vossy

Looking good Dave, how come the coat of varnish?
 
Chris
 

Wood filler and sanding applied to first planking,  plus a coat of varnish.  Now ready for second planking.
 
Regards,
David

This looks really good Dave. I will be rapt if I can ever get my Bounty to this stage!
 
Chris
 

Hello everyone,
 
An introduction:
I turned 40 last year, but have about 34 years of modelling experience (with only a 2,5 year break when my children were born).
I completed Heller's Le Gladiateur 1/200 plastic kit when I was 11 (ittle did I know it is a ficticious vessel, but I enjoyed it a lot!), but have been on different modelling ways since.
I first got into armour diorama's in 1/35th scale.
My last one (completed in 2004):

Then I a series of mostly scratchbuilt figures, figure vignettes and boxed diorama's, mostly in 1/35 scale too.
An example of these (British balloon observers under attack during WWI):

But after my kids were born and I got back in the hobby, I turned to ship modelling.
But whatever the subject, I'm always a diorama modeller at heart. And since the subjects have been WWII aircraft carriers thus far, I have worked in plastic in 1/700.
 
So far, I have completed a diorama of USS Lexington being abandoned by her crew at the end of the battle of the Coral Sea:



And one pic for scale :

 
And I'm now about to complete a diorama showing the Japanese aircraft carrier Amagi in 1946, sunk at Kure harbour:


And a (veeery much enlarged!) close-up:

 
So I'm close to starting a new project. I chose the subject already a couple of years ago and have been doing some research since, so I am looking forward to it a lot.
It will be HMS Victory and Le Redoutable in close combat at Trafalgar. Something like this:

Although I have much admiration for wooden ship models and their builders, I will stick to my usual materials of plastic, resin, metal, etc. and I will work in the small scale of 1/300. Even though this will make the job much more manageable, two ships with crew and battle damage still make for a very ambitious project that will take a lot of time to complete.
 
I have been active at the Modelwarships forum for the last years, and will continue to do so. But since this forum is more dedicated to ships of the age of sail, I am really excited about interacting with you specialists here.
Research will be a challenge as always, especially for Redoutable, so I will certainly call for your help.
I will post a build log too, but it will probably take a couple of months before I can start it. First I have to get some visible modelling results to post...
 
In the meantime, many thanks for a great forum with many wonderful resources!
 
Cheers,
 
Marijn

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

First planking done with one rough sanding pass.  Now wood filler and sand, sand, sand.
 
Regards,
David

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

I would definitely go with the spiral staircase if you can manage it; and i'm certain you can!
 
chris
 

That's very clever to use the old fret as a bending form. Its for this reason I never throw any offcuts etc. out. Also really like the herringbone deck. If I ever do this model I may go down that route if you don't mind?
 
Cheers
 
Chris
 

I've been meaning to get these pictures up here.   I tried a couple of different ideas on the stair issue.   I continued with the original idea,  adding the stairs to the landing.   I then thought that the landing might be a bit too deep.


...if anyone needs a guillotine....or a hangman's platform.......I'm your man       I then tried idea #2........the same basic double flight of stairs,  but I went higher...and gave it closed in sides.

you see the edge that has been cut out.......I will do the entire flight.

here I get the notion that I've gone too high.  perhaps a couple steps lower.

...here are the infamous before and after pictures............

I then did them in mahogany stain......they came out looking blotchy.   my next idea should raise my expectations...hopefully take it to the next level.

Moving upward. Some shots of the next level cabins planked, filled, sanded, and with doors and windows cut out.
 




 
And now some with the first coat of white paint. The structure is just sitting in place at the moment.
 



 
Cheers
 
Chris.
 

I want to thank Blue Ensign for his really great advice -- and for stating it strongly so that I'd have the motivation to rip out planks and go back.
 
So I did just what B.E. recommended above.  You can see the removal and the re-do in the pics below.  Much, much better plank line, and I can see how the former one would have not just "led to problems down the line", but actually have been a disaster.
 
I have to confess that I found the drawings not very helpful in understanding how the stern should look, and I was also led astray by the initial size of the second bulkhead.  I assumed (wrongly) that it would have been made closer to its target size.  What helped a lot was scouring all of the build logs on Fly, which helped me understand how the lower stern counter mates with the planking.  The drawings were just a mystery to me.
 
Again, thanks and kudos to Blue Ensign.
 
Regards,
David

First planking underway.
 
This is the smoothest and best-fitting first planking I've done to date, and I think the reason is that I beveled each bulkhead separately off the ship before installing it and gluing it it, testing each one with a test plank for fit.  So far, things are lying nicely.
 
Regards,
David

Nice start.  Be careful with the clinking at the bow, try to let the planks lay as flat as possible.  If I remember correctly. the planks start to sweep up so by trying to flatten them out and pull them down into a more horizontal position, you are going to get the clinking that you see.  Sanding and filler will be your friend.  Better to start your tapers at the stem further back.  
 
I think what is a little more concerning is the sharp bend at the last full bulkhead.  Again, it's better to let the planks lie as naturally as possible (and you may need to fair them a little more).  Rather than try to align each plank against the one above it at the stern, plan to use more stealers.  I think by forcing the planks into the unnatural orientation you are ending up with the cracked planks and the sharp bend at that bulkhead.
 
