AntonyUK

Thanks to Zoran, Antony, Nils and all the other users who appreciate my wip of this intriguing model . . thanks again. Jack.

Welcome to MSW.
Looking forward to seeing your selection .
Brillint.
 
Regards Antony.

Welcome to MSW.
Looking forward to seeing your selection .
Brillint.
 
Regards Antony.

Hi Jack.
Stunning workmanship. 
Real nice progress throughout the build.
Nice attention to details and the little bit you are puttng into the ship.
 
Regards Antony.

Hi Kevin.
Fantastic build. The use of so many different building materials makes this a intresting build for me.
Lots of real nice details you have added and the shear size makes this a real display model.
With your skill's building the launcher will not be too much of a challenge. Make a jig for the frame work as you will need 6 off the same if I remember correctly.  With slight modes to each frame. Go for it..
 
Will you keep her ?  You might need a extension built. 
Late I know But I gonna follow along with your excellent build.
 
Regards Antony.
 

Monday 4th December 2017
 
The weather is definitely getting cold and working in the cold of my garage is not the best . . but the passion and, above all, the wish to see some few planking installed made me overcome this difficulty . . as long as it lasts . . 
 
As anticipated I started "to warm up the tires" by applying few planks in the upper part of the forecastle: first there is an area of 5/6 perfectly straight planking followed by a larger area of planks, previously bent, which connects to the real stem.
 
To bend the strips, in limewood 1.5 x 5mm, I used the method of the iron can and the candle, a method that I learned to master at the time of the model of the 12 Apostles and I find it very simple and practical.
 
From now on I could start to apply the planking on the whole hull, but first I still have to refine  and get ready the stern area, in particular with regard to the well known bevel angle.
 
Below, the usual roundup of images, see you soon, Jack.

01 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182034.jpg

02 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182053.jpg

03 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182114.jpg

04 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182252.jpg

05 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182309.jpg

06 Ragusian Carrack/04122017/IMG_20171204_182327.jpg

Thanks, Bob!
 
I planked the hold up to the deck clamps for the orlop deck. I added thick stuff at the approximate locations of the futtock joints. I alsp started planking the outer hull. The inner planking is European beech, the outer hull planking is swiss pear. The limber boards are fitted but not yet installed.

Got a little more done today.  I milled my own keelson and deck clamps out of European beech and installed them.  Next is planking the hold.  I'll use beech and include thick stuff as well as footwaling.  I also plan limber boards and a well and shot locker.  This may be a bit challenging at what is essential 1/8" scale.

I finished gluing up all 5 pair of half frames. There are spacers between each one, and because of all the end grain butt joints, I elected to use 5 minute epoxy to glue the frame assembly together. I used 6 small machinist's squares to keep the glue up straight and perpendicular. There will be minimal fairing, because most of the spacers fit inside the profile of the frames. I will have to fit the keelson and that will require a little trimming of the notches, but nothing major. The outboard surface will need almost no fairing, since the frames are identical.

Bellona was built in 1760 but didn't get her bottom coppered until 1780. I think I'll use a stylized color scheme: Swiss pear below the wales, rosewood for the wales and rails, boxwood for the outboard planking above the wales (usually painted ochre) and bloodwood for the inner bulwark planking. Deck framing will be European beech wood and the decks, holly/

Welcome to MSW.
Looking forward to seeing your selection .
Brillint.
 
Regards Antony.

My respect, colleagues!
We are pleased to be on this forum in a new status.
I am very glad that there will be a joint project between our companies and development teams.
I hope it will be interesting and productive!
 
Eugeny Mikhailov,
kits developer
"MasterKorabel"

Please give our latest sponsor, Master Korabel a warm welcome.  You can see their banner on our forum.  Click over to their website and check out their kits and other offerings.  I will also let you folks know that MK and Syren Ship Model Company are in discussions to create a collaborative project together.  One that will show how two similar companies from across the world can partner to develop projects and offerings together.  Stay tuned for more details as this develops.
 
Please give them a warm welcome.
 
Chuck
 

Hi Nils.
Regarding the amount of oars men.
"By the early 16th century states and navies grew and required more men. They used more and more unskilled slaves and prisoners. The Venetians designed a new system "alla senzile”: 3 to 5 men per bench, handling one large oar. Only the lead rower needed to be skilled, the others just followed his move. This allowed larger ships, but the side men were much less effective. Maximum speed dropped from some 6 to 4 Knot (more or less: a much discussed topic), as compared with 9-10 Knots maximum for ancient triremes (cf. Olympia's trials). The "senzile" system was soon adopted by all Mediterranean nations, and older galleys were reequipped that way."
 
