daveward
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Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Here's the link to my build log, as promised: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13171-lady-nelson-by-daveward-amativictory-models-164-scale-first-wooden-ship-build/ Thanks again for all the advice! -
This log will document my progress as I build the Amati/Victory Models Lady Nelson. I've always wanted to build a wooden ship model, but I've never had the time. Now that I'm finally out of school, it's time to get started! I've done a good amount of research before starting this build, but I'm sure I'll have some questions for the experienced and knowledgeable members of this forum as I make my way through the build. Thank you in advance for your help! I'm going to do my best to take as many closeup photos of the process as I can. Perhaps they will be helpful to other modelers in the future! So, let's get started! After taking a look through the kit and getting acquainted with the instructions (which are basic), I sat down at my workspace with the sheet containing the bulkheads: First, I numbered all of the bulkheads, based on the plans. Then, I cut them out using my X-Acto. The cutting left some rough remnants of the tabs that held the pieces into their sheets: So, I sanded these smooth with my sanding stick: The final bulkhead/transom sits at an angle in the center keel: This piece had to be beveled to match the angle of the center keel: Here it is, sitting flush with the center keel: Next came the fairing of the fore and aft bulkheads. I did this before I glued anything in place, as it made the process easier. I fit the bulkheads in the center keel and bent a plank around them to get a feel for the required curvature, then filed by hand: Here is the second bulkhead fitted in the center keel, with its bevel on the forward edge: Here is the foremost bulkhead, with its extreme bevel: I test fit each bulkhead, marking each with the letters "F" and "A" to represent the fore side and aft sides, respectively:
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NMBROOK, the ship I'll be building is the Amati/Victory Models Lady Nelson. mtaylor, I am definitely planning on using sheetwood so that I can utilize as much of the material as possible. I appreciate the tip on the wood source, but I didn't see any sheets offered at 1 mm thickness (a problem I have encountered with many domestic wood suppliers). However, I have been in communication with Jason at Crown Timberyard, and I'm planning on purchasing my wood from him. I hear that he does quality work, and I'm happy to support a member of the forum! As soon as I can figure out a decent estimate on how much wood I need, I'll get started!
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Thanks for the quick reply, Nigel. However, I'm trying to figure out the total number of sheets I'll need. The kit comes with (40) 5 mm planks, and (50) 4 mm planks. So, that's exactly 200 mm worth of material for each layer of planking. I was wondering if there might be a ballpark figure that I can multiply this by in order to find out how much I'll need, in total. For instance, I could go with 400 mm or 600 mm (2X or 3X width). Any suggestions?
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I am about to order some sheets of wood for my upcoming build, which will be planked using the spiling method. My kit came with first-layer planks that are 5 mm wide, and second-layer planks that are 4 mm wide. I want to order enough material, so I'm wondering how much wider my raw material should be in order to properly cut out the curved planks. I have heard some people say that they used planks that were 50% wider than the originals, but this still seems a little narrow to me. Can anyone give me some advice as to what width I should be ordering, based on the widths supplied with the kit? Thanks!
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Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
I will certainly post a link when I get the build log up and running! By the way, it's nice to see a fellow Texan here! I just recently moved up to Wisconsin for work, but Texas is still "home!" -
Spiling Tools and Questions
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Mike, you raise some good points! When you get right down to it, spiling is definitely the best way to go. While you end up purchasing extra wood, the freedom it provides you with regard to crafting your own planks to the exact dimensions you need in any situation is invaluable. For my first project, I'll be building the Amati/Victory Models Lady Nelson. I think it will provide an excellent starting point for me in this hobby. It's got a double-planked POB hull, a few guns, and some nice rigging, with some interesting deck furniture. Since this will be my first build, I wanted to get as much information as possible on this specific model before I began working on it. I've checked out the build logs for this kit, as well as a variety of planking/spiling guides. I also purchased the tutorial DVDs for this model from Lauck Street Shipyard. While they were expensive, I thought they would give me a good idea of how to approach this particular model, while helping me to build skills that I can apply to future projects. The DVDs have been interesting -- I've picked up a number of tips/tricks that will help me throughout the process. However, the majority of the techniques used in the videos are done by eye, or based on "experience," and I've always preferred to use exact, repeatable methods using measurements and planning (I am a scientist, after all). Regardless, the DVDs have been helpful in that they have either given me techniques to use for my build, or allowed me to see what I would do differently than the way it was done in the videos. So, with the research I've done thus far, as well as the opportunity to draw on the wealth of knowledge brought to the table by the many experienced builders on this forum, I feel that I am well-prepared for the project! -