I offer this just as a bit of experience on my Pegasus.  You can see I had similar issues, but I soon figured out to start tapers earlier at the stem, and leave room for spacers at the stern.  The one thing I've learned in planking my Morgan and LAR is that the bow and stern filler blocks really help with the planking.  Without the blocks, it becomes a lot more of a strategic exercise to figure out where to stop the planks so that they end on a bulkhead.  With the blocks, much less concern.

Mike:
 
Thanks for all of this. 
 
Sanding and filler is in fact my very best friend -- I just think that I may for a change end up with more planks than filler on the first planking.  You should see my earlier attempts -- tubs of filler    You are right about the clinking, but these first planks are 1.5mm so plenty of room for sanding. 
 
On the stern:  the sharp bend is there whether I try to align with the plank above or not.  I have a really good steamer, and the cracks you see are partly a function of me being too impatient and not steaming enough.  When I do steam enough, I can really move the planks where I want them.  I have studied pictures and build logs to be sure I understand the run of planks at the stern -- and I think I do, although the plans are not terribly helpful on that score.  From what I can figure out, that sharp bend is part of the deal on this boat.
 
The stealer count will go up with the second planking.
 
You said "from what I can recall."  Have you built the Fly?  I only see the Pegasus in your signature.  If you have built the Fly, or if the Pegasus is similar, how did you handle the bend at the stern? (just the bend -- not the alignment part).
 
Regards,
David
 
 

Take a look beginning here on my Pegasus log - you can see how I started getting a little of the clinking at the stem and stern.  Things got better at the stem when I started tapers further back and that big drop plank, while they got better at the stern by using stealers.  In the end, this is just the first planking, so with filler and sanding, you should be fine.  Just wanted to save you some of the extra work at the end of the first planking if you take some basic steps now.
 
 
Here is a link to my LAR - I'm a little further along than the log, but you can see how the planks at the stern post are laying much more flat by using stealers rather that trying to get each plank to line up against the plank below it.  Same principle applies at the stern counter where you are.
 
 
The key to remember is that the planking bands change size along the hull - usually narrowing at the stem and expanding at the stern.  At the stern, if you don't use stealers every few planks but instead force the planks to lie against the plank next to it, you end up bending the planks laterally against their width (took me a while to truly understand what this means).
 
My current approach with the first planking is to soak the planks, pin them in position, and let them dry.  Then I glue them into position.  I find this helps avoid cracking and gaps between the planking if you glue soaked planks.  Another tool I started using is this bending machine from Micromark - not sure I paid anywhere close to this, but it really helps start a nice curve in the plank without using nippers or jigs or anything (you wet the plank, then roll it in the bender a few times - the tighter you make the distance between the two cylinders in the bender, the tighter the curve in the plank):
 
https://www.micromark.com/Bending-Machine
 
It's a bit pricey, but you could always use something like this which I also have which works nice (the bending machine I find works much easier and faster for planking, though putting a particularly bend in thicker materials, the jig below works very well):
 
https://www.micromark.com/Plank-Forming-Jig
 
For the second planking on my Pegasus, I spiled my planks.  It's amazing how well it works to let planks lie naturally.  The drawback though is that it takes a lot of time to spile planks - but, you save time on the back end.  My Pegasus log has lots of pictures of how I created spiled planks.
 
Hope that helps!
 

Mike:
 
Thank you so much for the substantial time you put into that post.  I have been tapering the planks at the bow, but I may start further back as you suggest.
 
Your stern bend on the Pegasus looks shallower than mine on the Fly.  That's either because the ships are different in that regard, or maybe I should have beveled that last bulkhead more to create a shallower drop -- but it's too late now.  I see what you mean about the stealers.  I have looked at the other Fly logs and can't get a good handle on whether their bend is as steep as mine.  I haven't worried a lot about the side effect of pulling the stern planks over to align them, again because sanding and wood filler are my best friends on layer 1.  Not so with the second planking.
 
When I built the Revenge, I edge bent the second planks using clamps, a steamer and a hair dryer.  It takes a long time, but they really lay well when I get it right.  Lots of snake-like S-bent planks!  Also lots of stealers where needed.
 
Regards,
David

Gotta love cut out gun ports! Now you can get stuck into hours of self satisfying hull planking! lol
 
Cheers
 
Chris.
 

No update for the moment - I’ve gotten rather busy at home! Two pics (only the first for now, the other soonest) showing the start of the 45° planking. Hope to restart work soon!
 
Hugh
 
 

That's very clever to use the old fret as a bending form. Its for this reason I never throw any offcuts etc. out. Also really like the herringbone deck. If I ever do this model I may go down that route if you don't mind?
 
Cheers
 
Chris
 

That's very clever to use the old fret as a bending form. Its for this reason I never throw any offcuts etc. out. Also really like the herringbone deck. If I ever do this model I may go down that route if you don't mind?
 
Cheers
 
Chris
 

Moving upward. Some shots of the next level cabins planked, filled, sanded, and with doors and windows cut out.
 




 
And now some with the first coat of white paint. The structure is just sitting in place at the moment.
 



 
Cheers
 
Chris.