PeteB

However, the point of origin of the laser will have to be precisely aligned with the point on the draught, as well as be horizontal and at right angles to the plane of the draught, as well as the draught precisely in line with the model, which will need to be precisely parallel to the draught.... Aaaagh!

Gaetan,
 
I think you will be better at it than I (English), else you may polish my French.
 
I think it is feasible, but not with a projector. I have something brewing but I will probably need to make a drawing to get it explained.
 
The quick version: You would need a spot light to set the points on the hull. If you have a drawing of the scale model in 2D in front of the model, and you have pierced the line of the deck, and e.g. the corners of the gun ports, you could set the exact corresponding points on the hull when you place a spot light at 90º angle to the keel at the level center of the pierced spot. {edit] so you get a narrow beam from the pierced hole to the corresponding point on the hull.[end edit] Does that make any sense to you?

Hi Gaetan,
 
I have been thinking about your projector experiment. I have attached a diagram showing what the issues might be.
 
In the first diagram, showing the project and ship hull from the side, if the light source is a single point, then the image lines will radiate away from the source. An image at X is projected to a greater Y on the projected surface, but the image will be an even greater Z at the hull.
 
The second diagram shows the setup in plan. If the light source creates parallel rays, the image on the projected surface will be accurate, even around the curve at the bow. But if the light source is a single point, as in the third diagram, the distance on the hull at Z will be greater than the distance at Y on the projected surface. and the curve at the bow will not be accurate.
 
You could avoid this problem if you could take each point on the projected surface, and then project it onto the hull exactly at right angles to the projected surface. Maybe this could be done with your laser beam.
 
Just some thoughts in your very interesting experiment!
 
Mark
 
 
 

Like Carl, I doubt if projection will give accurate results. Too bad; it would save a lot of time! Even projecting on to a flat surface will result is a degree of distortion due to lens. This will only get worse when projecting onto to a curved surface.
 
I've used threads for some years to line off planking runs. They are easy to view and to adjust, unlike wood battens.

Carl, I surely will not give you an english lesson because it is not my primary language.
You ask a good question and I do not really know the answer.
 
At first sight, I would say that it is not possible.
In fact, I do not think that it is what I do.
Here is how I see it: 
It is like to transfer a 2D drawing on a 2D paper, the work is only in 2D. No measures are taken for the third dimension; depth.
 
 
I remade the lines with more precision. Still have to check the lines.
 
Height between decks is not the same for each one. In a house, usually all the height of ceilings are at the same height, but apparently not on the french 74.
 
I traced in red, on the drawing, parallel lines to the keel at the lowest point of decks around at  the middle. Overall, I would separate decks in 2 : fore and aft.
 
The fore part are parallel to the keel.
The aft part is much higher and in angle.
I think that the engineers at that time were bright. I am imagining the next sentences, so I do not know if it make sense or not :
Aft volume is smaller than the front half.
When in water, aft part is deeper than the front one. I always thaught that it was because it was heavier but I do not really know why. May be because of the lest, may be because a bigger volume will float more! I have never tried it but I guess that if I put 1 ton of lest fore and 1 ton of lest aft, aft part would be deeper because of the volume effect.
 
But anyway, aft part being shifted deeper and fore half being shifted higher, the height difference on decks become  more equal fore and aft. Where there was  almost no height difference at the fore parts we now have more.
Water from both ends now flows better  towards each end, and this is the camber. We can see it on the last drawing; before and after.
 
I also tried to see the optical effect of a curve line and a kinked one at the bow, but did not get good results.
That is enough dreaming for today.

As Mark wrote: Interesting method.
 
If you project an image through a beamer on a straight surface, you will be able to trace the lines without a problem. However, if you project on a slanted or curved object, you wll get distortion either in the vertical, horizontal or both. When I look at your gun ports, those may not be subject to the distortion, or minimalistic considering their size, but the lines from stem to stern are definitely, so the place ment of the ports may/will probably be off, as will the run of the deck, etc where there is a curvature/slant of the hull

Interesting method, Gaetan. I too am curious how this works out.  Fascinating idea... 

Not really working on the mode ship actually, just driving  on the photography learning curve.
Just doing some experiment in tracing.
Simplified version  to report a height on  a stick.
Marking with a black rope, it does easily follows the curves.
I was too lazy to install a bigger vice for 1 hole only, I built a ‘’jaw extender ‘’.
 
Actually doing some experiments  with global markings using a projector.
If I could use the image and do all  the tracing, it surely would  be faster.
 

