Revenge 1577 by Loracs - Amati - 1:64

[Loracs]

GrandpaPhil, Agree with you 100%.  this is my first large scale ship... you learn with time.  

 

Indeed, the Vanguard ship model is fantastic.  I tried the small cutter/yawl.  Just superb.  I don't know if Chris Watton is still following this tread (which intimidates me a little at first as a beginner - I wanted to bring justice to his design), but yes his work is so nice.

Edited May 15 by Loracs

[Pfälzer]

Hello, 
that doesn't sound so good. Until today I was wondering whether the Revenge would be my next build. Your report is now putting me off a little.
Only one question remains, how old is your kit? Somewhere I read that Amati had improved it. Maybe yours had been on the shelf for years before it came to you and still has the old components. 
I was satisfied with the material of the Lady Nelson so far. But it was also my first build after 40 years of absence. My current build looks different again, it's from 2010. 

Greetings

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[Loracs]

Hello @Pfälzer, if you like the model design like I do... please don't be put off (not discouraged). You just need to know what to expect. Amati (Chris Walton) design of the revenge is superb (I would say unique) and documentation top notch.  The foundation and first planking are quite fine.  The review was to bring awareness on a number of weak points. Other manufacturers are raising the bar... so should Amati and many others.

 

BTW, I'm a little perfectionist. I bought the kit last year....  but who know how long it was on the shelve.

 

At a minimum, I would change the rope and blocks.  The blocks are made of soft/brittle wood and very hard to work with (and could look a lot better).  Bright side: pearwood/basswood blocks are available.  I choose pearwood.  The ropes...  invest in a Syren ropewalk (careful assembly require).  Easy to use, fun and superb end-results. You will recoup cost very fast (MARA strings of various thickness is not that expensive).

 

The wood strips are brittle BUT look OK (basswood or pear would be better but it is asking a lot).  You just need to be extra careful. They break easily or fray at the end while cutting (go slow and use sharp tools/blades).

 

I don't like the paper decorations, but this is personal preference. Replacement was more expensive for me.

 

I would buy walnut wood strips at few width 1-3mm mostly (or use some of the extra strips).  This would allow you to plank (to re-enforce) the very brittle/soft accessories like the small side platforms and cannon bay doors.  Trying to drill a side hole for nails (or adding nails) just damage them, sometime beyond repair.  Same goes with the larger front and back pieces.  I just planked then all. The glue and planking solved the issue, and the end-results look better to me... 

 

The masts can be stained walnut... so they all look the same.  They look fine afterward.

Bright side, I found the sails to be nice but have not seen other.

 

HOPE, I'm not discouraging you.  The kit is still worth it with the above restrictions.

Edited May 17 by Loracs

[Loracs]

Hum....  a little set back. 

 

After working on the ratlines, I come to realize two things (both my fault) after waking up at 2am with a nagging feeling that something was wrong with the build.  I checked more closely.

 

1. The lines are just too thick to fit several in a thigh space.  The issue, I think, is that I served the rope.  It makes it thicker and very hard; it doesn't compress and take too much space above.

 

2. The top platform was not set-up quite right.  I decided to fix that.

 

Results:  All the rigging made so far had to...  go down. 2 weeks gone in an instant, but experience gained.

Edited May 17 by Loracs

[kirill4]

Good day,

There are a few ideas, which could be found usefull, how to fitt shrouds in simple way by using cardboard patterns and thin brass wire and CA gel to fix shrouds when they passed around upper deadeye...

Pls note ,

*upper deadeyes temporary secured to the cardboard by thin soft wire , sometimes necessary to apply a drop of CA glue on the other side of the cardboard to make wire less moveable...

*than assembled piece of cardboard need to be precizely fitted in pozition between mast top platform and chainplate.

* shroud need to pass around upper deadeye by means of strong pincet with a very ,very little force just sufficient to keep shroud thread straight but no more! and  to secure its running end temporary in such position by any convenient way

* than apply a small drop of CA gel glue a little above upper deadeye and to squieze both branches of the shroud together in this point by means of long nose plears for a few seconds with redonable force to allow CA work and than apply one throat an two round siezings above deadeye and to cut off remains of running end of the shroud.