This is from http://www.cogandgalley.com/2009/02/16th-to-18th-century-chebec.html
this is the only article I know off.
 
Regards Antony.
 

Hi Mike.
This is a very nice kit.. and you have made a excellent start to the build.
I will grab my chair and await the next scene.
All the best with this fabulous boat.
 
Regards Antony.

Eric,
Some interesting comments.
You're probably correct about the low rate of fire. I don't think these ironclads often, if ever, intentionally engaged in broadsides with other vessels but were used mostly for bombardment of inland targets. The bow armor was 25-inches thick combination of solid wood and 2.5-inches thick iron plates. Their limited side casement armor only covered their mid-ship boiler and engine sections. All of their gun port lids were only 2.5" thick oak with no armor cladding at all.  Most of their heaviest cannon were located in the bow casement gunports which had a little more room to retract their guns for reloading, however I've never seen any detailed reports on their battle practices. As for deck wear, I'm sure you're right, but these ironclads were originally built as an emergency stop-gap and weren't expected to last very long anyway. I think they were much more successful than expected, largely because the Confederate Navy didn't have any counterpart on the rivers at that time.
I do agree they must have used a chute for coaling especially if the coaling facility was compatible. The main coal bunker scuttle was on the boat centerline, about 25-feet from the side casement and nearest gun port which had a 2-foot high sill. A chute this long wouldn't have much of an angle decline to help feed the coal along. The single scuttle for each of side coal bunkers is closer to a gunport but is against the wall behind the cannon. I've read somewhere that coaling was sometimes done thru a gunport but then transported further with buckets, but am not sure this was the standard practice or just in an emergency. It would probably be easier to just use a chute thru the gunport to dump the coal onto the gundeck and then shovel it thru the scuttle into the side bunkers.
 
johnhoward

Model Enthusiasts,
While building our detailed model of the "USS St. Louis" ironclad, two problems about its basic design have consistently bothered us: 1) How did a crew of 175 access the upper (Hurricane) deck ?,  and 2) How were stores, equipment and  provisions loaded into the cramped spaces of the lower hull?.  Attached are a few contemporary photographs of "City Class" Ironclads and comparable photos of our model which better illustrate this issue. The existing drawings of "City Class" ironclads only show a single hatchway in the Hurricane deck with a ladder down to the gun deck but it is inside of the pilothouse which has no exit onto the deck itself. There are several "so-called skylights" on the Hurricane deck but only the 4' x 6' opening at the front of this deck is usable, but it is directly above the center bow casement cannon. The large "skylight" over the boilers is really an iron grate covered exhaust ventilator, and the other 2 openings are over the "Pittman" Arms and paddle wheel bellcranks. None of them have ladders or stairways. The most obvious access to the Hurricane deck would be thru open gunports onto the fore & aft decks and then up ladders on the fore & aft casements. The Captains access from his quarters on the gun deck to the Hurricane deck would evidently be thru a stern casement open gunport onto the stern deck and up a ladder on the stern casement! You can imagine the difficulty frequent coaling resupply operations with these limitations. Obviously the Hurricane deck is only an unarmored wood beam structure which could be modified for better access but since none of it survived the USS Cairo recovery in 1963, we have no idea what it may have contained.
We have unsuccessfully researched this issue including the USS St. Louis log book (quasi-diary) for a better understanding and would appreciate any feedback you can provide.
 
johnhoward
 

Attached are a few recent photos depicting further progress on the wheelhouse and the framing for the ironclad starboard and aft casements. We are now starting the initial planning for modeling of the two main steam engines.
 
johnhoward

Pat,
The twin rudders are surprisingly heavy especially in relation to their surprisingly flimsy looking tillers, but are based on their actual remains, recovered with the "USS Cairo" in 1963. Even so, they were reportedly relatively ineffective in controlling the ironclad on the rivers.
 
johnhoward

Sorry we haven't posted anything for the last few months (due to computer problems) but we continue to make good progress on our "USS St. Louis" Civil War Ironclad project as evidenced by the attached recent photos. The paddlewheel is nearly complete and we are finishing up the "Hurricane" deck elements and starboard side deck planking; much of the port side will remain un-planked to expose the model sub-structure and internal components. We are now concentrating on the fore, aft, & side casements, after-which the Hurricane deck and its temporary aluminum support frame will be removed for completion of the gun deck.
 I hope to be able to provide more details soon.
 
