Montanes 1794 by Cmm4000 - OcCre - 1:70

[Cmm4000]

Greetings All, 

Build log for the Occre Montanes.

Pretty happy with the kit everting was nicely packaged and wrapped. All the ply was flat and not warped all the strips and dowels nicely banded together and all the small parts in plastic compartmented trays. The instructions are good, there is a book of photos and a separate book of instructions. The plans for the masts are nicely printed at 1:1 scale.

I did take the plans to my local copy shop and have them single side printed and had the plan for the side view enlarged to 1:1 scale instead of 1:3. My last ship had double sided plans and it got old constantly flipping them over. This is my third build and I wanted to work at a bigger scale, this ship is big! I had to build another bench to make things easier.

 

For the build board I went to my local home improvement center and got a melamine shelf board, a "premium pine" furring strip and poplar strips for the bottom slot. The shelf board gives a nice flat smooth surface and I have a piece of 3/4 ply underneath, roughly $40.00 for materials. I Made sure the uprights were perfectly squared then made sure they were in line using a 3' steel level. The notches in the bottom boards are for the bulkheads. The notch down the center is to keep the false keel straight. On my first kit I didn't take much time with the build board and the false keel twisted. I was able to fix it, but I had to remove a lot of planking and add reinforcements to the false keel not fun!

 

For the frame I cut the rabbet and the bearding line with a Proxxon mill. I sanded all the bulkheads, so they were snug but not tight and dry fitted everything at least ten time before I started gluing things together. I stated with the bow bulkhead and worked to the stern. the big square reinforcements were sanded so they would slide in without being forced. I squared each bulkhead to the false keel and plumb to the build board. I also added a lot of bracing (might have gotten carried away a bit but I don't want the disaster I had with my first kit).

The instructions show planking the decks then gluing them in place. I don't know how I could have gotten them glued to each bulkhead correctly as the have significant slope towards the bow and stern, so I opted to pin and glue the decks in place first then do the planking.

I

 

 

 

 

Deck Planking:

Decided to use the method I saw here on MSW with construction paper. After consulting with the admiral and her staff, decided the light brown looked best. (Tried black, dark brown, pencil and sharpie). The hardest part here (other than making what seemed to be an endless number of planks) was getting the glue consistency down. Too think and the paper does not bond well, too runny, and it gets between the planks. I also found the brushing the glue on worked best for me. I used watered down PVA. When gluing the planks to the paper make sure they are snug with each other. After the glue dried, I separated the planks using a double-sided shaving razor blade. Oh, and put tape on the blade to avoid nasty little cuts!

After the planks are separated repeat the process for the ends. You only need to do one side and one end for the planks.

I used a four-plank shift starting from the centerline. Not hard just have to keep track of where you are and make sure the construction paper caulking is facing the right way. I didn't take the planking all the way to the first bulkhead since it will never be seen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cmm4000]

The second deck has been installed and planking continues.

I also sanded and sealed the first deck before starting on the second.

 

[Cmm4000]

My guide for doing the deck planking.

[Cmm4000]

Adding the deadwood and the plywood formers. I was worried about soaking the plywood per the instructions. I was afraid the plywood would dis-bond but no issues. I also bent the bow plywood over a big metal can first then nailed it place let it dry then glued it on.  On the bow I left two slots so I could put planks in to align the stem.

Also added some vertical reinforcements on the stern for the rear gunports.  

[Cmm4000]

Putting on the keel. I put a dowel through the keel at every bulkhead. the planks are in the slots to align the stem.

[Cmm4000]

LEDs. I am using the kit from Artesania Latina (their part # 27950) comes with LEDs, wire, solder, heat shrink and battery holders. The LEDs twinkle so all you have to do is wire them up.