Spiling Tools and Questions
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Thanks for the tips, guys! I will probably try out a number of different techniques before I settle on the one that's right for me. Spiling each plank for my first build is probably a lofty goal, but I've always been the type of person who loves a challenge. I think I can accomplish it if I take my time and work slowly and patiently. Based on the way I want to do my planking, I imagine I'll be working at a pace of 1-2 planks per night. My plan is to take my measurements, cut out the spiled plank, trim it, and do a test fitting before putting a small bevel on the top edge so that everything fits perfectly, making fine adjustments and rechecking as necessary. Next, I'll soak the plank, bend it around the bulkheads, and clamp it in place. I'll let it dry and take shape, then come back and do a final fitting check before gluing it in place with Titebond III. It will take me a long time to get finished, but I'm confident that this method will provide the most aesthetically pleasing results. I'll be starting a build log here on the forum, so feel free to follow along! Thanks again, and good luck with your builds! -
Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Thanks, guys! I appreciate all the good advice! This forum has been wonderful to me so far -- of the many forums for my various hobbies in which I've posted, this has to be one of the friendliest. I had planned from the beginning to start a build log here on the site. I'll try to tear myself away from building for a few moments to take some pictures of the process. I'm planning on taking a very slow and methodical approach to my build. Based on the way I want to do my planking, I imagine I'll be doing 1-2 planks per night. I want to get all my measurements, cut out the plank, trim it, and get a tiny bevel on the top edge so that everything fits perfectly. Then, I'll soak it, bend it around the bulkheads, and clamp it in place. I'll let it dry and take shape, then come back and do a final fitting check before gluing it in place with my Titebond III. It will take me a long time to get finished, but I think this method will provide the most aesthetically pleasing results. I know that patience is key in a hobby like this! I'll try to take some nice closeups of the different steps I'm taking -- perhaps they'll help out other modelers in the future! Anyway, my kit will be arriving at my front door this afternoon, so hopefully I'll be able to get some of the bulkheads fitted tonight. I can't wait to get started! Thanks again for all the help, and good luck on your builds! -
Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
For now, I'm holding off on the scroll saw. I want to see how easily I can cut out my spiled planks by hand before I make that decision. Given how thin my sheetwood will be, I should be able to cut out the rough shape of each plank with an X-acto, filing and sanding it into its final shape. In the meantime, however, I am adding a few more tools to my collection. Here they are: Dremel 3000, with attachments 1" Spring clamps Small trigger clamps Larger sanding sticks Sanding sponges Extra X-Acto blades I've been putting off getting a Dremel for WAY too long. There have been so many time when one would have come in handy. Between modeling, household repairs, and gunsmithing, I'll always have a use for this thing! I'm primarily going to use the trigger clamps for holding the end of my plywood bulwarks in position around the front of the bow while my glue dries. I can put one of the jaws in a hatch opening in the false deck and the other up against the outer face of the bullwark and hold it down nicely. As for the sanding sticks, I currently have regular thin cardboard-style emery boards. I want to get some of the foam-type nail files, which should work better. I think I'm going to go with sanding sponges over an angled sanding block for sanding the hull. I had originally wanted to find a Mini Sander from ADC, but I think the sanding sponges will work just as well for sanding the various curves I'll encounter. I'll probably get them in 100-150 grit, and maybe 220 grit or finer if I can find them. As for the X-acto blades, I think for now I'll stick with #11, #18, and #22. These are the blades I feel I'll be using most often. My kit arrives tomorrow, so I'm getting excited! All of my preparation thus far has been based on the research I've done and the tools I see builders use most often (as well as the helpful advice from all of you!). I have tried to walk through the steps of the first portion of the build (hull construction and planking) in my mind, making a note of which tools I'd probably need. My goal was to first acquire the tools that I was certain I'd need beforehand in order to do a good job, adding additional pieces when they became necessary. So far, I think I have laid a good foundation. I can't wait to get started! Thanks again, everyone! -
Spiling Tools and Questions
