'm going to use basswood for the replacements. I took some 1/16" square basswood and passed it thru a drawplate to round off the edges. After painting and putting the nodes on they should match the rest of the material. Good luck with the canard. My parts requests have been 'processing' for since the end of November for the cockpit parts and mid-December for the cylinder. I hope that you get your parts quickly and don't need to experience such a delay. Greg Old Collingwood, mtaylor, Canute and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 4 Share #73 Posted February 4 Greg, Canard structure is done and nodes applied (half knotted light brown thread with a drop of CA. My modification to the rib jig by overbending the profile seemed to have worked OK as the profile shape stayed close to plan Fuselage Will finish off the canard next. Good luck getting your parts. Have you considered recreating the exhaust on the misformed carb with wire or tubing and CA? Haven't tried to tackle the carb distribution yet. George king derelict, Egilman, mtaylor and 8 others 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 5 Share #74 Posted February 5 Greg, I'm still working on the canard and humming along and am at the axis stage where I'm doing the nose and have run into a mystery. On page 30 in the instructions I've just bonded Cn 1 to the bamboo. Is this really a butt joint glued with CA? Doesn't seem very strong but that's what I've done. Tried to drill a 1mm hole into Cn1 where the bamboo butts so I could pin the joint for strength but the material is too hard for my small drill bits to make much of an impact. Also, what is Cn2? It doesn't appear on the metal parts page and your build doesn't seem to show it either. You are right about the instructions being somewhat sketchy. My bamboo treatment is the yellow ochre applied by hand using latex gloves where I dip my forefinger in the paint and rub it on after the nodes have been applied. This is followed by Diamond Glaze (by Judi-Kins available on Amazon) diluted with water to give it a slight sheen like bamboo. I like your bamboo finish which makes it looks like an aged bamboo that really looks authentic. George Egilman, mtaylor, Jack12477 and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 6 Author Share #75 Posted February 6 On 2/5/2024 at 2:18 PM, George Ramey said: Greg, I'm still working on the canard and humming along and am at the axis stage where I'm doing the nose and have run into a mystery. On page 30 in the instructions I've just bonded Cn 1 to the bamboo. Is this really a butt joint glued with CA? Doesn't seem very strong but that's what I've done. Tried to drill a 1mm hole into Cn1 where the bamboo butts so I could pin the joint for strength but the material is too hard for my small drill bits to make much of an impact. Also, what is Cn2? It doesn't appear on the metal parts page and your build doesn't seem to show it either. You are right about the instructions being somewhat sketchy. My bamboo treatment is the yellow ochre applied by hand using latex gloves where I dip my forefinger in the paint and rub it on after the nodes have been applied. This is followed by Diamond Glaze (by Judi-Kins available on Amazon) diluted with water to give it a slight sheen like bamboo. I like your bamboo finish which makes it looks like an aged bamboo that really looks authentic. George George - I did it as a butt joint as well - I added a fillet of CA between the three parts to reinforce the joint. Good question about the Cn2! I don't know, I just attached the nose to the Lt4 brass tubing (again with a butt joint). After the rigging lines were put in place I felt pretty good about the nose structure. I'm not familiar with the Diamond Glaze product - I hope you like the result you have gotten! Greg mtaylor, Old Collingwood, Egilman and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 6 Author Share #76 Posted February 6 George Thanks for sending the pics - looks really nice! Greg Egilman, Old Collingwood, Canute and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 6 Author Share #77 Posted February 6 Today I got notified that Model Expo has sent the replacement engine cylinder! I think I got their attention this weekend by asking for a store credit as I had nearly given up on ever seeing the replacement part. king derelict, mtaylor, Canute and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 7 Share #78 Posted February 7 I have a feeling that the Cn2 was replaced by Sup 1 and Sup2 on the fl08 laser sheet. Egilman, Canute, Old Collingwood and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 7 Author Share #79 Posted February 7 that would match well with the illustration mtaylor, Canute, Egilman and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 9 Share #80 Posted February 9 Forward part of the fuselage done and also the canard. Am working on the cockpit metal parts now and am mostly done with those. trying to figure out what to paint these bits since I'm sure they weren't made of the same material. After that the top part of the engine. getting close to fabbing the front cockpit bits like you did; don't want to have to cease work. A couple of more pics. Canute, Jack12477, Greg Davis and 6 others 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 10 Author Share #81 Posted February 10 Replacement cylinder arrived in the mail today! Time to get out a file to clean it up and then paint it to match the other seven that are already in place. hof00, GrandpaPhil, mtaylor and 7 others 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 16 Author Share #82 Posted February 16 A good portion of the engine is complete. Here it is sitting on the engine mounts, but not permanently attached. The fuel distribution system that goes on top still needs to be built. It needs to be attached after the engine is in place for good because there is not enough room to maneuver the complete structure in place. In fact there is a good deal of tipping and turning just to get this much of the power plant in. Old Collingwood, Jack12477, GrandpaPhil and 5 others 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 16 Share #83 Posted February 16 Oh my. I on the finishing stages of the engine build and am installing the plug wires. I'm using black thread instead of the thick beige stuff in the kit because it seemed to be too thick. Fuel distribution is complete so I'm worried about the engine installation. Do you think it is feasible to install the engine after the front cockpit structure and install the aft cockpit structure afterwards? I'm thinking I could splay the fuselage bamboo to install the engine and install the aft cockpit next. Your engine and cockpit area look great. I hope mine can look as good, Attached is an engine photo. Not real enthused about my fuel distribution installation. I made a jig to install the first two pipes based on measured dimensions on the two carbs farthest apart and installed that first. then each tube was individually fitted which required some tube trimming. The problem I discovered was that the carbs are not positively located on the block due to the very slight block counterbore so the carb cannot be really positively located. Also, there will be be slight clocking differences so that throws the pipe