I am going to light up the stern gallery, the waist grates, the deckhouse and the stern lanterns (still working on the details for that but the wire is wrapped up in the access I cut in the deck). Still working on how to get the wire out of the bottom of the keel (thinking brass tube) gonna go scope for parts this weekend at the hobby stores.  Oh, I drilled all the holes in the bulkheads for the wire to pass through before I glued them in place. I drilled a hole in each bulkhead one each side of the false keel just in case. 

[Cmm4000]

Stern gallery. Was not crazy about the cast metal parts form the kit the only parts I used were the plywood bulkhead and the PE brass window frames. The wood is cherry strips for the planking, walnut for the door/window frames and some scrap veneer for the details. I used the AL scrapers to make the detail on the columns and built a jig to make the doors and windows and columns 

[Cmm4000]

Planking begins.  I could not tell from the pictures in the instructions how the fist plank lined up with the head deck, so I ran the plank slightly above the deck to have a reference to trim the plank, so it is flush with the deck. The whitewood supplied with the kit is nice to work. I have let it soak for at least 24 hours and use my hi-tech plank bender (lid from a scotch tube) to start the bend. I clamped the planks in place and let them dry overnight before gluing them in place. 

[Cmm4000]

More planking. Have the four hardest planks (IMHO) per side done, the first two below the wale and the first two above the keel, and I need to add a stealer to the gap in the bow. I used an electric plank bender (looks like a soldering iron) for the stern. The brown wood is a little harder to work so I let it soak for two days and really took some time with the bends. I overbent the stern planks so I did not have to fight them into place.  

Going to pause on the planking so I can put in the lower gun deck ports in while I can still access behind them. Pretty happy with the first gun port, the inside box is 1.5 mm walnut the outside box is 1mm supplied with the kit so the box will have an inside lip. I am going to sand the outside box flush with the hull and stain the inside box black for depth. Now the fun part cutting the rest of the ports, making 27 more boxes and gluing them in place. Once that's done, I'll pick back up on the planking.  I'm going to use the tapered plank method from the tutorial on the MSW site. Still have to do the tick strip stuff but I figure I'll have plenty of tome to figure it out while doing the gunports. I also made another jig for making the gunports.

[Cmm4000]

More work on the gunports and the tools used to cut the ports and make the frames. Had to cut four bulkheads back to accommodate the boxes. The stick and square sanders are homemade I make sure the sandpaper does not protrude past the edge, so the corners stay square, and the sandpaper does not cut a line into the adjacent side. The square stick by the frames is to mark the center of the frames for the dummy guns. I use a drafting triangle to make sure the sides of the gunports are vertical to the build-board.

 

[allanyed]

On 11/30/2022 at 6:24 PM, Cmm4000 said:

so the corners stay square,

Your work is VERY neat and clean, kudos!!

For future projects, keep in mind that the gun ports are rectangular with corners that are pretty much square midships, but they are trapezoidal fore and aft.  The top and bottom do not follow the line of the planking but rather the line of the deck which was different.   Below is a contemporary model at Preble Hall that shows what I mean better than in words.

 

Have you seen the planking videos on YouTube by Chuck Passaro?  

 

Allan

Edited December 2, 2022 by allanyed

[CiscoH]

Cmm4000- planking looks great!

i agree Chuck Passaro’s planking videos are excellent (in brief he uses the heat from a small travel iron to bend wood.  it takes minutes, not days like soaking does).  its a great technique which i use in conjunction with water bending.

 

Allanyed- i knew the gun ports followed the deck line, otherwise the cannons would have different height ports.  But i didnt know the exterior planking didnt necessarily follow the interior deck line, which sounds obvious when i write it but the thoughts never connected in my brain.   Learned something new, thanks for the explanation

[allanyed]

No worries Cisco.   Looking at many contemporary models at Preble Hall and RMG, I could not find one where the planking is parallel to the deck line.   This brings up an interesting point..... why are they different?   I assume it has to do with structural strength but I cannot wrap my head around this.  

