ClipperFan

Rob, it's a nice little piece but isn't the capstan more wooden with some inlaid brass components?

Vladimir, my response to Rob's error in thanking me for your compliment was intended to be totally a joke. It was deliberately wordy to poke fun at the silliness of it all. I doubt anybody took it seriously. By the way, I'm so glad you read and write such fluent english. I know some German but none of the Slavic languages at all.

Rob, as my slow efforts, did I mention slow? to finally capture the true lines of "GLORY of the SEAS" in painstakingly accurate to all specific measurements we have double verified (actually I think I'm erasing more than sketching, I've redrawn her sheerline three times now) it now looks to me like the line of the Poop Deck Rail aligns equally with that of the Rear Carriage House. That house is 8' tall. Knock off 3 1/2" for being set below deck and that leaves 7' 8 1/2" to project above the Poop Deck. It is set at the height of the main bulkhead. I don't have enough time to calculate specifics but the idea is we should be able to get very close to the actual rail height.

Vladimi are you sure you're not slipping in some work being done on an actual ship just to fill in your progress on this model? 😉 Wow the detail work is amazing. It will look even more so when you finally add the t'gallant Rail which we all now know is solid.

Rob, there's a noble history of highly appreciated art trickery "T'Rompe L'Oyle" literally meaning "trick the eye". I actually enjoy well employed 3D fakery, such as you see in nature dioramas where it's challenging to determine where the material foreground ends and a cleverly mimicking painting begins.

Rob, your gratitude while welcome is misdirected. You left poor Vladimir out in the cold, like a forlorn wet puppy in the rain, while sending appropriate acknowledgement of his rightly correct observations to me, who was probably slumbering at the time he replied and certainly don't deserve to steal his thunder...even as lightly as it may have clapped ;-) Having said that, Vlad of course is right, you consistently do beautiful work. Oh in the future, you might want to look for the letter "V" which is how Vlad usually finishes his sentences.

Rob, I'm beginning to strongly suspect that at the scales you and Vlad are working at, to get some of these diminutive details you're venturing into Lloyd McCaffery territory!

Vladimir, thanks for the kind compliment. Actually I'd love to help with the details for the Rear Carriage House, Wheel House, etc. Michael Mjelde's books contain some decent references as a starting point and then we have some nice photos to go on too. As for how to reproduce the complex Fancy Rail moldings, since they'd be so tiny, I wouldn't worry about it. I think keeping details to scale is more critical. Outsized moldings to try and capture those multiple features would mar your vessel more than help it.

Rob, no lie, no hyperbole and most especially no exaggeration. I believe your model will one day win accolades and awards. It's that good and that faithful to her subject matter herself. I am in awe....

Vladimir, as I told Rob, after I posted the other Artist's impression I recognized that the iron bar handle was shaped wrong. This illustration has the right configuration and I reworked the turned stanchion. Rob pointed out that the pinrail doesn't continue to the Poop deck but didn't specify when it ends. Either he knows exactly or we have to dig a little further.

Rob, oh my God, your Grecian Goddess 'Athene' Figurehead looks simply gorgeous! When I told my wife that she's just under an inch tall she said "oh, wow!' It's also thrilling to see the graceful McKay reverse "S" curve that we discussed now realized in three dimensions. I love too the little highlights of gold which subtly emphasize the graceful folds of her gown. Now this is a worthy representative of "GLORY of the SEAS!"

Rob thanks. I took a little ill advised "artistic license" to throw in the poop deck rail. I also caught another mistake too. The iron bar doesn't just sit on the top of the t'gallant Rail, it actually bends down and goes straight in, mirroring the way it enters the poop deck Rail. When I have time I'll revise it to reflect how it is on the actual vessel.

Vladimir as promised, here is my, ahem revised Artist's impression of Glory's somewhat troublesome and confusing "T'gallant...Monkey...Fancy... Rail" as I can interpret it through somewhat limited images we have of this area of the ship. I have also added the curved Iron Rail which can be seen at the start of her Poop Deck turned Stanchion Railing. Indented line of the rail itself is visible in the picture as well as the inclined angle which is also accurate. It appears the Stanchions follow the curve of the Hull below. They begin slightly chanted inwards, straighten up as they run alongside the Rear Carriage House then cant just slightly outward as they go around the curvature of the Poop itself. Another tricky detail I missed before until Rob pointed it out: the last molding is actually the Pinrail mounted just below the upper Main Rail Molding. It doesn't project much at all, apparently just enough to allow belaying pins to fit inside. Of course, how much, if any of this fancy work you actually want to replicate is entirely up to you. I'm just trying to provide the most accurate information to assist you in your goals to model Glory in all her wonderful details.

Rob, I hope you don't mind but I recently discovered a blast from the past. This sketch was taped to a light board my wife bought for me 12 years ago, when I first embarked on my long journey to uncover the genuine appearance of "GLORY of the SEAS." This was when I hadn't yet discovered that, as originally launched, her Mizzen Skysail just barely went above the Main's Royal Yard. It's also years before even a blurry image of San Pedro became available. Still overall, it reveals the mostly accurate direction I was being led to interpret her appearance based on other photos in Mike's first book.