johnhoward 

Attached are photos of our "USS St. Louis" ironclad flue type boilers/firebox and exhaust plenum recently completed by Bill. This model represents our reconstruction of the complete boiler arrangement for a typical Western River steamboat from about 1840 onward and was sized for our ironclad from the 5 boilers, steam drum, one of the mud drums, a few of the valves and 2 firebox doors actually recovered with the "USS Cairo" in 1963.   The remaining more fragile elements such as the sheet metal covered firebrick bridge and sheet metal exhaust plenum apparently didn't survive or couldn't be reassembled.
The model consists of a wood sub-structure covered by embossed metal foil sheathing and cast firebox doors with added individual relief and mud drum clean-out valves, all primed, painted and highlighted to correctly represent its exterior surfaces. High pressure steam from these boilers is fed to the two single cylinder main steam engines, the "Doctor" main auxiliary steam engine and another auxiliary steam engine which powered the capstan.
 
johnhoward

Attached are today's progress  photos for our USS St. Louis ironclad model which include installation of the fore and aft deck margin planks and a dry-fit of the hurricane deck "ventilation" grate. It should be noted that, on most "City Class" ironclad models and drawings, this grate is erroneously fabricated as, or referred to as, a "skylight", similar to the small glass paneled skylight in the far forward part of this deck.
Besides the fact that the only objects beneath this grating are the five hot boilers enclosed by louvered walls, which wouldn't particularly benefit from any great amount of light, Samuel M. Pook's original gunboat specifications for the "Hurricane" deck states as follows:  [Quoted from the NPS Vicksburg Historic Structural Report(HSR)]
"There shall be an opening in this deck eight feet wide fore and aft the boat for ventilation; a coaming will be formed around this opening three inches above the deck and six inches thick; there will also be a center piece of the same height fore and aft the opening, over each beam a thwartship piece will be fitted and fastened to the beam; the whole will then be covered with grating."
 
For our 1:24 scale model this ventilation grate is fabricated from pearwood frames and "1/8-inch hardware cloth" (galvanized wire grating) which could be walked upon, if necessary. The grate will ultimately be fastened atop the Hurricane" deck planking. In actual practice, this grating would ventilate the excessive lower deck boiler heat. Awnings were fitted above this deck, primarily for protection from the sun in the Southern USA, but would also provide protection from excessive rain. All of the other 16+ small gundeck access/ventilation openings will be similarly covered with 1/8-inch grating and wood panels. The fore & aft deck margin planks will either be "nibbed" for the deck planks, or the deck planks themselves will be beveled in accordance with standard shipbuilding practice.
 
johnhoward
 

Attached are recent photos of activity on our USS St. Louis ironclad model. The first 2 show the structural framing for the aft Hurricane deck house with a prototype sliding window. A more delicate & realistic version of this window is under construction. The forward deckhouse and four smaller sheds are also under construction and will complete this structural assembly  The purpose of this dry-fit was to verify its mate-up with the wheelhouse arch. The starboard side will eventually be completely planked while the port side will remain unplanked similar to the wheelhouse..
The other photo is a dry-fit of a prototype 32-pdr cannon & carriage at one of the port side gun ports. It is resting on a small temporary section of gundeck planking.  The cannon barrel is Bob's 3D printer version which will be replaced by Tom's brass machining, currently in work The purpose of this dry-fit was to verify structural clearances including the gun port sill which was 24" above the deck. This side of the model will remain relatively open to reveal the structure while the starboard side will be completely finished
 
johnhoward

Attached are photos of recent activity covering the planning for items to be located on the Hurricane deck for our model of the City-Class Ironclad, "USS St. Louis"..
The first photo depicts a mock-up of the port side "Hog Chain" (Cable) which runs from the forward hull floor frame at station #73, over the two support posts (which extend down to the outboard keels) and then aft down to the hull floor frame at station #21. The mock-up rods will eventually be replaced by continuous cables for the port and starboard "Hog Chains". The "Hog Chains" were obviously required to help support the aft twin hull booms which straddle the paddlewheel and tended to "hog" due to insufficient buoyancy. The path of these "chains" through the lower hull framing is amazingly tight but tends to verify the accuracy of the hull framing drawings.
The second photo represents the first step in a layout of the aft Hurricane deck-house which is incorrectly depicted in most of the existing "USS Cairo" drawings and models because they lack the deck-house roof camber and the Hurricane deck camber. The Hurricane deck camber is already included and when the roof camber is added to this layout, it will clearly intersect the straight ridged wheelhouse roof in an arc (in its plan view) instead of a straight line. In addition, the twin stern facing doors will be replaced by two smaller sliding windows which are all clearly visible in contemporary photos of the "USS St. Louis" (Baron DeKalb).
 
johnhoward