hamilton Posted June 22, 2014 Share #1 Posted June 22, 2014 Hi there: I'm installing a margin plank in several sections, scarfed together. My question is whether there would have been visible trunnels at the scarf joints on the margin plank and if so, how they would be arranged. This is for the Fair Rosamund, 1831... Thanks in advance! hamilton Quote current builds: Corel HMS Bellona (1780); Admiralty models Echo cross-section (semi-scratch) previous builds: MS Phantom (scuttled, 2017); MS Sultana (1767); Corel Brittany Sloop (scuttled, 2022); MS Kate Cory; MS Armed Virginia Sloop (in need of a refit); Corel Flattie; Mamoli Gretel; Amati Bluenose (1921) (scuttled, 2023); AL San Francisco (destroyed by land krakens [i.e., cats]); Corel Toulonnaise (1823); MS Glad Tidings (1937) (in need of a refit); HMS Blandford (1719) from Corel HMS Greyhound; Fair Rosamund (1832) from OcCre Dos Amigos (missing in action); Amati Hannah (ship in a bottle); Mamoli America (1851); Bluenose fishing schooner (1921) (scratch); Off-Centre Sailing Skiff (scratch) under the bench: MS Emma C Barry; MS USS Constitution; MS Flying Fish; Corel Berlin; a wood supplier Colonial Schooner Hannah; Victory Models H.M.S. Fly; CAF Models HMS Granado; MS USS Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted June 22, 2014 Share #2 Posted June 22, 2014 The trunnels would have been no more visible on the margin plank than anywhere else on the deck. Russ hamilton 1 Quote T'aint a hobby if you hurry Completed projects Cross section model by Russ 1/48 scale Biloxi schooner model restoration 1/24 scale Biloxi oyster skiff 1/24 scale Biloxi schooner 1/48 scale POB Current project Biloxi lugger Captain Roy 1/48 scale POB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share #3 Posted June 22, 2014 Hi Russ: Thanks for the response, but this doesn't really solve my issue - are you saying there are no trunnels (or treenails) visible anywhere on deck or that the scarfs should be trunnelled the same way as the joints between the deck planks? Sorry if I'm being thick - I've just seen many modellers adding treenails to their decks.... hamilton Quote current builds: Corel HMS Bellona (1780); Admiralty models Echo cross-section (semi-scratch) previous builds: MS Phantom (scuttled, 2017); MS Sultana (1767); Corel Brittany Sloop (scuttled, 2022); MS Kate Cory; MS Armed Virginia Sloop (in need of a refit); Corel Flattie; Mamoli Gretel; Amati Bluenose (1921) (scuttled, 2023); AL San Francisco (destroyed by land krakens [i.e., cats]); Corel Toulonnaise (1823); MS Glad Tidings (1937) (in need of a refit); HMS Blandford (1719) from Corel HMS Greyhound; Fair Rosamund (1832) from OcCre Dos Amigos (missing in action); Amati Hannah (ship in a bottle); Mamoli America (1851); Bluenose fishing schooner (1921) (scratch); Off-Centre Sailing Skiff (scratch) under the bench: MS Emma C Barry; MS USS Constitution; MS Flying Fish; Corel Berlin; a wood supplier Colonial Schooner Hannah; Victory Models H.M.S. Fly; CAF Models HMS Granado; MS USS Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted June 22, 2014 Share #4 Posted June 22, 2014 If you want to add trunnels that is fine. On a real deck, they are not really that visible. On a model it is a personal choice to add them or not. Russ Quote T'aint a hobby if you hurry Completed projects Cross section model by Russ 1/48 scale Biloxi schooner model restoration 1/24 scale Biloxi oyster skiff 1/24 scale Biloxi schooner 1/48 scale POB Current project Biloxi lugger Captain Roy 1/48 scale POB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbot Posted June 22, 2014 Share #5 Posted June 22, 2014 To me adding trunnels is a personal choice. Ona real vessel they are easy to miss. On a model if not donw prooperly they detract fom the model. Many modlers put them in and they ad a maritime measels effect. They are either to big or n ot in contrast with the deck. David B hamilton 1 Quote Work in progress USS Maine in cardstock.http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7446-uss-maine-by-dgbot-hmv-card/#entry220003 Completed Blockade runner Teazer http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6063-blockade-runner-teazer-by-dgbot-card-stock/#entry175967 Completed The Monitor Lehigh http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/6920-the-monitor-lehigh-by-dgbot-card-model/#entry203680 Completed Kingston Class MCVD http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/forum/10-kit-build-logs-in-progress/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanyed Posted June 22, 2014 Share #6 Posted June 22, 2014 Hamilton, What scale is your Fair Rosamund? Trennals (trunnels, treenails, trenails, tomato, tomahto) for the deck planks were relatively small. In addition, they were often seated below the surface of the deck planks then capped with a wooden cover piece so the end grain of the trennal was not exposed. If you are at 1/4 scale and you want to use and show treenails, go for it. They were probably no more than an inch diameter or less. The smallest hole on my Byrnes draw plate is needed to get this small. Not an easy task, even using bamboo. If I was building at 1/8 scale, I would not show them as I have no way of making them small enough. 