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Haha, alde, I sent the same message to Chuck! I'm sure he gets that a lot... I think I might try using masking tape, as I have some that is 3" wide, and it's low-tack. My only problem is that it's not clear, so I won't be able to mark the bulkhead locations very easily. I feel like I'd get more accurate results by actually rubbing the pencil lead against the edge of the plank to trace the curve, as opposed to tracing the curve by eye using a sharpie. In Chuck's guide, he mentions a 3" wide Scotch tape that you can write on in pencil, but I can't seem to find anything like that anywhere... As far as I know, Scotch only makes their "Magic" tape in the thin widths commonly used in offices. If I find that I can't make the bulkhead marks, I'll probably switch over to some wide packing tape that I can see through. Mike, holding the plank down along the curve while tracing was my big concern... I'm just not sure that I could do it well enough, and I had a feeling that bending a full-width, untapered plank around the bulkheads for tracing would be a little awkward for me. My kit arrives tomorrow, so I'm still in the planning stages. Everything so far is just theoretical. I'll have a much better idea of what will and won't work when I get the center keel and bulkheads assembled and faired! -
Spiling Tools and Questions
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
All good points, Mike! I'm still on the fence about the ruler... It seems like a good idea, but I like the fact that the ship's curves never change their shape. I worry that the flexible ruler might get a subtle wave in it somewhere along the curve and cause problems with the fit. I, too, was worried about the scroll saw being a little too much for thin wood like that. I had already made up my mind to take a shot at cutting the planks out using an X-Acto before deciding if I wanted to spend the money on a scroll saw. I didn't think it would be too bad, given how thin the wood will be. I'm also sure that my wife would be happier if I didn't walk through the door with a power tool that we'd have to find a place to store! I have a good compass, and I had given some thought to using the method that you suggested, so maybe I'll give that a shot. Did you just bend the wider plank around the hull and trace the curve of the previous plank onto the wide one? Most of the time I see people using a piece of card stock to trace the curve onto (which, again, would have to be laid across the planks properly, I'm assuming). Jud, I took a look at the flexible ruler you mentioned when I was at a craft store a few days ago. I think those are the kind that have a metal core and a flexible material on the outside. I didn't purchase it because, since they require you to "shape" the curve yourself, they might be prone to developing tiny bends somewhere along the length that might create a less than perfect curve... I'm still not sure how big of a concern that is. I read a review somewhere that stated that the ACU-ARC is less likely to do this, based on its different construction. -
I agree, reklein! Spiled planks tend to look amazing, and that's what I want! I also think it will feel great to look at the hull of the ship when it's done and know that I hand-crafted each plank. That would certainly be something of which to be proud! It's going to take a lot longer, but I'm happy to take my time and get superior results rather than finishing quickly and getting something that doesn't completely please me.
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So, I've made the decision to spile all the planks for my upcoming build, as I love the look and fit of spiled planks. I'll basically be cutting each plank from a piece of sheetwood, by hand. While I will be using masking tape to trace the curve of the last plank in order to trace out my spiled plank, I'm still going to need a way to smoothly connect the dots that mark the widths of the proposed plank at each bulkhead on the other side, to complete the outline of the plank. Many people use's a set of ship's curves for this purpose, but I've been looking at the ACU-ARC adjustable curve ruler as an alternative. It looks like this: Basically, it consists of a number of flexible plastic strips bunched together. You can flex the ruler to meet the points you've marked and it will hold its shape due to the friction between the strips. You then simply trace along the flat edge to make your line. I'm wondering if this might be a better choice, since it will provide a nice smooth curve from start to finish, rather than using the traditional method of finding the best fit for a portion of the points with a ship's curve and repeating the process until the line is complete. What do you guys think? Also, one of the things I'm worried about is not currently owning a scroll saw... As it is, my only option seems to be cutting the rough shape of each plank out of the thin sheetwood using an X-Acto blade, then filing/sanding to the final shape. How easy do you think this will be with basswood and walnut sheetwood ranging from 1/32" to 1/16" thick? If I do decide to purchase a scroll saw, what type of blade should I get to smoothly cut sheetwood in this thickness range? I'm assuming I'd be looking for one with a high number of teeth-per-inch. Do you guys have any suggestions for the proper TPI range? My last question refers to the method of laying the tape in order to trace the correct curve of the last plank. I've read some descriptions of this process (and seen a few pictures), but I want to make sure I have this right. The correct method, as I understand it, is to lay the tape so that the portion of the tape that is laying on the existing plank is smooth, with no wrinkles or bends. The other edge of the tape (i.e., the portion that's hanging over the edge of the existing plank) can be a little wrinkled without affecting the accuracy of the curve you're tracing. Is that right? I've tested this method on the rim of a glass that is wider at the mouth than at the base, and I ended up with a nice curved strip that wrapped around the glass and was perfectly parallel to the rim of the glass, so it seems to be a good way of doing it. What do you guys think? As always, thanks for your advice, opinions, and assistance!
