Norwegian Sailing Pram by Venti - FINISHED - Model Shipways - 1:12

[Venti]

Here's the pictures I forgot! 

Going to work on her now!

 

[Venti]

Well probably a very short session tonight... The pintle straps supplied seem to be WAY too short... I might have used the wrong piece for the bottom rudder gudgeon but even so the longest one only has about 1/16" engagement with the rudder... 

I think I'll get some thin brass sheet and cut my own out. 

[Kenchington]

1 hour ago, Venti said:

the pictures I forgot! 

Very nice!

[Kenchington]

13 minutes ago, Venti said:

The pintle straps supplied seem to be WAY too short...

Yup. Especially if you wrap them around the bit of tube, as the instructions suggest.

 

Trevor

[Venti]

Lots of progress today! 

Steps 39, 40 and 48 done

 

Step 39: Pintles

     Got some 0.010" thick brass from Hobby Lobby and cut a 2mm strip out. Cut two 15mm  lengths of that and drilled some holes in the end and got started. You can see below the difference in length of these and the ones they supply... Went pretty well after I had those made. Just had to make sure the lower pin was slightly longer than the top one and then make sure to put them the in the right spot to line up with the Gudgeons. When gluing, I had to make sure it stuck to the right spot as well as keeping the pins parallel to the rudder edge. Next I did a test fit to make sure it worked and then I drilled a hole through the rudder to bolt the pintles on. Surprisingly I hit the hole on the other side very easily despite the angle I needed to drill at as you can see below. With the supplied nails, I cut them about .5mm longer than needed and tried my hand at riveting them since this seemed like an ideal piece for that. And it worked well!! It isn't neatly rounded but it definitely mushroomed out to hold it in! Success!

 

40: Display Stand

     Pretty straight forward. Biggest thing to note is the hole in the base is slightly too big for the supplied dowels. It's not so much bigger that it looks bad from one side so I used that as the top. Got it glued and square and then just filled in the gaps on the bottom with glue haha. I'm not super worried as I don't think this will be it's permanent display stand.

 

48: Oarlocks

     Another super short step but satisfying since it makes the boat look much different. I had to drill the PE parts out slightly for the nails but this was easy after glued to the pads. Pinned them with the nails and glued the oarlocks in.

 

Another very satisfying day! I'm super excited to start the the sail and rigging but not really looking forward to shaping the mast... I will try using a plane on the square parts they give but it seems most other kits give dowels so I might try my hand with the dowel first... We'll see.

 

[Venti]

Well the part I was dreading the most is done... I got the mast shaped. I decided to use the dowel and not the square pieces. I'm not sure why they couldn't have given us a smaller dowel sine we had to trim it down so much... I threw it in my drill and started trimming it with some 150 sandpaper. This was so painfully slow... So I got the bright idea to use the Dremel with a drum sander while spinning it in the drill 🤣🤣 I wish I thought of this first because it took off wood soooo fast. I had to be extremely careful though because it was so aggressive. I wish the instructions had more detailed drawings so I could at least have a diameter to aim for.... I keep regretting not spending the $30 for the drawings someone had linked in their log... Won't make that mistake again. 

I ended up making my own cleats for the mast because the laser cut ones were so small and looked ridiculous. 

I used some of the brass plate I got to make a pad for the boom but I'm not 100% happy with it. It ended up with small dents and scratches 😭 I might still use it though. 

 

[Kenchington]

Looking good!

[Venti]

Got the boom, gaff and mast done today! Boom and gaff went well, I think I beveled the ends too much so they're pretty small but should be fine. I also sanded the pad on the mast for the boom so it looks significantly better. I haven't glued it on yet because I'm not sure where it needs to be exactly.

 

I got the mast 99% done. All that's left is to drill some holes and then I can start putting it all together... Easier said than done I think... I got too excited and didn't quite follow the instructions for the mast. Once the 8" x 12" and 3" x 12" sheets were dry I traced the parts needed to be cut and cut them all out. I then just glued them on one at a time until finished.  I think the instructions way is harder to make mistakes but thankfully I had no issues.

 

 

[Venti]

Got a little done on the sail. Got the gaff and boom connected. Got some of the thread wrapped around stuff. Is this all called rigging? The step says lashing but maybe that's just rigging the top of the sail to the gaff? Idk. I used entirely too much CA to hold the knots where I wanted them. I think I have the boom too far out (? Away from the mast) so the sail won't be parallel to the mast.

 

A little more to go and she'll be done. 

