Did I ruin my brush?

[MBerg]

This is how my brush looks most of the time. It was just cleaned. I noticed there's a bit of paint at the base of the bristles which may have caused this. I'm not sure how - I don't let paint dry on it, keep it wet, wash it immediately after. I only put paint on the very tip, but it quickly travelled up the bristles and always saturates the whole brush.

 

I feel way out of my element when painting like it's an entirely separate hobby with text books worth of information. I had a mental block when I got to painting this model, but am trying to push through it now.

[GrandpaPhil]

Brushes will stain.  Especially with a flat brush, that is just fine.

[Jack12477]

My son is a professional painter, when he cleans his brushes he also uses a wire brush to get the paint out of the bristles, brush from the handle straight towards the brush tip. Use the small brass brushes. The wire brush does not damage the bristles. You can also use Artists soap, it's like a saddle soap. See example below

 

 

Edited Friday at 10:14 PM by Jack12477

[petervisser]

For a deep clean of your paint brushes, you might want to try TSP which you can purchase at Canadian Tire, seeing as you're in Canada. Give give the paint brushes a soak overnight using the recommendations on the container and rinse with water. I hope this is a help.

Cheers, Peter

[druxey]

You will need an appropriate solvent to clear the heel of the brush. If it is acrylic paint, soaking in isopropanol (rubbing alcohol) will do it. For oil-based paint, something like acetone - but only in a well ventilated space, please!

[MBerg]

Thank you all! Yes, acrylic so luckily the 'easiest' option. I'll try some of the solvents mentioned and soaking.

 

I have that brush soap and it's great, it just didn't save the deep stuff on this one (I think I got it after a few paintings). I'll check out some brass brushes to help down the road.

[Jack12477]

Make sure you clean the brush with soap/water/solvent as best you can before you wire brush it. The wire brush is used to remove any remaining paint build-up from the bristles and to straighten them.  

[wefalck]

I don't want to question the professionalism of Jack's son, but I would have doubts using a wire brush on an artist's hair-brush. The hairs are just too delicate.

 

It is quite normal that paint wicks into the hair inside the ferrule, even if you don't dip the brush down to the ferrule into the paint. As long as the solidified part does not extend beyond, this has no practical consequences.

 

The best advice for getting the paint out of the ferrule was already given above: the appropriate solvent.

 

It is also quite normal that a wet flat brush looks like in the picture above. Once clean and dry, the hairs will separate again.

 

Personally, I find brush-painting acrylics over larger surfaces quite difficult. Perhaps a 'retarder' can keep the paint longer workable, resulting in better surfaces. I normally use an air-brush.

 

[MBerg]

Appreciate the additional comments. I don't have a wire brush at the moment anyways. It's been soaking overnight, I'll clean it up and take a look shortly.

 

Good to know it's generally not a big concern.

 

3 hours ago, wefalck said:

Personally, I find brush-painting acrylics over larger surfaces quite difficult. Perhaps a 'retarder' can keep the paint longer workable, resulting in better surfaces. I normally use an air-brush.

I just ordered some proper thinner, retarder and some better paint (been using ME kit paint). I expect these to make things a bit easier, but thinking ahead, I keep wondering if investing in an airbrush would be worthwhile.

 

I'm only working on small boats so far and in already predicting some issues with larger projects.

[paul ron]

when using camel hair brushes, never let the paint dry on it, the brush should be rinsed in the solvent of the paint till needed again during that session. once the job is done, the brush gets thoroughly  cleaned with the proper paint solvent, then wash the brushes with soap n  hot water. 

 

the trick is not to allow the paint to accumulate in the ferrel to begin with. the build up is because the brush wasn't cleaned between uses over time. 

 

to salvage the brush at this point, use the paint stripper for that paint. wash and store.

 

as noted before, leaving the dried paint in the ferrel in its current condition will not effect anything as long as the remaining portion of the hair is still pliable and clean, the ferrel is now sealed.

 

 

[wefalck]

BTW, acrylic paints should not be worked with natural fibre brushes, such as sable, but with synthetic fibre brushes.

 

[MBerg]

9 hours ago, wefalck said:

acrylic paints should not be worked with natural fibre brushes, such as sable, but with synthetic fibre brushes.

Well.... That's interesting advice. I don't recall the type being listed I bought them. Is there a way to know by look and feel?

 

I have no issue getting some new brushes if needed, I just want to make sure I get the right ones that'll last. I also have no idea what constitutes a 'good brush'. I generally just try to find something in the 5 to 10 dollar range. 🤷‍♀️

 

I mean, if there's a specific brand recommended, I have no problem just buying that to avoid getting the wrong thing.

 

Thanks again 

 

 

[druxey]

If it's real sable it will be a very expensive brush! However, properly looked after, it will last decades. Some of my brushes lasted for many years, so the initial cost amortised over time was far better than a cheapo brush. The performance of a real Kolinsky sable brush, if you've never used one, is a revelation.

[Dr PR]

16 hours ago, wefalck said:

BTW, acrylic paints should not be worked with natural fibre brushes, such as sable, but with synthetic fibre brushes.

 

Why?

[wefalck]

This is a recommendation by manufacturers (e.g. DaVinci) and art materials supply-houses. No explanation given, but I assume that the detergents and solvents used to clean out acrylic paints may damage the natural structure of the hair - raising the scale-like structures of the hairs, making them rough and less pliable. Ask your wife about using too aggressive shampoo ...