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Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Just out of curiosity, if I were to get a scroll saw, what type of blade would be best for cutting out spiled planks? Since the thickness of the sheetwood I'd be cutting would be very thin, I'm assuming I'd need a blade with as many teeth-per-inch as possible, right? What would be the TPI range I'd want to use for cutting veneer in the 1/32" - 1/16" thickness range? -
Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Since I've decided to cut my own spiled planks out of sheetwood for this project, the scroll saw is looking really nice... Otherwise, I'm going to be cutting each plank with an X-Acto blade! My problem would be trying to find a place to store the saw... As for the Dremel, I know without a doubt that it's a good idea. I'm trying to find that balance between getting the tools I need and not worrying my wife by buying a ton of tools right off the bat before the kit even arrives! For some reason, I like the analog calipers. Taking vernier scale measurements just feels right for this project! -
Nice job, Mike! I think I'm going to get sheets of basswood and walnut, and just cut the planks out of the sheets so that I can make the most of the material and not have to worry about purchasing the right widths. Unfortunately, since I don't have a scroll saw, I'm going to have to cut the planks by hand! At least I'll get a real sense of accomplishment out of it, right? Haha! I'm going to give it a shot before I decide whether I should break down and buy a saw, since I don't have a lot of storage space for the saw...
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Oh, the kit is double-planked. I suppose I can just do the first layer as single hull-length planks and cut the second layer to scale lengths. However, it might be a good idea to try cutting some of the first layer planks to scale just so I can get some practice before it "counts." I'm planning on getting a build log going when I start working on the kit. I just hope I can remember to take pictures along the way, as I'm sure I'll be concentrating pretty hard on my work! I'm going to do the first layer in basswood, and then use walnut for the second layer. Hopefully I can find the right thicknesses of sheetwood for my kit!
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Yes, I was wondering how many people cut a whole hull-length plank and simply cut it into separate planks afterwards to achieve the "scale" look. I would think that this would be an easy way to get shorter planks that fit together well.
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Valuable information, NMBROOK. I appreciate your input! I think I'm looking for a balance between ease of planking and a smooth, fairly accurate appearance. My plan is to check the thickness of the planks provided with the kit (when it arrives), and then acquire some sheets with the same thickness from which I can cut my spiled planks. There will be a lot more preparation involved, but I think the results will be nicer. A big part of me wants to go with scale plank lengths, as well, but I don't want to bite off more than I can chew... Let me see if I've got this right: I'll pick a starting point (the wale, for instance), which will most likely be at full width across the hull. I'll divide the hull into working bands, lining the plank spaces off on each bulkhead, according to the planking fan. Working down from the wale, my first couple of planks in that band will likely only require some slight tapering to fit properly. Once I have those in place, I'll begin spiling the rest of the planks based on the curvature of the planks that are already in place. Does that sound correct?
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The more I look at the spiling guides, the more appealing that method is to me. I love the way the planks seem to lay down so perfectly on the bulkheads when the curve is actually cut into the planks. I'm worried that if I try to use the standard planks and just taper the edges, I'll end up with a slightly "clinker" look, which is really unattractive to me... Here is a comparison of a straight plank bent around the bulkheads and a spiled plank (taken straight from the "Lining Off Your Hull for Planking" guide): The spiled plank (or cardstock, in this case) looks a lot better than the straight plank. I know that doing a good job of tapering and not attempting to "edge set," or laterally bend, the planks will help to reduce the clinker look, but spiling still seems like the most effective way to minimize this occurrence. Anyway, I tend to obsess over certain aspects of a process in order to figure out the "best" way to do something, so please tell me if I'm worrying over nothing. Thanks!
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Amati/Victory Models Lady Nelson - Bearding Line?
