Will Everard by Micklen32 - Billing Boats - 1:67

[popeye the sailor]

I have quite a few rolls of the billing's thread......after a few  'adjustments'  it starts to get rather fuzzy.   I'm not a big fan of bees wax either,  so I look for other alternatives.    the poly threads seem to work well for me.   some of the brass parts lead a lot to be desired as well.   I have not used their stanchions........are you going to drill a hole near the tip {or in the tip},  so you can install eyelets?'

[rjt]

Hi and you are doing a nice job considering the almost total lack of any use-able instructions.

Congratulations on your determined approach (I would have thrown the towel in long ago,    and would not touch a Billings kit now  .

However it may be helpful for you to look at the photographs on this website http://www.nationalhistoricships.org.uk/register/234/will  I know they are fairly modern but it would give you a good idea of the answers you need.  Particularly re. the davits etc.around the stern, note also the chain linkage from the steering gear to the rudder stock.

 

Meanwhile all the best, keep plugging steadily away and remember, it is a hobby not a race.  Stay well and enjoy the journey.

Kind regards from Rob in Oxfordshire (UK)

[Micklen32]

Ok I am here to get some ideas from you all

Firstly my main supplier is Cornwall Model Boats

They have a fair supply of rigging thread, but are a bit limited on colour

 

First regarding sizes, I was thinking of 0.1 for the ratlines and 0.25 for the rigging

Looking at the scale of 1:67 is that good or do I need a little thicker ?????

 

Next the colours

 

 

They seem to be limited in the smaller sizes to hemp and black

I couldn't find a brown

So what are your thoughts on this, both the size and colour

As to colour I err towards the hemp

As to size I just don't know which would be the correct sizes for the scale and there I would like a bit of help

I look forward to hearing from you   

 

 

Just to help you a bit, that white Billings stuff appears to about 0.5 but it is very loose and fluffy   

Edited February 2, 2014 by Micklen32

[Micklen32]

Did a few more hours on the Will

 

First things were two bits of wood that go the full width of the ship just off the deck

I am presuming they hold rigging as one has some eye bolts and a hook, the other just a hook 

 

They look like prime objects for tripping over   

Also somewhere in the parts list the name 'Horse' was mentioned

Does anyone know if that is what they are called ???

 

Then I made a couple of pulley systems

Looking at the plans these control the dropkeels

 

 

They took most of the time today

Tomorrow we have friends up for the day then Tuesday my day club

I MAY get some time Wednesday, if not it will be Thursday   

 

Don't forget to get back me about the rigging   

[Sjors]

Let me see ....

 

The colours are good.

That's one !

 

Second :

 

0.1 for the ratlines is very thin.

Also for the rigging.

I'm using 0.25 for the ratlines and 0.40 for the rigging.

But that's what I have.

Maybe one of the more experience builders can give yo an answer on that.

 

[sawdust]

Hello Mick,

Sorry for not responding to your thread sooner, but I have fallen victim to a bug. Head and bronchia full of snot, sneezing, running nose and watery eyes  not at all conducive to  examining plans, books or typing. All I want to do is sleep. I should have been consuming rum toddies  from the outset. but I fell victim to this during my sleep. 

The standing rigging on the Will Everard would have been multi stranded galvanised steel wire. Some of the running rigging would have been flexible steel wire  and the rest would be rope. Since the standing rigging would have been coated in Stockholm tar you  could certainly use black thread,  even though it may not be strictly accurate  I would use hemp coloured thread through out for ithe running rigging. You will also need some short lengths of chain. Did Mr. bIllings include chain  in the fittings kit.  The  things designed to trip you up are called Horses  And the fiitings which travel on them are the travellers. the devices you have assembled from the brass piece  are indeed the leeboard winches and they are used to hoist and drop the leeboards ( you called them  drop keels). They would most likely have been pained grey. I . have finally found a sketch which had previously eluded me and it shows a detachable handle which fits onto  the drum. so in all likelyhood the drums would have been on the inboard side of each winch This is contrary to my initial belief concerning removale handles..