 

You are so lucky to only be about an hour or so from Preble Hall.   I would probably do a lot less modeling due to the time I would be spending over there if I was that close!

 

Regarding Chuck's videos, Ihis methods to work very well but I still like to soak the wood for the heaviest bends and I have stopped using an iron and gone to an industrial hot air gun that was about $20, delivered.   I find it much easier to use than the iron but to each his own.  

 

Allan

Edited December 2, 2022 by allanyed

[Cmm4000]

Allen, Cisco.

Thank you for the comments. Learn something new every time I get on MSW. Never thought about using a heat gun for lateral bends. I have used an iron and warming the wood (wrapped in damp paper towels) in the microwave. I will also let the wood soak at least overnight. I would really like to build a small steam-box someday, maybe for the next project... Something else I have been kicking around is to get a kit like the Montanes and double the size say to like 1/32 scale. That would require tools I don't have like a lathe to make the cannons and the deadeyes but the level of detail you could put on a model that size would be amazing, and another problem is where to put it when it is done. 

 

Here is a picture of my San Juan Nepomuceno in the case. This was my second kit the Montanes is my third.

Curt

 

[Cmm4000]

Ok more gunports so I can get back to planking.

The starboard side is done (at lease for the bottom deck) and I have made a test door also.

I'm not a fan of painting anything on my models, that is made of wood, it's just to pretty to paint so I used several types of wood on my SJN (that did not come with the kit for the different colors). I have some nice dark cherry to line the bulwarks to simulate the red for the Montanes. 

Work begins on the port side.

[Cmm4000]

Planking continues.

Figured out the power for the LEDs using a power cable from an old cell phone charger through the keel. Cut in the first of several steelers.

Started the mast tops replacing the ply from the kit with walnut and cherry for the crosstrees. The keel looks pretty rough at the joints, but I plan to cover it with walnut veneer that I just got in the mail a few days ago yea!

 

[Cmm4000]

Sorry haven't posted for a while been kind of hectic.

Planking continues, hopefully my measurements come out OK so I don't end up with any weird planks.

More on the mast platforms (walnut, beech, and sapele laminate), cross trees (cherry). I have also made some prototypes for the ribs (bottom left of the build board). 

I'm thinking the bottom one, just have to make lots of them and build a jig for the tapering.  Also, a picture of my hi-tech bending jig, I use an iron to heat the wood. I couldn't get the beech to bend nicely for the upper trees so I'm going to try cherry and walnut. 

[BikerMart]

I appreciate that this question refers to something that you did some months ago...

 

Did you follow the kit instructions and place the middle gunport strip before the placing the lower gunport strip?

This sequence seems odd to me. Given that there are steps in the bulkhead for locating the lower gunport strip, why wouldn't that one be added first, as the steps would provide more positive location for the strip?

I am about to be at that stage and am considering starting with the lower strip. Do you see any glaring problems with that approach?

Thanks, Martin

 

[Cmm4000]

Hi Martin,

Sorry for the late response and being away for so long been kinda busy.

If I understand the question. I did not follow the instructions for the plywood decks and planking especially with the way the decks slope. I glued and nailed the ply to the bulkheads and then started the planking from the center outwards to both sides. My thoughts were how would you make sure there were no gaps between the plywood deck and the bulkhead? And there would be a giant gap running right down the center of the deck. Sanding the gun deck was a little tricky working around the bulkheads and I also varnished the gun deck before placing the main deck. I think the instructions sometimes focus on doing things faster, but I agree the deck stuff just didn’t make sense to me either. Hopefully I answered your question, let me know.

Curt

[Cmm4000]

Hi all, 

Been away for a bit, planking recommences, looking forward to having this part being done. 

[BikerMart]

Hi Curt.

Not quite, but that's okay! I was referring to the gunport strips rather than the decks.

However, I went ahead anyway and fixed the lower strips followed by the middle strips and then the bulwarks. They appeared to fit just fine, and so planking of the hull has started, with those planks around the gunports first.