location slightly off. I made a crude engine stand out of scrap balsa which has helped working on the engine George mtaylor, GrandpaPhil, Jack12477 and 6 others 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 16 Author Share #84 Posted February 16 3 hours ago, George Ramey said: Oh my. I on the finishing stages of the engine build and am installing the plug wires. I'm using black thread instead of the thick beige stuff in the kit because it seemed to be too thick. Fuel distribution is complete so I'm worried about the engine installation. Do you think it is feasible to install the engine after the front cockpit structure and install the aft cockpit structure afterwards? I'm thinking I could splay the fuselage bamboo to install the engine and install the aft cockpit next. Your engine and cockpit area look great. I hope mine can look as good, Attached is an engine photo. Not real enthused about my fuel distribution installation. I made a jig to install the first two pipes based on measured dimensions on the two carbs farthest apart and installed that first. then each tube was individually fitted which required some tube trimming. The problem I discovered was that the carbs are not positively located on the block due to the very slight block counterbore so the carb cannot be really positively located. Also, there will be be slight clocking differences so that throws the pipe location slightly off. I made a crude engine stand out of scrap balsa which has helped working on the engine George Looking really nice! I would give your idea of putting the engine in place and then closing up / finishing the backend some thought. My initial thoughts considering the pro's and con's seem to be having to disassemble the fuel system vs having the backend of the plane heavy as you rig the undercarriage / complete the nacelle. I found that undercarriage rigging to be a little challenging because the brass turnbuckles are really fragile. I had to come at the work from a lot of angles and appreciated that the structure was light weight at the time. If you can get the fuel system off in one piece that may be the 'safest' way to go. Looks like we made similar engine stands! mtaylor, king derelict, Old Collingwood and 5 others 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 17 Share #85 Posted February 17 Greg I'm worried about trying to remove the distribution system since that process was a royal PIA. I'll study fitting as much as brass parts on the installed forward cockpit and installing as many aft cockpit brass on the loose aft cockpit where only the rigging is left. Could be a pipe dream though. My missing forward cockpit parts are due to arrive next Tuesday, a much better response than your carb. I guess they must have ordered a few since that was a common shortage. George Egilman, Old Collingwood, mtaylor and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 17 Author Share #86 Posted February 17 5 hours ago, George Ramey said: Greg I'm worried about trying to remove the distribution system since that process was a royal PIA. I'll study fitting as much as brass parts on the installed forward cockpit and installing as many aft cockpit brass on the loose aft cockpit where only the rigging is left. Could be a pipe dream though. My missing forward cockpit parts are due to arrive next Tuesday, a much better response than your carb. I guess they must have ordered a few since that was a common shortage. George George - Completely understandable - I totally understand where you are coming from! Good luck! I received the (no longer needed) cockpit parts in the mail today, so it will undoubtedly be the case that yours arrive soon. Greg Canute, Old Collingwood and mtaylor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 17 Author Share #87 Posted February 17 Yesterday I made a small jig to help assemble the fuel distributor. First I marked the pattern of where the parts would attach to the engine by placing a small sheet of vellum over the cylinders on my engine. I then taped the pattern to a piece of wood and drilled 1/16" holes where each tube would go. Figured out where each of the eight tubes were to fit (not quite the way the instructions seem to indicate). As with George's experience, the castings needed to be reduced a bit (close to 1mm) to fit the carburetor(?) correctly. Also it might be noted that for the pieces to come together correctly, the carburetor needs to be aligned with its casting molding line parallel to the engine block. At first I was going to put all 8 fuel tubes in place using the jig, but then I got worried about pulling the assembly free so I stopped at the four longest ones and waited overnight before extracting the assembly. I then fit this assembly to the top of the engine. Two of the fuel tubes needed to be shortened for the assembly to sit level on the four cylinders. I also needed to make a few small adjustments to get a better alignment of the tubes to the cylinders. Through a series of very small bends using two pairs of pliers I got everything to match as best possible. And just as George said - working on this assemble is a royal pain! At this point I decided to permanently attach the engine to the engine mounts and then attach the partial fuel system to the engine. I'll fit and install the remaining four tubes with this much in place. GrandpaPhil, Egilman, mtaylor and 6 others 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 21 Author Share #88 Posted February 21 Just finished installing the fueling tubes to the middle four cylinders - pretty tedious work. Now it needs some copper paint to be finished with the engine installation. wefalck, Diver, Paul Le Wol and 8 others 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Davis Posted February 24 Author Share #89 Posted February 24 (edited) The engine is done! The propeller shaft is attached now but the propeller will not be added until much later. A set of bamboo crossbeams need to be added near the front of the engine. These crossbeams can be seen in the following (interesting) picture were a hand cranked engine starting mechanism has been attached to the 14bis. Note, the crossbeams can be located on the big plan of the model, but are not mentioned in the instruction manual. They are shown in the pictures of the porotype model on the ME website: Edited February 24 by Greg Davis Jack12477, king derelict, Diver and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Ramey Posted February 25 Share #90 Posted February 25 Beautiful job, Greg. Really impressive build. Good catch on the extra crossbeams. I think I'm about a week behind. I decided not to assemble the forward and aft cockpits after the forward cockpit was installed on the fuselage as I previously proposed. Mine are now assembled, less the cross piece under the motor mount support as you suggested. Just attached the motor mounts and waiting for them to cure. Rather than disassemble the engine fuel distribution tubes from the motor to install it, I'm going to try mounting it on the mounts before sliding the cockpit assembly onto the four fuselage bamboo corners. I'll let you know if that works. George mtaylor, Jack12477, Canute and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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