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Wood ship model kits
Thanks a lot for the additional information, Bart! I suppose I'll just have to wait for the kit to arrive and simply take a look at the instructions. It's no big deal! When I get ready to start a project, I like to run through the process a number of times in my mind to help me mentally prepare for the various tasks ahead. I was just trying to get a feel for what I'd be doing ahead of time (while also giving me something to daydream about while I anxiously await the arrival of the kit!). -
I'm a little confused, because the "Planking Techniques for Beginners Guide" says the exact opposite... Here's a picture from the guide (with the ship in the upside down position, with the keel facing up): Based on that diagram, the tapered edge on the garboard strake pictured below (also taken from the guide) should be the keel-side edge, right? It certainly does seem like each builder has his/her own opinion when it comes to which side of the plank to taper. Based on what I read in the guide, I was under the assumption that it was a hard and fast rule to only taper the top edge of every plank but the garboard strake. Apparently the choice is up to the builder. I'm assuming that it's just a matter of consistency (tapering the same edge on each plank, once you've decided). Just out of curiosity, which edge do most of the people here choose? I appreciate the useful information that has been shared thus far. I'm still interested in hearing other members' answers to my previous questions, though! I'm definitely learning a lot.
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Hello, everyone! I've been taking some time to read up on all the planking tutorials offered here, and I'm trying to conceptually apply the techniques that I'm learning to my first build, which will begin in a week or two. I believe I understand the planking process in theory, but I've noticed that, with the exception of the "Hull Planking Techniques for Beginners" guide (http://modelshipworldforum.com/resources/Framing_and_Planking/plankingprojectbeginners.pdf), most of the guides seem to describe a technique in which each individual plank is spiled to fit the lined-off sections on the bulkheads. While this method seems easy to understand and certainly appears to provide a beautiful fit and a great-looking hull in the end, it requires you to use your own wood, as the spiled planks you cut out require stock that is wider than the planks that are included with the kit. This method seems ideal to me, as it puts less stress on the planks, and seems to make for an easier planking process, as long as you take your time cutting out each plank as perfectly as possible. However, I'd like to strengthen my understanding of the process used if one were to plank using the strips of wood included with the kit itself (for the sake of clarity, I've written my questions in bold). Based on the guide, it would appear that, in this case, you are to use the measurements of your lined-off bulkheads to plot a curve along the top side of each plank (i.e., the upper edge of the plank when the model is upright, with the keel on the bottom, as if the ship were sitting in the water). The top edge of the plank is then tapered along this curve (without ever tapering the bottom edge of the plank), minor adjustments are made, and the plank is moistened and heated, then bent over the bulkheads and clamped, where it is allowed to dry in order to take the shape of the hull. Once dry, the plank can be adhered to the bulkheads. Is this correct? From what I have read, the only plank to which this method does not apply is the garboard strake, which is tapered along its bottom edge to match the curve formed by the bottom edges of the bulkhead where they meet the keel. The top edge of the garboard strake (when the hull is positioned upright) is not tapered. Do I have that right? Finally, I'm curious about the wale. Is this where most people start planking, working down to the keel? Is this plank tapered at all? If so, which edge is tapered -- top or bottom? While I had originally assumed that I would simply plank my hull using the strips that come with the kit, I've become quite interested in the spiling technique, as the hulls I've seen that result from the use of this technique look amazing. My kit has not arrived yet, so I do not yet know the thickness of the planks that are included with it. If I were to acquire some 1/16"-thick sheets of basswood, would this thickness be comparable to the thickness of most first-layer planks that come with these kits, or is 1/16" too thick? I appreciate the help, guys!
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Tools and Supplies for My "Shipyard"
daveward replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
I appreciate the suggestions, everyone! I am sure I'll be adding some of the tools you guys mentioned to my collection as I progress through the build. I ended up getting a standard swing-arm lamp, and I put a 850-lumen 5000K natural daylight LED bulb in it. I think it will provide plenty of light for my work. I have also purchased everything on my list, as well as a dressmaker's tape measure, a small 3-inch vise, some extra tiny drill bits, some map pins, some 3/4" spring clamps, rubber bands, toothpicks, and a bottle of rubbing alcohol. The sandpaper grits I selected were 100, 150, 220, and 400. I ended up going with Zap-A-Gap glue (with some Z-Ends), and the wood glue I selected was Titebond III. I am also probably going to pick up an Optivisor and a helping hands with a magnifier. For now, it's just a matter of waiting for the kit. Since this will be my first model, I went ahead and spent the money on the Lauck Street Shipyard Lady Nelson DVD set. While it was expensive, I think it will be beneficial to watch a step-by-step build of the exact same kit I will be constructing. I'm sure I'll learn a lot, and the skills I develop can be used on future builds, as well. Between the DVDs and the wealth of information here on the forum, I think I stand a good chance of producing an aesthetically pleasing model that I can display in my home once I'm done. Thanks again for your comments and suggestions! Happy modeling!
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