 Incidentally the ratlines would have been steel wire  and hence could be smaller in diameter than one might expect. I am assuming  the rope sizes you quoted were in mm. If you need some rigging sizes  I can look through my information sources,  but I will be quoting circumferences in inches on a full size vessel so you will need to do some simple conversions and then compromise   to make your selection from sizes available.   if you want the size information get in touch and I will see what I can find when I am feeling better.

 I purchase rigging thread from Cornwall model boats , they have a good selection and the quality is better than the fuzzy stuff that Billings supplies, or have they improved?

 Kip

Edited February 3, 2014 by sawdust

[Micklen32]

Hi there

Was rushed into hospital Sunday night with a severe speech impediment

I am not going to run to deep into it here other than to say that an MRI scan found a lesion on my brain

 

I have had a Caring bridge web going giving the full story of my recent cancer problems

If you wish to visit the site and read the story and the things other people have also left as it were, could you please message me personally as I don't want everyone on there who just want a visit for the hell of it, I want people who WANT to read as it does go a little deep

 

Obviously I am not sure what the immediate future may hold, it could now involve quite quick surgery I may just disappear for a bit

 

Anyway back to the model and questions

 

So Sjors do you prefer the lighter Amati thread over the slightly darker Mantua hemp thread???

The sizes are certainly better

Are you that way inclined as well Kip???

Also Kip, the Billings thread is IMO a very poor thread that frays very quickly

 

Now Kip, regarding those leeboard winches

You are saying the drums are fitted inboard, opposite to how Billings show

I also had a problem with the cog as to which side it goes as in two different plans it was shown different ways, but that has been done now

So any help in any way will be very well received

Thanks everyone

Edited February 4, 2014 by Micklen32

[sawdust]

 Hello Mick, this too you will overcome!. I have sent you a pm.

 Regarding the Lee board winches my best source of information so far is Freeston and Kents book  "Modelling Thames sailing Barges".

  It included  amongst other things a drawing of  a leeboard winch taken from a  manufacturers catalog, a sketch of a leeboard winch and its separate handle and a series of  small b&w photos of Max Davey's model of the Kathleen.  These leeboard winches are relatively small probably  less than 2ft tall so as a detail in a small photo of a model is a little difficult to examine for smaller details like the drums ( probably less than 6" in diameter). After looking at the diagram and sketch and examining the photos with a magnifying glass I concluded  that  the  Leeboard winches are usually fitted with one drum and  handles are separate and only installed in use and on the drum side of the winch and the drums and handles would therefore be on the inboard side of the winch.   Since the winches are installed very near to the bulwarks this makes sense since the person operating the winch needs space to operate the handle and that in my opinion would only be possible if he were standing inboard of the winch.  I am not alone in my criticism in the quality of the instruction and detailed information supplied in Billings kits.

  I prefer the darker looking thread but I hate those flat spools and prefer to buy rigging thread on round spools in the longest length they supply. You can never have too much rigging thread.

 Kip

[popeye the sailor]

the only way I use the Billing's thread,  is to treat it with diluted white glue and stretch it until it dries.   for standing rigging,  I have stained it with India Ink and then treated it in the same manner....this seems to work well.  

 

I downloaded the plans for the Will.......I am used to Billing's plans,  as I have build a few of their kits.   I must say......I am in awe of what you are up against........vague......doesn't even describe it.   they must have a shortage of folks who can do a choreographic build log of the proto type.

 

sorry to hear of your recent condition.  know that there are folks here who care.....because of this site...we share a sense of closeness.  just because we are  'across the pond'  so to speak,   my thoughts are with you...I hope you fair well.  I hope you'll keep us up to date with how your doing.

[AndyG]

Also somewhere in the parts list the name 'Horse' was mentioned

Does anyone know if that is what they are called ???

 

Yes - these are sheet horses: it's a beam for a traveller (the metal hook) which carries a block for the sheet which runs to the bottom corner of the sail. It allows a better sail set when sailing close-hauled or running free.

 

Do, please, get on the mend quickly - and continue with the build when you're able!