Hi Mark,
 
Often  white balance is adjusted after the photo was taken with a program to correct photos. White  balance adjusts by  comparison with known color values.
From left to right:
Color checker card
grey card 18%
These 2 are used after a photo was taken.
 
Sekonic color meter  and light meter are use before taking a photo. A camera is far from to be as smart as a human eye.  Taking a photo with different kind of lights and intensity
will give photo. Ideally, we want to take a photo with exactly the same colors. These things helps to come closer to the true colors. Sometime it is not important but sometimes it is.
 
Color meter let us know how to adjust  white balance before taking a photo, so there is no color correction needed after the photo was taken. To day it is easy to correct a photo after but when film rolls were used, we can easily understand that we can prefer to have the right colors because after, iy was too late.
 
Light meter is use  to tell us instantly  what opening to use  with a certain strength of a flash. If no light meter is use, we would have to guess which opening to use on the camera but it could take a certain time before to find it.
 
I hope it is clearer
 
Gaetan
 

The first one is a wood square to hold 1 pointer each side of the model ship from. This jig can move from one end to the other. It is use to transfer a height value from 1 side to the other. 1 measure is set 1 side and the other one is set by using a parallel line given by horizontal line of a laser.
 
The second jig is made of high density plastic. Many years ago when I began making tools, steel was always use, later to make the job easier fo the machines, aluminium was used. Today, when a  small rigidity  is needed, plastic is use. It is as easy as to cut in butter. Everything is easier to clean after the job and no liquid is needed   for heat reduction to help and preserve the tool life. For this little cable holder, I took my inspiration from the third picture but made  it a bit less complicated. This holder is made to help to preserve the quality of the mini HDMI camera connector which are very easily bent.
 
The forth picture is a screen from  a program use for photo sessions. Capture One requires a cable between the camera and the laptop but the transfer is very fast in comparison with Lightroom, no cable connector, wifi connection but  a much longer transfer time (a small second in comparison to many seconds).
 
When taking photos, White balance use by the camera is always approximative from auto  to sun, to neon… WB can be the first parameter to adjust on the camera. For a long time, I wanted to get more precision with this parameter. At the end of last year, I got  a meter to measure the quality of the color in Kelvin degrees. Then, choosing ISO and time on  a light meter, aperture (F) is given to use with the flash intensity. Values are then transfered in the camera, photo is taken and transfered in the laptop program. Minor adjustments can be done if required. By adjusting WB right at the beginning of the process, post production of the image is much easier but there are still minor corrections for highlights and this kind of adjustments.

I guess it could be done... but not by me. It would have to be vacuum by parts and then assemble by appropriate glue. What would be the workability, better or worst.
 
The question is in fact if possible would it be worth? It is not sure. The more model ship I build, the more I realize that distortion happens as soon as frames are assembled  and too much pressure is used in squeezing the frames to fit in the length of the ship. I think it is very important to realize that excessive pressure at this early stage is a sure way to have problems. I guess I prefer to spend 1 additional month to try to understand how to assemble frames and try to fix as much as possible problems at this early stage.
 
On this forum many members came with innovative solutions to fix this problem and the addition of all these solutions is probably the key to  get a  stable frame assembly. The only thing which is missing now is the chapter regrouping  all these solutions...

Dan,
When I started reading your reply I thought it a bit strange when you wrote:
 
"Then the remaining air is sucked out and the liquid is forced into the pores of the wood.  This works only for a solid piece of wood.  If you put the model into a bag and evacuated the air, I think you would be in great danger of collapsing the model. "
 
For only the air which is easily sucked out, will be removed, creating a pressure environment on the liquid, which implies you could put the model in a pressure tank and fill it with the stabalising liquid, and the model would not be subject to the wrecking forces of a vacuum sealed bag. Lukily you realised that:
 
"Actually, the process for stabilizing an assembled model would use pressure, rather than vacuum."
 
Which is the same method used with food - probably copied from the wood stabalising method ...(?) I do not think the submersion of the model would harm it in a pressure tank, but the time needed for the liquid to harden/dry may result in unwanted side effects (torsion, splitting), and what will the effect of the hardening liquid be on the joints and glues used. I do entirely agree when you wrote: "Please don't risk the terrific work that you are doing."

Hi Gaetan - 
 
No, sorry, the vacuum system will not work for an assembled or partially assembled model.  It is a process like vacuum-sealing food.  The wood billet is placed in a plastic bag partially filled with the stabilizing liquid, whether cyano, resin, or other.  Then the remaining air is sucked out and the liquid is forced into the pores of the wood.  This works only for a solid piece of wood.  If you put the model into a bag and evacuated the air, I think you would be in great danger of collapsing the model.
 
