Bulkhead sanding advice

[Jameskilroy]

Hello All,

 

this is my first post so apologies if not in correct place etc. 

I am building my first ship - Occre Endurance and have been trying to prepare the bulkheads for planking. I’m concerned I’ve taken too much off in a couple of places but really I’m struggling to even tell. I’ve followed guides and I don’t think I’m a million miles out but in a couple of places I wonder if I’ve mucked up. May be impossible to tell but I’ve added a couple of photos. Any advice very gratefully received! In particular at the bottom on the wood marked A15 - you can see I accidentally sanded the keel which I can live with but I’m worried I’ve made A15 so flat at bottom that planks won’t fit to it. 
just how flush to the bulkheads do the planks need to be? Again, worried I’m taking too much off in pursuit of perfection! The Occre videos are generally good but really seem to give little for this bit and it’s obviously so important! 

[BrochBoating]

Welcome!

 

As another novice my first impression is that you probably haven't gone too far, yet. Take a plank from the kit and use that to see/feel if the wood flows over the shapes you've made. Bear in mind you will probably need to soak the plank so it relaxes enough. Should give you a much better idea how it is.

 

Good luck and maybe start a build log in the relevant section. Much more experienced people than me will help and you can use it look back on to improve your next kit.

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by BrochBoating

[Jameskilroy]

Thank you for your (very quick!) reply -that feels reassuring. I have been doing as you suggest with a plank - it sort of seems to fit - I feel like I get it there on a couple then have to move further along boat to take more off for other bulkheads then back and forth which is probably exactly as it should be but is very nerve racking on first boat! Lol. I’ll see if I can get photos of a plank in place along the bulkheads and as you say start a build log. Then shamefully post nothing for months as life gets in way! 
 

J

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

  Looking over a number of builds of Plank On Bulkhead kits, the builder who glue blocks in to fill the entire space between the bulkhead ... at least those near the bow and stern (where the planks will ben the most) get a nicer fairing and less trouble planking - in terms of low and high spots where one needs either a lot of filler or has to sand the plank perilously thin, respectively.

 

  You don't need the filler wood to be a single piece, since you can just glue in pieces and scraps of basswood (or even dense balsa) helter-skelter until the void is filled.  Then the edges that protrude the most can either be coarse rasped away, or belt sanded to 'hog' them ... but don't get too close to the bulkheads themselves.  Then you can carve/sand  as needed to get nice even fairing, and you will have plenty of substrate to pin or nail planking on.

[BrochBoating]

Very welcome.

 

Again a thought from an inexperienced novice who doesn't know this kit. That said if there is scrap material available I'd consider adding another layer where it's marked a14 & a15 (and the same at the stern) so there's more space to make securing the planking easier whether with glue or pins.

 

[No Idea]

There's some very good advice you've been given there already 👍

 

Looking at your pictures I would say that you are pretty much there but as has been said use a plank to check.

 

What I would say though is that if you do go too far all is not lost at all.  Simply glue some thin strips of wood onto the bulkheads to build them back up and start to shape them again.  Although some builders may see this as fail it's not - we all make mistakes it's just part of building model ships.  Once the planking is on the fix will never been seen but a badly shaped hull always will be if the error is not corrected.

 

Good luck with your build as it looks very good so far

[knightyo]

Hi James, 

 

I would also fill the spaces between the bulkheads with blocks of wood (balsa would be easiest), and sand to shape.  It would then be easier to see the curves with the eye, and also far easier to plank those areas. 

 

Alan

[Jameskilroy]

Thank you all for the tips/comments. The stern in fact does come with pieces to add in to create a fully rounded mount for the planks (only between the last bulkheads) so that’s a relief to know I’ve prob done the hardest bit (or fairly close). 

 

it makes sense as you have suggested to put more in between bulkheads to shape - I’ll think about how o can do it. Problem is I work off a dining room table with limited tools and have to pack it all away each shift (2 3-year olds with curious minds in this house!). Alas no workshop or garage
 

I run the planks over it regularly but it’s quite difficult to know how the should look as you get to the keel - probably over worrying! 