 

Andy

[ferret]

Hi Mick from another new comer, I am also building the "Will" and not far behind you, so, have been following with interest.

Re your unidentified parts, post, 18th January, it is the engine throttle controland, if you look very carefully at drawing sheet 1, you will see a small square between the compass binicle and engine hatch, thats it.

It took me ages to find it and I haven't worked out how tall it should be yet, I guess a little taller than the compass.

Hope this helps as I agree with everyone elses views of Billings instructions.

Good luck with it and if I can help further I will jump in.

Also good luck with your health, I know how hard it can be.

[Micklen32]

Just to let you know I have decided to go forwards with surgery to remove what they can of the metastasis on my brain

This may happen quite quickly so I may disappear for a while soon but I hope to be able to let you know

 

My thing now is to get my mind off things so I hope working on the models will help

I will do more work on the Will tomorrow

It is actually looking very close now to starting the rigging and the masts and I do hope for a few pointers here If I can get them as the instructions are non existent

[egkb]

Hi Mick, some of the photos from those web sites should help sort the rigging ! just sing out and I'll do a bit of research at this end.

 

All the very best!

 

Eamonn

[ferret]

Hi Mick,

good to see you back for the moment, good luck with the op, like you say, ship building will hopefully take your mind off it until the time comes,which hopefully won't be too long and you'll be back fighting fit and building more.

So, to the rigging.

I hope to get the masts built up later today but am waiting for a new stock of cord to arrive before I can go much further.

However, I have been studying the rigging plan very carefully, talk about confusing, it seems either a big photo copier or an array of mirrors would be useful as you need to see both sides of the plan and the instructions at the same time.

I must say, this would have any beginner running for cover.

 

Good luck for now.

 

Ferret

[sawdust]

 Hello Mick,   sadly Billings are poor regarding instructions and the drawings impart little information when it comes to rigging. A good idea is to photocopy the rigging plan so you can mark up and include additional notes  such as color, size, how and were  a line terminates etc.. If I can be of any assistance please contact me.

 Kip

[sawdust]

 Hello Mick, just in case you haven't visited this site,this should take you to Ivor Bittle's site on model sailing barges

http//ivorbittle.co.uk/

 It contains useful information and a good section on standing rigging.

 Kip

[tomarack]

Hi Mick,

            greetings form Mid Europe... 

       I have to say, for the novice very  nice model, indeed (when remember my first efforts..)

       I can recommend Ivor Bittle  website too, maybe you can visit AMBO website..    

 

  http://barge.homeunix.org/index.php/home

 

       You find more infos a photos from building and rigging  of thames sailing barges.

     There you can find   interesdting booklet  about buliding barges too  (somewhat bigger, RC models in 1:24 scale )

 

      http://barge.homeunix.org/pdf/2012/Building_a_model_in_Wood_or_GRP.pdf

      

I wish you success      Tom

[edmay]

Hello Mick,I just love those beautifully painted river and canal barges,I will catch on your log but first,hope your feeling better.Eds recipe,vic rub on chest,a wee shot of tepid brandy(medisional) and hot tea with lemon ,honey,regards to the Admiral.Edwin

[GTM]

Hej Mick,

Sorry, Just found your "new" log and health state..

Hopefully your fine & everything goes well.. best wishes, Theo 

[Singing beak]

Hello, I have been reading your forum and have found it very useful; not the least is to find other people that have the same problems and uncertainties as me.
I bought my “Will” kit a few months ago and am slowly making some sort of sense of it. The hull is 90% complete but I have had to be a little too reliant on fillers and blobs of Araldite. I gleaned some information from: -http://www.tradboat2.co.uk/barges/bargephotos/bargephotocollection.htm
I shall continue to view this useful forum.

Singingbeak

[Anja]

Dear friends,

 

I am very saddened to write that our friend Mick passed away in the early hours of July 24th after a period of illness.

 

Eamonn (egkb) has opened a 'So long Mick' in the Shore Leave section.

Please join us there in offering his wife Elaine, family and friends our condolences.

 

Goodbye Mick, rest in peace.

Your are gone, but not forgotten.