[Kenchington]

35 minutes ago, Venti said:

Is this all called rigging? The step says lashing

I've been bending sail to spars since I was a kid, but I can't answer your question! I don't know whether I would call the lashing "rigging", though I tend to think not. But I have no idea whether that could be considered

"correct" or not (in so far as any terminology can really be "correct" or "incorrect").

 

39 minutes ago, Venti said:

the sail won't be parallel to the mast

I think you mean the luff (the leading edge of the sail). That won't be parallel to the mast at all. It is a lug sail, meaning that the yard projects forward of the mast. The upper part of the luff will necessarily be ahead of the mast and the lower part abaft it. Nothing parallel.

 

 

Trevor

[Venti]

10 hours ago, Kenchington said:

But I have no idea whether that could be considered

I think mostly, I'm not sure what the entire process of attaching the sail to spars is called. If there is one haha. 

 

10 hours ago, Kenchington said:

Nothing parallel

Oh duh... If I would just look at any of the pictures I would have seen that haha... Well that's good then, I think it will come out ok!

 

I'm pretty unhappy about how dirty my sail is getting 😭I did use plastic wrap to separate it from my cutting mat as I've read people saying that will transfer colors. but once I cut everything out, it was downhill... I should have left the plastic wrap on. 

[Kenchington]

1 hour ago, Venti said:

I'm not sure what the entire process of attaching the sail to spars is called

That I can answer.

 

You "bend" a sail to a spar.  That's true whether you use a continuous lacing, as in the pram, or separate lengths of twine or rope at each eyelet or cringle, which is normal for large sails. If the lengths are separate, they are called "robands", probably a shortening of "rope bands".

 

Trevor

[Venti]

Trevor, thanks again for some of your knowledge! I feel I will never stop learning new things with this new hobby haha.

 

Got a little more done last night! I thought I was going to finish her up, but I got a headache and stopped for the night. I finally got the backstay plates on the mast (I was waiting to get a better idea of the angle they would be at before gluing them on). I would love to find a way to glue the extremely short nails in while still letting the plates swing freely. 

I got the Halyard and Downhaul attached.

 

The travel done. Almost forgot to put the block on there before... but remembered last minute. 

 

And I got the forestay done... Saw lots of issues people were having with this part so it took me a very long time to make sure I got it right. I'm not really sure the intended way to make a loop for this is. (I should probably go read Trevor's log again because it likely says 😆) but I just went with the one loop knot I'm familiar with... Number 290 in Ashley's book of knots.

 

I'm also having trouble with the other knots needed... the instructions call for half hitches (#48 in the book) and I end up doing two (#54). It doesn't seem to tighten up very well which isn't an issue for this since I'm gluing them in place anyways but would love some insight on what some better knots for this would be. 
With this, is there a good knot for stopping the rope from going through holes? Like for the Downhaul line or Traveler? I usually just do 1 or 2 overhand knots (#46)

Edited yesterday at 11:42 AM by Venti

[Kenchington]

46 minutes ago, Venti said:

Trevor, thanks again

You are very welcome!

 

47 minutes ago, Venti said:

I would love to find a way to glue the extremely short nails in while still letting the plates swing freely.

I doubt that is possible. Free-swinging means no glue. I used one nail and peened the end, forming a river-like arrangement.

 

49 minutes ago, Venti said:

half hitches (#48 in the book) and I end up doing two (#54). It doesn't seem to tighten up very well

The kit-supplied rope (really a fine cord but rope at scale) is very slippery and does not hold knots well. You did well to pick Ashley's #290 as it is an angler's knot, chosen because it holds in the stiff, slippery lines typically used with road and reel. Half-hitch and glue should work but I got very annoyed trying to lash down the tack of the sail using the kit's material.

 

For most else, I just pushed the kit-supplied cordage aside and used better material. From what I see on MSW, that's often the best solution with even high-quality kits. Skimping on cordage seems the first way to economize for many manufacturers.

 

54 minutes ago, Venti said:

is there a good knot for stopping the rope from going through holes?

If the hole is little larger than the line passed through it, a single overhand knot is fine. For a rather larger hole, use a figure-of-eight (Ashley #520) for seamanlike neatness, though two overhand knots will do just as well, if the second is tied on top of the first (not two knots in line, each as thick a the other), so long a they are tucked out of sight -- such as under the stern quarter knees of the pram!). Ashley has many alternatives for still-larger stopper knots, though most would not be practical in a model.

 

 

Trevor

 

On the endless learning about ships, seamanship and seafaring ...