[MBerg]

6 hours ago, Dr PR said:

Why?

I searched around a bit. I'm finding anything from 'chemicals used in acrylic paint are bad for natural fibres' to 'natural fibres don't take to loads of water very well' as below.

 

"The reason that synthetic brushes are often used for painting with acrylics is that the hairs are not damaged after soaking in water. The synthetic fibers also are durable if acrylic paint partially dries in the brush. Let’s face it, acrylic paint dries really fast and can subject the brush to extremely damaging conditions. The animal hair used in making natural hair brushes, on the other hand, can absorb water. Soaking these brushes in water for a long period of time can ruin the natural hairs."

 

It sounds kind of like synthetic fibres reject the paint and natural fibres draw it up the hairs and into the ferrel. I guess this doesn't happen with oil paints because they're not water based, and don't dry so fast. Seems like drawing the water out of the acrylic would also cause the paint to dry even faster on or off the brush. 

[paul ron]

ive never heard natural vs synthetic for certain paints. but capilary action will draw the paint up regardless of the fiber material. just be sure to clean your brushes well. 

 

i get nice Camel hair and synthetic brushes at michaels. they have sets in both fibers for about $12. 

 

https://www.michaels.com/shop/crafts-hobbies/craft-paint/brushes-accessories/craft-brush-sets

 

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=michaels+paint+brushes&adgrpid=1339205740483960&hvadid=83700572733567&hvbmt=be&hvdev=m&hvlocphy=97622&hvnetw=o&hvqmt=e&hvtargid=kwd-83700728525048%3Aloc-190&hydadcr=11120_13459965&mcid=4ad25eefbc323c52a5db562e9ed82ba3&msclkid=1e29a7fe935a10239ee6c0026f484d0a&tag=hydusmmsn-20&ref=pd_sl_17g2089ecz_e

 

 

Edited yesterday at 12:24 PM by paul ron

[wefalck]

I have used synthetic brushes from the DaVinci range with acrylics for decades and always was quite happy with them. Not sure what brands you would get in Canada.

 

I gather the scaly surface structure of natural hair helps to keep more paint in the brush than the smooth synthetic fibres. This can be useful, when painting long lines with round brushes and in similar situations.

 

I actually also bought flat synthetic brushes from cheap Chinese sources and they are very soft and elastic, good for painting larger areas.

 

In general, I do not buy round pointed brushes on-line, but prefer to test the point in the shop myself (with a bit of spit between the fingers ...). On the other hand, if you buy on-line from a reputed supplier and you can show that a branded product does not form a proper point, they will replace it (at least in my experience).

 

The reason for buying on-line in the latter case was, that neither of the two or three art supply-shops here in Paris had undamaged brushes in their racks. People do not pay attention, when putting the protective sleeves back and break or bend hairs 😡

 

BTW it is not the water that damages natural hair brushes, but the solvents and detergents used to clean them. After all, the highest quality brushes for watercolour painting are the Kolinsky sable brushes already mentioned by @druxey.

Edited yesterday at 12:19 PM by wefalck

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

  New brushes don't cost that much.

[Dr PR]

I found this discussion interesting. I began painting (artistic) seriously about 65 years ago. I was a student for years with artists of our local art guild. I learned from them how to care for brushes. I used oils mainly, with some watercolors and tempera. For my models I used lacquer/dope and enamel. More recently I have been using acrylics.

 

I have always used sable brushes with all types of paints. I have some camel hair but I don't like it. For throw-away jobs (glues, etc.) I just buy cheap whatever brushes.

 

Never leave brushes standing in solvents. NEVER! The liquid will wick up inside the ferrule. This causes the wood to swell, and that opens the ferrule so eventually  it will fall off the handle when the brush dries.

 

I wash brushes with the solvent used in the paint. I have never used a detergent or soap - not even with acrylics. I wipe as much paint off as possible with paper towels. Then I dip the brush in solvent and wipe it on a paper towel. I repeat this until no pigment bleeds from the brush. Then I let the brush air dry.

 

Many of my brushes are at least 50 years old (some maybe more than 60 years) and are still in good condition.

[MBerg]

9 hours ago, Dr PR said:

I wash brushes with the solvent used in the paint.

Just so I'm clear on your description. Are you saying the thinner I used to thin the paint is also used to clean the brush? (I've been thinning with water, but finally just got some proper thinner today)

[wefalck]

There are different formulations of acrylic paints. Some only use water as 'medium', while others may have a mixture of water and some kind of alcohol. Some may also contain some sort of detergent to reduce the surface tension of water (aka as 'flow improvers'). So, the 'thinner' should be compatible with the 'medium' used in the paint formulation to prevent coagulation.

 

I doubt that with pure water one would be able to clean out acrylics from a brush. You need something that encapsulates the binder molecules (the acrylic resin) that otherwise have the tendency to stick to the hair of the brush (which indeed is their purpose). This is a fairly complex physico-chemical process and normally some sort of detergent ('soap') is used.

 

I was given a pot of 'brush soap' by my wife, but historically have used washing powder for wool. The latter is a mild detergent designed to not damage the natural animal hair (i.e. the wool).