* all standing rigging threads were painted ( in necessary color by using mix of acrylic paints and matt varnish in free proportion You like) in advance  before installation, it made them flex like soft wire which,by my opinion,  makes them much handy to operate with...

Ps

There are a few other methods which make shrouds lanyards installation more easy...someone used to use a distance / calibrated piece of wood of certain length with metall pins in both ends which is fitted between lower and upper deadeyes, than running end of the shroud passing and fixed around upper deadeye and procedure repeated with another pair of deadeyes and so on, than lanyards of all shrouds could be fitted...

 

 

Edited May 18 by kirill4

[GrandpaPhil]

@Loracs ,

You got this!

[Loracs]

@kirill4 Thanks for the tips and pictures... it is worth a thousand words.  Love your build, very original.  The color choice is very cool!

 

Thanks a lot for taking the time, it is greatly appreciated!!

Edited May 19 by Loracs

[Loracs]

@GrandpaPhil,  Hey... just a little set back.  I'm still determined to complete the build.  It is worth it!

[kirill4]

Good day,

There is very interesting and lot of usefull information! build log of GH by Patrick

 

[kirill4]

Good day ,

there are a few more tips and pictures if You like

... sometimes it is difficult to simulate seizing when we are busy with rigging blocks or try to end up other rigging lines in small scales,

using ordinary , even thiniest threads for these purposes often gives not nice but some bulcky and rough visual results,

after a few experiments I 've found these Gutermann threads seria Skala (they are different in sizes, than bigger No than thiniest thread) which gives more nicely results ,by my opinion,for imitation seizing ... for imitation seizing I used simple round knots apllied one after another on the thread and final drop of "CA liquid"... for making fine cut off the thread I use good nails cutter which gives fine and clean cut...

 

Edited May 19 by kirill4

[Loracs]

@kirill4   Again thanks a lot... this is my first ship with more comprehensive rigging.  All these tips are very helpful.  ;_)

[kirill4]

 a few examples  of rigging details -  golden level if I could say that  ... both works in a Dutch style(the work of Ab Hoving need to read at lest one time very carefully! , especially section of making model at least :))) , yes , but most of the rigging tips , tricks and details could be used for rigging english galleon of the period and, moreover... model of Pinnace Papegojan 1627 - 1/48 [COMPLETED BUILD] by mati.n- it's just pure fantastic work :)))... and there are a few pictures of famous model of galleon Elizabeth Jonas ...

Het_schip_van_Willem_Barents_-_A.J._Hoving.rar

Papegojan 1627 — копия.rar

Elizabeth Jonas 1588.rar

Edited May 19 by kirill4

[kirill4]

on your model, running end of mast tackles lanyards - they need to be secured somewhere at its own gear, but not away somewhere in other palce, as I understood... pls check it 

[kirill4]

please check lashing of your boat on deck - lashing should be run from one side to another and tight by tackles , but not like cross each other as You shown on yours ... it should be done smthg like this 

128.tif.tiff

Edited May 19 by kirill4

[Loracs]

@kirill4, Thousand thanks for the comments.  Many easy fixes that will improve fidelity. I will get on those.

[Loracs]

@kirill4, Fantastic pictures and very nice builds.  I'm seeing a lot I did not know of, like the serving of the block ropes tied to masts. It makes sense since those are potentially weak junction that likely did need serving for strength.  Will be working on a lot of things as improvement.  ;_)

 

Very timely, with the rigging down I can make the modifications easily.

[kirill4]

Yes, indeed, he is very talanted person!

[kirill4]

I don't know, but if You don't have this book, than I would strongly reccoment to have it and read it carefully :))) ...it is of  grade "must have" when busy with 16-17th model rigging ... section by section,standing and running , each rigging line described in details

[Loracs]

Rigging - upgrades: I'm slowly catching up from last week's misadventures.  I took this opportunity to "upgrade" some of the rigging as @kirill4 suggested. Thanks!

 

I changed the way I tied the block to masts, using serve-rope this time.