3/16 is a close call but doable (look at Ed Tosti's Naiad build log for evidence.) IMHO, out of scale trunnels and hatch gratings are the easiest way to ruin the look of an otherwise fine model. Allan hamilton 1 Quote PLEASE take 30 SECONDS and sign up for the epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series. Click on http://trafalgar.tv There is no cost other than the 30 seconds of your time. THANK YOU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
augie Posted June 22, 2014 Share #7 Posted June 22, 2014 Based on the plans for my current build (Passaro Confederacy 1:64), treenails run across the margin planks in line with the butt planking for the deck planks. I would think that, at your scale of 1:53, including them would be most reasonable if that's your preference. Quote Augie Current Build: US Frigate Confederacy - MS 1:64 Previous Builds : US Brig Syren (MS) - 2013 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Greek Tug Ulises (OcCre) - 2009 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Victory Cross Section (Corel) - 1988 Essex (MS) 1/8"- 1976 Cutty Sark (Revell 1:96) - 1956 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muzzleloader Posted June 22, 2014 Share #8 Posted June 22, 2014 Hamilton This is the deck of the D. Fernando II e Gloria built in the 1830's she is in Lisbon. That's my size 8 in the picture. mtaylor and hamilton 2 Quote Current build Dom Fernando II E Gloria crossection Finished boats Portuguese Caravel Artenaval Yacht Mary Mamoli Mayflower M.S. H.M.S. Unicorn Corel Whaleboat Marine Model Co. Swift A.L. America (solid hull) Marine Model Co. Albatros Mantua U.S.S. Constitution Revell Spanish Galleon Revell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share #9 Posted June 22, 2014 Well it seems I'll have to give it some thought. I added treenails to my 1:25 scale Glad Tidings pinky schooner, but at that scale they looked appropriate. At 1:53 (a little smaller than 1/4) it might not be doable. I certainly want to avoid a pock marked deck....at the same time, if I can fashion a small enough treenail and if, once the deck is finished, they blend in well, I may go for it....I'll probably do a series of tests before finalising the decision anyway. Thanks all for the input and for the nice photos! hamilton Quote current builds: Corel HMS Bellona (1780); Admiralty models Echo cross-section (semi-scratch) previous builds: MS Phantom (scuttled, 2017); MS Sultana (1767); Corel Brittany Sloop (scuttled, 2022); MS Kate Cory; MS Armed Virginia Sloop (in need of a refit); Corel Flattie; Mamoli Gretel; Amati Bluenose (1921) (scuttled, 2023); AL San Francisco (destroyed by land krakens [i.e., cats]); Corel Toulonnaise (1823); MS Glad Tidings (1937) (in need of a refit); HMS Blandford (1719) from Corel HMS Greyhound; Fair Rosamund (1832) from OcCre Dos Amigos (missing in action); Amati Hannah (ship in a bottle); Mamoli America (1851); Bluenose fishing schooner (1921) (scratch); Off-Centre Sailing Skiff (scratch) under the bench: MS Emma C Barry; MS USS Constitution; MS Flying Fish; Corel Berlin; a wood supplier Colonial Schooner Hannah; Victory Models H.M.S. Fly; CAF Models HMS Granado; MS USS Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted June 22, 2014 Share #10 Posted June 22, 2014 The 'treenails' in the D. Fernando II e Gloria are probably side-grain plugs over nails or spikes. You would not want end-grain wood on deck: moisture will wick in and promote rot in short order. Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted June 22, 2014 Share #11 Posted June 22, 2014 I have seen where, in more wooden built ships, they used wood plugs over the counter sunk spike or nail and the grain of the plug ran the same as that of the surrounding deck planks. Russ Quote T'aint a hobby if you hurry Completed projects Cross section model by Russ 1/48 scale Biloxi schooner model restoration 1/24 scale Biloxi oyster skiff 1/24 scale Biloxi schooner 1/48 scale POB Current project Biloxi lugger Captain Roy 1/48 scale POB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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