Vladimir beautiful work. I particularly like the bow straight on. She really reveals her imposing Clipper entrance in that one!

Rob, based on the 3 images you shared, I owe Vlad an apology for slightly misleading him on the monkey/fancy/t'gallant rail (do you think they had enough names for the same rail? Sheesh!) Anyhow, Vlad I hate to be wrong because it means I misdirected someone, which I never want to do. In my own "shallow" defense, I put too much emphasis on this scene with the ship's boy. Enhanced, there definitely appear to be ribs intersecting the t'gallant rail. However, they do not appear in any other scene which means these must be cast shadows. Most of what else I sketched appears to be correct, with the exception of the (1) top bead which doesn't show up in the clear image of the t'gallant Rail top molding, so that bead must run alongside the lower edge of that upper molding. When I get a chance, I'll submit a revised illustration.

Vladimir as promised, a quick sketch of my Artist's impression from the tiny enlarged pics of Glory's bulwarks. Keep in mind, this is entirely of the monkeyrail section (or fancyrail as it's also called). I did a perspective, trying to show how these moldings appear. As usual I'm not too thrilled with the result, so I threw in a rough cross section on the left corner. How I see it is that there are definitely 5 molded sections each, totalling 10 all together. Figuring the molding around the Waterways to be similar would add another 5 for 15 in total. Top of the monkeyrail: (1) thin line looks to be like a bead molding at center top (2) larger molding almost a full circle (3) half sized of larger molding almost looks like the big one above indents to create this one (4) shelf molding is definitely further in, as it's noticeable by cast shadow from above it. (5) a second shelf molding, just slightly shallower than first but otherwise same depth Top of Main Rail Molding at lower end of monkeyrail bulwark: (5) mirror image of shallower shelf molding from above (4) mirror image of thicker shelf molding from above (3) slightly larger but similar round molding to #2 above (2) thicker but otherwise similar round molding to #3 above (1) slightly thicker round molding to #3 above Of course immediately below this would be the pinrail mounted just underneath. While my most recent sketch just showed a featureless pinrail end, it's quite likely like the tables of this era, it too probably had 2 or 3 moldings to it. Nobody's saying you have to model all of these but this is what I can see. Also from the scene with the Ship's Boy, it's vague but you can see stanchions which appear to be 2' apart. So I illustrated them in the perspective sketch.

Vladimir, great observation. You are of course correct, interior moldings are even more ornate than exteriors, which is amazing. I will try to sketch them from the enlargements you've shared. As for the Pinrail, it strikes me that it would run across the Bulwarks of the main deck, starting at the Bow just behind the end of the Quarter Deck and terminating at the beginning of the Poop Deck. When you think of it neither of those other decks have need of belaying pins as much as the main deck would. Rob can correct me if I'm wrong.

Vladimir I echo Rob's sentiment about your 'spoiler' pic. Besides beautiful which Rob already expressed so eloquently, I would add the word 'imposing' as that's the sense I get from this view.

Rob, per your confirmation of Glory's Pinrail location, submitted here for your review is my revised bulkhead cross section with appropriate Pinrail included. I also cleaned up some of the dimensional call outs to be less confusing. And.... wouldn't you know it, as soon as I posted this sketch, I spotted an error. So it's been re, revised to indicate more accurately that from the exterior, the Planskeer Molding is actually 8 1/2" above the deck line, since the Waterways are recessed 3 1/2" into the Deck Beams.

George, placing tiny scale flat plates on a curving surface has got to tax your patience for sure. I don't envy you but the results of such practiced tedium will certainly be worth it.

Rob, there are two illustrations of pinrail mountings. Detail F: continuous carved panel (clamp?) between Main Rail Molding then Pinrail is mounted inside to Intermediate Rail. Is that the same as Sheerail? Detail J: pinrail is mounted inside directly below Main Rail Molding. Did Glory have both styles or just the one? From photos it looks like she had detail F style. Your thoughts?

Rob, you're absolutely correct and here I thought I was being so accurate....

Vladimir now for something completely different. Since you mentioned doing the Sheerline moldings, I thought you might appreciate seeing this. Here, as best envisioned by me, is a cross section of Glory's Port side bulwarks looking Foreward, with interior dimensions on the right and exterior on left. I tried to incorporate every visible molding as can be determined by many photos available. Interestingly enough, when the 3" wide Main Bulwarks strakes are counted, there are exactly 8 visible between the 2 6" wide shelfs (for lack of a better description) which mirror each other top and bottom. All dimensions are, as usual taken directly from MacLean's 1869 highly detailed specs most likely supplied directly by McKay's Shipyard.

Vladimir here's how accurately you're capturing your topic! Congratulations on an incredibly accurate ongoing creative work!!