Like you, I haven't fixed the 'backing' to the gunports - I felt that opening up the gunports would be far easier without those obstructions.

I haven't fixed the upper deck in place either; I feel that that can be done once the gunports have been opened and lined - again, to provide good access to the gunports.

Martin

 

[allanyed]

 

 

On 8/10/2023 at 3:05 PM, BikerMart said:

Did you follow the kit instructions and place the middle gunport strip before the placing the lower gunport strip?

Hi Martin

Sorry if I am dense on this, but what is a lower gunport strip?  It sounds like a strake under the gunports but the external planking did not follow the line of the gun ports as discussed earlier so I am at a loss.   I am basing this on British contemporary planking expansion plans at RMG and now wonder if Spanish ships like Montanes might be different.  

Thanks

Allan

Edited September 26, 2023 by allanyed

[Cmm4000]

Hi Martin, 

Can you post a picture of what you are talking about?

If you are talking about the plywood strips with the gunport cut-outs I did the top ones first.

I used full length planks the cut the lower gunports in.

Once I finish the planking I will cut the next set of gunports. 

 

One side of the lower planking is finished yea! 

 

[BikerMart]

Hmm. A bit too late for a picture as the planking now covers that area of the bulkheads.

But yes, I was referring to the plywood strips with the gunport cut-outs. It seemed to me that the steps on the bulkheads would provide a more positive location for the lower strip to be placed first, followed by the upper.

Well, that's what I did anyway, and it worked just fine!

I am shamelessly copying your method of producing 'boxes' for lining the gunports!

 

 

 

[Cmm4000]

Hi Martin, 

Glad you liked the gunports!

Lower planking finally done! Now cutting more gunports and finishing upper planking.

 

[Cmm4000]

Finally got all the gunports installed/lined. Added a third port back from the bow on the upper deck. Missing in the kit plans/not precut, many of the drawings I have show this third gunport so I decided to add it.

Also, the 5th gunport back from the waist was too high so I had to move it down to the correct height for the cannon.

[Cmm4000]

Started work on the bow. Sanded the plank flush with the prow and roughed in the doors. The plans call for rectangular doors and not inset I prefer the rounded top and inset matching many of the drawings I have accumulated.  

[Cmm4000]

Got the heads and doors roughed in and the first test column to replace the kit PE. Mast tops major construction completed to replace the kit supplied ply w/ (walnut, cherry, birch, sapele). If I was going to paint the plywood the laser-cut is top notch but I'm a wood guy. The ply parts make excellent templates though. The jigs for the cross trees and making the cross trees (cherry and birch).  The next big steps are sanding the hull and cutting the stern gunports, not looking forward to the all the sanding and mess, so I've been building these other parts to get motivated. 

[Cmm4000]

Crosstrees completed. Stern gunports cut in and lined. First hull sanding done (sand-vacuum, sand-vacuum, ugh).  More of the bulwark lining done. Been messing with what to make the fenders from, either wood soaked in black dye or dark walnut. Both are soaking for bending so while I was waiting for that I made the waist grates. The kit grates are nice but IMHO way out of scale (the openings look way to big, I have a 1/72 scale sailor and his foot would almost fit through the opening), so I used laser cut grates from Falkonet with much smaller openings.  One very important thing my Nepomuceno taught me is the importance of building assembly jigs. This is a piece of poplar from my local home improvement store with blue tape for a reference and a square block of bass for a stop.  I keep a couple of these poplar boards on hand as they are great for making push sticks, sanding blocks, shims, vise jaw protectors, drill press jigs, etc. and they are really cheap too!

[Cmm4000]

Work continues on the grates and hatch covers. Making the top for the bell tower laminating walnut with my high-tech jigs. Decided to go with the kit supplied walnut for the fenders really nice wood. Had to thin it to 1.5mm I could not get the 2mm to bend on the stern wood processed and test bend successful!