 

thank you all again - it’s been very nice to have so many helpful/supportive  replies so quickly. I was worried this would be such a common question as to mean I’d just be told to check other posts! 
 

 

 

 

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

  Hmmmm ... in your home situation you might benefit for either a locking 'secretary' desk or a 'roll top' dest (also with a lock - not only for the top but also for the drawers.  Sometimes one can be found in thrift shops, 2nd hand stores.  Then you would have to 'put away' less and merely close the top and lock it to prevent curious children from getting at what's inside.

[mtaylor]

Welcome to MSW, James.  The others have given some great advice.   If you havent' done so, read the tu;torials here:  https://modelshipworld.com/forum/98-planking-downloads-and-tutorials-and-videos/

 

As a side note, I find using sanding sticks such as those found in beau;ty supply shops for nails to work a treat for fairing.

[Dr PR]

James,

 

Fairing the edges of the bulkheads is tricky. You can quickly get into a situation where you take too much off of one, and then remove some from the neighboring pieces to smooth the curve of planks. Then you discover you took off too much from one of those later bulkheads so you need to tale some off of another ... Eventually you realize that you have removed too much from them all and the hull is too narrow and the curves all wrong!

 

I try to leave a bit of the original bulkhead edge so I don't remove too much. It paint the edge or mark it with a. soft lead pencil. While fairing the bulkheads remove as much as necessary to shape it but leave a thin bit of the paint/pencil along the high edge.

 

Sometimes the kit bulkheads really aren't sized properly, or they aren't positioned correctly on the keel so one side is "high" and the other low. Just add a strip of wood to the low side and fair it until a plank curves over it correctly (a smooth curve). For the high side sand it down until a plank curves over it without a high spot.

 

One other tip. Some kits do not have enough bulkheads, especially midships. The planking will tend to flatten between widely spaced bulkheads, with an apparent high spot when the planks fit to the bulkhead. You can always create another bulkhead to fit in the gap and fair it to fit the curve along the hull. Some people just fill in all the spaces between bulkheads with scrap wood and fair the whole thing like a solid wood hull.

 

Don't sweat it if you end up with what appears to be a cobbled up set of bulkheads. The planking will cover it. But if the bulkheads aren't faired correctly the planking will have bumps and hollows that are very apparent!

[Jameskilroy]

Thanks for the further tips and advice. I’ve been out and bought some wood to fill in between some bulkheads. I will be sure to look through the links too. At every stage I’m finding there’s more and more to ship building! Heaven help me if I start to want to split planks so they are more realistic widths/lengths too - I’ll never be done this decade. Lol

[Jameskilroy]

Must be a market out there for 3D ready shaped hulls for planking. That’s probably sacrilege.

[BrochBoating]

14 minutes ago, Jameskilroy said:

Must be a market out there for 3D ready shaped hulls for planking. That’s probably sacrilege.

 

Lol that's just plastic modelling  Seriously though look at the Vanguard models their frames are a better start. Expensive but worth it.

[Jameskilroy]

Hi again all! 
I will start a build log shortly but since already being discussed here o thought I’d see what you thought. 
 

photos show a plank in place at various elevations across hull. As you can see def some gaps. 
now of course I can for most part attach anyway - can’t push the plank against the bulkhead as too few hands but I imagine that’s not good practice? 
 

as ever, any further thoughts or opinions on it very welcome. 

[Jameskilroy]

in the below photos is the other side which I’ve done less on so far. The red circled bulkhead never seems to get contact with a plank. I’ve taken a fair amount of the ones further towards prow and only a little on the green one. Logically I’d assume more has to come off the green or blue but that feels like quite a lot off blue - which may be perfectly normal but just a bit unsure. I could of course cheat by building up the red one but again that feels wrong somehow. 

[Seamus107]

“Majority wins” is my motto in this case.  If only one bulkhead seems to be too high or low, I assume the others are correct and sand down the high one or add material to the low one.  Sanding away a bulkhead or two fore and aft of a low one might introduce asymmetry in the hull unless you do exactly the same on the other side, which then means you have substantially modified the shape of the boat.  In my experience, the less you have to do to get a clean and true fairing job, the better.

 

james