Lastly, I changed the way I tied the small boat on the deck.  I do not have blocks of the appropriate size, so I simply tied but this time vertically without any cross-over.  The sailors are in the process of tying the third one ;_)

 

Back from a small vacation, so I should be able to catch-up this week.

Edited June 3 by Loracs

[Loracs]

delete... was duplicated.

Edited June 5 by Loracs

[Loracs]

Backtrack completed.  It was a slow process, but I think it is better now.  The small changes I made were to use a light colored rope for the lower part of mast tackle.  I think it is more appropriate since the rope is tied mainly to the deck racks, which I assumed would be kept clean (no tar).  here it is...

 

Edited June 5 by Loracs

[Loracs]

Worth Repeating:  Please DO NOT hesitate to correct me or highlight mistakes.  I'm somewhat a beginner and welcome your comments.  Even thought, this build may not be historically accurate (I took liberties with the hull decoration, for example) ... I still want to improve my skills.  Sometimes you just don't even know when you are making a mistake.  I love the "craft" and this won't be my last ship.

cheers all.

 

 

[Baker]

You're doing very well. And it is very nice to follow.
I would only attach the backstays of the fore and main mast more forward, like on the mizzen mast.
If you tie them so far back they can get in the way of later rigging.

[Loracs]

@baker, Thanks a lot.  Let me check the plans if I can use alternative attach points. I'm planning on adding sails later on, which will use quite a lot of attach points...  I may run into potential conflict/complication.  However, it is really worth looking into it.  

 

Thanks for the compliment, I'm just taking my time and looking at as many logs possible... to learn from all of you.

Edited June 5 by Loracs

[Loracs]

Rigging: Not quite what I was expecting.  It is far harder and slower than I thought.  I had to redo things a few times to get the results I wanted.  Hopefully, it gets easier over time....  I know, wishful thinking.  Slow progress but progress nonetheless.  Note: It is a very tight fit with served 1.2mm line.... very tight.  I learned earlier that anything larger won't fit if you serve the line.

 

Edited June 16 by Loracs

[kirill4]

Good day Loracs,

You have a very good progress in rigging as I could see!

I have some thoughts regarding belaying points of mast ( or side tackles)tackles running end...

as I could understand, if not mistaken, they should be coiled and secured somewhere at/on the lower block of the tackle, 1st ring bolt for the tackle pozitioned in the forward part of the chanell and 2nd,in a few deaeyes aft on the chanel?...there You have  a few free eye bolt.

The last aft eyebolt on the channel used for securing the back stays tackles as a rule... there are a few pictures from Ab Hoving book and from RC Anderson book... and galleon Elizabeth Jonas model ... where we could find such details...

 

Edited June 16 by kirill4

[Loracs]

 

Hello @kirill4,  again a thousand thanks...  a lot of great information to digest. About the backstay anchor points:  @Baker did point this out too... and I got distracted with building the ratlines.  I'm really glad for you both...  I will get on it.  Great suggestions.

Edited June 16 by Loracs

[Loracs]

@kirill4 @baker, what do you think of the front Masts tackles?  OK to tie the end to the rack as shown (as per plan)? 

 

or hook the block-end of the backstays to the front eye bolt on each platform?

or should I tie the opposite end of the backstay to each adjacent eye bolt?  rather that shown here on the rack?

 

Lastly, rather than tying the end to the eyebolt as suggested, would adding a cleat to the deck for the backstays-end be ok (front and main masts)?  (Like what you see here for the front one).

 

Finally, Was I OK to use light rope for the lower part?  or all dark rope?

 

Edited June 16 by Loracs

[Loracs]

I think I get it (for the main masts backstay):   Tying the ends like that ...  to each front-end eye bolt.

 

Should I do the same for the Front masts' backstay?

 

Edited June 16 by Loracs

[kirill4]

Good day Loracs,

There should be couple of mast tackles( or side tackles )as they named in Ab Hoving book, on each side of the mast... back stays ( roughly say they used to support top masts) - they are different gears of their functionality, and arranged not like mast tackles ...I have posted pictures from Ab Hoving book, both these rigging lines were shown...  those examples, from pinnas model,which You posted. they are very good!