Actually, the process for stabilizing an assembled model would use pressure, rather than vacuum.  If anyone wanted to, they could submerge a model in a large container of the stabilizer, seal the container and raise the pressure inside.  As before, the pressure would force the liquid into the pores of the wood.  But I, for one, would not want to experiment using something that I had worked long and hard on, or something as beautiful as your ship is.
 
If you have seen any episode of the knife making show, "Forged in Fire", you have seen stabilized wood, and even stabilized pine cones, used for the handles of the blades that they make.
 
Please don't risk the terrific work that you are doing.  I am really enjoying following along in your build.
 
Dan 

Interesting technique you are proposing Gaetan; I will follow your experimentation closely.  A stable wood would certainly help with the hull.
 
cheers
 
Pat

Here is some dumb thinking. I was talking with a gentleman this morning and he explained to me what is : Stabilized wood.
 
In the Knife making business when they want a perfectly  stable wood, they use acrylic resin as a wood stabilizer. The penetration  is made by vacuum.   Could it work if I could put the model ship under vacuum?
 
Dry parts are almost done and all parts can easily be assemble or disassemble at this stage.

Looking at your photographs is always engaging Geatan, please tell us about the 4 schooners. The last picture is most interesting, what a simple way to keep the mill table clean with slips of hardwood filling the T slots. it also creates a more useful work surface if the vice is basically in a permanent position.
The scale of your work is really interesting to follow, and your comments about the thickness of the glue interface was revealing, something that I had not really considered but yes the accumulation adds a significant amount. i shall also have a go at some dark background photographs because the really are dramatic.
 
Michael

I did not touch  the 74 for few weeks.  I only had these 4 schooners to play with.
 
Back at home, it was time to fix  few tools :

Sharpening knives for jointer and planer on the surface grinder.
 
For the jointer, I do not have the tool they give to replace the knives. In fact we do not really need it. Right side of the table is set at 0, left side is set parallel to the other side. Then cutters are height set with 2 parallels as reference... as easy as this.
 
A small vise had the base not exactly parallel to the jaws.
 
Surface milling to fix it. A block is fixed on the big vice. The small vice is set upside down on the big vise. The block is the union between the 2 vises. A surface milling cutter straighten the base.
 

Another  photographic test: Taking pictures with an Ikea $20 LED lamp.
 
On the second deck, there will be 10 windows aft. 6 windows are inside the limit of the frames and the other 4 will be added later. Looking at the plan it is difficult to set the width of the windows,  so I looked at it a different way to set the position of 8 vertical beams.
3 beams are installed : 1 on each wall and the middle one. Then, each half was divided in 3 spaces between beams.
In a global way, these are the only measures  needed to set the vertical beams.
The width for the gun opening is derived from the setting of 2 upper beams.
 

Marvelous work, Gaetan.  Maybe it's the bigger size and the excellent photos but she looks to be the real thing.

Great progress, Gaetan!

Thank you but in fact it is not a dark background:
After supper, no sun, 1 led light and underexposed of -2 F openings
 
Needed to make a hole much deeper than the  standard drill bit lenght :
So extra long one has been used.
 
Almost everything is fixed  temporary.
Added 2 horizontal  U shape curved beams to hold the vertical beams.
 
The hole for the rudder was did on the milling and then sanded on the oscilating sander. The closer the diameter of the round hole, the better the results.
Similar results could not be achieved with a sanding drum a fraction of the hole diameter.

thank you and for those who love dark shots:

I knew that laser technology still comes to modeling! Gaetano! Great job! I'm studying...

The whole structure is fully framed except above the toilet  door. Even if  I did not do any research, I see no reasons why this space would not be also fully frame, so I filled the void.
Even if a cannon ball would not be stopped by a frame, it surely would surely be slow down, especially that there is a big reunion room behind.
 
I replaced the dead laser guide. In addition to project 1 or 2 perpendicular lines horizontal and vertical it can also project a angular line 360 degrees and another tool is added to measure with greater ease the same elevation on both sides when tracing longitudinal lines outside or inside the hull; a laser to measure distance especially, the  vertical  ones.
 
An 8 feet long square batten, almost as thick as the planking,  is use to draw reference lines on the hull. Basically it is a straight line with both ends being higher than the middle. To get a regular curve at the front end, masking tape is use instead.

I like the dark images. Really shows up the lines of the hull.