 

The professionals would tell you that, even after a lifetime at sea, they never stop learning. The rest of us can only struggle along in their wakes. But a lesson for today:

 

"Rope" is a material. Once some length of it is cut off, given whatever treatment it needs (ends spliced around thimbles, perhaps), at sea it is rarely "a rope" and more often "a line" (as well as having its own name, such as sheet, shroud, stay etc.). There are "ropes" on shipboard, foot ropes, manropes and the like, but generally "rope" is a material from which "lines" are made.

 

But not everything that looks a bit like rope is properly called "rope". At the upper end, there are cables (made by twisting ropes together) which are arguably not "rope". At the lower end, there are sizes that cascade down through cords to twine and threads, which nobody would call "rope". That gets even more difficult with models, as a heavy cable at full size gets represented by a thin cord at scale. I tend to fall back on calling the whole lot "cordage", which does for everything from twine to cable at full size. (I doubt that anyone would call sewing thread "cordage", until it is used in modelling as a representation of cord.)

 

Enough pontificating for one morning!

[Venti]

5 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

pushed the kit-supplied cordage aside

I did not think about the material making that much of a difference, but that makes sense. Maybe I'll look at getting new cordage for the smack as it seems a good bit more complicated and I could use any help I can get. I'll look around, but if anyone has suggestions on which supplier has good quality stuff, let me know! I will look through the many MSW sponsors. 

 

9 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

use a figure-of-eight (Ashley #520)

Ah yes, this one looks much nicer than stacked overhand knots! 

 

11 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

"Rope" is a material

Excellent explanation, thank you! I suppose it's like calling the mast the "wood" 🤣

[Venti]

Whelp, a big day today. Just finished everything up!!

 

Started with getting the back stays. With the fore stay done I used a rubberband to hold the mast back and to help it from moving. I then used a knot that can be easily tightened and holds under tension (knot 1472 is closest I could find quickly. Instead of both ends doing the same knot, just doing one with the loose end of the back stay). Once this is done, it's incredibly simple to tighten both sides equally. This also made it easy to lash the loop under tension.

 

After this was done, it was just a couple more things. Hoisting the sail and main sheet. This was pretty simple but tying them off on the small cleats was annoying. Not sure if it is because the quality of the cordage or bad technique haha. I was following Trevor's masterclass on belaying to a cleat here:

 

I ended up just doing a loose coil of the sheet on the floorboards. I just imagine it is used often and wouldn't be in a fancy pinwheel. Not sure how it would actually be stored while in use.

 

All in all, I had a ton of fun building this and have learned so much. I just couldn't stop working on it in all of my free time 🤣 I've got the smack instructions out and have started reading them and I've already ready many a build log on it. Look forward to starting a new log and thanks everyone for the comments and likes on this one!

 

[king derelict]

Very nice. Congratulations

alan

[JacquesCousteau]

Excellent job, it turned out really well!

 

On 5/1/2025 at 6:43 AM, Venti said:

I'll look around, but if anyone has suggestions on which supplier has good quality stuff, let me know! I will look through the many MSW sponsors. 

I've been very happy with the rope I've bought from Ropes of Scale, they have a wide range of colors and sizes. I've used it for my Canoa de Rancho and Lancha Chilota builds (although I haven't yet rigged the latter). I've also bought rope from Syren Ship Model Co., which looks to be excellent as well, although I haven't had a chance to use it yet.

[Kenchington]

Really, really nice: Well done!

 

And you're inspiring me to finish mine.

 

1 hour ago, Venti said:

Not sure how it would actually be stored while in use.

In a loose pile at the helmsman's feet. There's no chance to keep it neatly coiled, as it is hauled in and veered out with every gust of wind. Then again, in a little boat like the pram, a tangle when you need to let the sheet out will set you swimming, so one of the skills a small-boat sailor must develop is keeping that loose pile free of tangles. It comes with experience, reinforced when necessary by a dunking in cold water or (far worse) a dunking in cold water that you share with your non-sailor wife.

 

Been there. Done that. 🥲

 

Trevor

[Venti]

Thank you all!

 

10 minutes ago, JacquesCousteau said:

Syren Ship Model Co., which looks to be excellent

I think I've decided on going with Syren as well. Mostly because I would also like to get some better sheave blocks and ropesofscale doesn't have those haha

 

10 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

In a loose pile at the helmsman's feet.

That makes perfect sense!

 

12 minutes ago, Kenchington said:

And you're inspiring me to finish mine.

Good! You're so close and it looks amazing!

[ccoyle]

Very handsome! Sailing prams are awesome.

[druxey]

Congrats on completing a very nice model.

[MBerg]

Beautifully done. Looking forward to your smack build!